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Thread: Attorney: New audio reveals pause in gunfire when Michael Brown was shot[W:72,732]

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    re: Attorney: New audio reveals pause in gunfire when Michael Brown was shot[W:72,732]

    Quote Originally Posted by Tettsuo View Post
    You mean like Brown turning to taunt Wilson before charging, daring him to shoot a gun he's already fired?
    Yes, this has never happened...
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    re: Attorney: New audio reveals pause in gunfire when Michael Brown was shot[W:72,732]

    Quote Originally Posted by Tettsuo View Post
    You mean like Brown turning to taunt Wilson before charging, daring him to shoot a gun he's already fired?
    The taunting could have happened before the first round of shots were fired.

    Why would Brown say " you aint gonna shoot me " after the cop already fired 6 shots ?

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    Re: Attorney: New audio reveals pause in gunfire when Michael Brown was shot

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    Absolutely, evidence presented in a court is the only "truth" we can rely upon in this situation. However, the credibility of the officer, in most cases, is a given when there is no contradictory evidence presented or available.
    I agree, in most cases, an officer should be presumed credible unless there reasons to believe otherwise. At the same time, the more "could haves / might haves" in the claim, even an officer's claim, the more need for additional physical evidence.

    In this case, there seems to be string of "could haves":
    -he could have initiated an attack on me (in car)
    -non lethal force might not have stopped him
    -he could have then initiated one or more to the death banzai charges
    -he could be incredibly dangerous, even when wounded
    -he could have closed the distance seperating us before I could use other options besides lethal force

    I can give the officer 1 or more "could haves". But, it appears he is asking for 5. To me, this makes the officer's claim extraordinary- even given the fact that Brown is not a "Gentle Giant" and was probably pumped up after "slapping down" the clerk.

    Who has the burden of proof? Must Wilson show that the shooting was jusified? If so, I think there are too many "could haves" for him to prove the shooting was justified by his word alone. Wilson must change some "could haves" into "probably dids" with physical evidence. I dont think he can do this.
    Last edited by Cryptic; 08-26-14 at 05:22 PM.

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    re: Attorney: New audio reveals pause in gunfire when Michael Brown was shot[W:72,732]

    Quote Originally Posted by Cryptic View Post
    I agree, in most cases, an officer should be presumed credible unless there reasons to believe otherwise. At the same time, the more "could haves / might haves" in the claim, even an officer's claim, the more need for additional physical evidence.

    In this case, there seems to be string of "could haves":
    -he could have initiated an attack on me (in car)
    -non lethal force might not have stopped him
    -he could have then initiated one or more to the death banzai charges
    -he could be incredibly dangerous, even when wounded
    -he could have closed the distance seperating us before I could use other options besides lethal force

    I can give the officer 1 or more "could haves". But, it appears he is asking for 5. To me, this makes the officer's claim extraordinary- even given the fact that Brown is not a "Gentle Giant" and was probably pumped up after "slapping down" the clerk.

    Who has the burden of proof? Must Wilson show that the shooting was jusified? If so, I think there are too many "could haves" for him to prove the shooting was justified by his word alone. Wilson must change some "could haves" into "probably dids" with physical evidence. I dont think he can do this.
    Your line of reasoning seems a little arbitrary if you catch my drift.

    A little subjective.

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    Re: Attorney: New audio reveals pause in gunfire when Michael Brown was shot

    Quote Originally Posted by Cryptic View Post
    I agree, in most cases, an officer should be presumed credible unless there reasons to believe otherwise. At the same time, the more "could haves / might haves" in the claim, even an officer's claim, the more need for additional physical evidence.

    In this case, there seems to be string of "could haves":
    -he could have initiated an attack on me (in car)
    -non lethal force might not have stopped him
    -he could have then initiated one or more to the death banzai charges
    -he could be incredibly dangerous, even when wounded
    -he could have closed the distance seperating us before I could use other options besides lethal force

    I can give the officer 1 or more "could haves". But, it appears he is asking for 5. To me, this makes the officer's claim extraordinary- even given the fact that Brown is not a "Gentle Giant" and was probably pumped up after "slapping down" the clerk.

    Who has the burden of proof? Must Wilson show that the shooting was jusified? If so, I think there are too many "could haves" for him to prove the shooting was justified by his word alone. Wilson must change some "could haves" into "probably dids" with physical evidence. I dont think he can do this.

    but you are forgetting one important fact

    Wilson doesnt have to prove innocence

    the prosecution has to prove guilt

    too many have jumped to conclusions on both sides of the equation

    i still say we dont know a quarter of the "facts" in the case
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    Re: Attorney: New audio reveals pause in gunfire when Michael Brown was shot

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    So, your "plausible" alternate scenario would be that at least 5 of the first 6 shots missed Brown, Brown then lay on the ground surrendering, and Wilson moved closer and shot him 5 more times, all hits, but the majority into Brown's right arm, and the shot into the top of his head is explained how?
    He was falling forward onto the street.
    The angle described by the forensic team would indicate he had to be face down on the street, or very near to it, when the last shot was fired into the very top of his skull.

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    Re: Attorney: New audio reveals pause in gunfire when Michael Brown was shot

    Quote Originally Posted by jmotivator View Post
    He's hitting on someone who he thinks is hot and has videos. I just figure that he comes off as phony because he's their customer.

    My guess is that there is accompanying video to this audio that couldn't be shown on CNN.
    We don't know. He could have been wearing headphones ... that could be why he never reacted to the gunshots.
    I'll bet the video is funny to watch though.

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    Re: Attorney: New audio reveals pause in gunfire when Michael Brown was shot

    Quote Originally Posted by gdgyva View Post
    but you are forgetting one important fact

    Wilson doesnt have to prove innocence

    the prosecution has to prove guilt
    I am going off on a limb here. Turle Dove may be able to flesh this out better, and I might just be plain wrong:

    Administratively, Wilson might have to prove that the shooting was justified. If he can't, then he can get fired etc. If the shooting was not justified, then it might also be a crime.

    Technically, the burden of proof is on the proscecutor to prove that not only was the shooting not justified, but that Wilson is also guilty of a criminal act.

    But.... many jurors may well presume that if Wilson cant show the shooting was justified administratively, then he is automatically guilty of a crime. They may even presume and apply that presumption despite judges instructions to the contrary.
    Last edited by Cryptic; 08-26-14 at 06:04 PM.

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    Re: Attorney: New audio reveals pause in gunfire when Michael Brown was shot

    Quote Originally Posted by shrubnose View Post
    Like I said, how can anyone really know what happened if they weren't an eyewitness?
    But of course ...there were.
    Four of them.

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    re: Attorney: New audio reveals pause in gunfire when Michael Brown was shot[W:72,732]

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    Attorney: New audio reveals pause in gunfire when Michael Brown was shot

    By Holly Yan, CNN
    updated 12:36 AM EDT, Tue August 26, 2014


    [...]

    In the recording, a quick series of shots can be heard, followed by a pause and then another quick succession of shots.

    "I personally heard at least 11" shots, the man's attorney, Lopa Blumenthal, told CNN's Don Lemon.

    The man, who asked that his identity not be revealed, lives near the site of the shooting and was close enough to have heard the gunshots, Blumenthal said.

    He was speaking to a friend on a video chat service and happened to be recording the conversation at the same time Brown was shot, Blumenthal said.

    [...]
    Lawyer: Audio shows 11 shots when Michael Brown killed - CNN.com


    11 Shots in 5 seconds.
    Short pause between 6 and the other five. Likely Brown was still coming at him.
    Just more evidence.


    I wonder if any of those "shots" heard on the recording is an echo?

    I once covered a police shooting incident in Vancouver where a video tape recorded 39 shots. There were no hits.

    An independent examiner found that there were 9 shell casings accounted for and eleven bullets from the assigned amount that were missing, two were later determined to have been expended in a test fire on the range.

    I do not ay this is the case here, in fact I here several distinct shots.

    In any event, what this will do is further the divide between the citizens and the police, further cast doubt on their integrity seriously harking their ability to serve and protect.

    They so need an independent investigation, all that need happen is the State Attorney general name a good judge, preferably half white and be done with it.
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