Page 5 of 28 FirstFirst ... 3456715 ... LastLast
Results 41 to 50 of 273

Thread: Navy reverses Bible ban

  1. #41
    Sage
    shrubnose's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Europe
    Last Seen
    11-29-17 @ 03:46 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    18,851
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Navy reverses Bible ban

    As long as no one is forced to read them, I don't have a problem with the Bible or any other book being there.

  2. #42
    Liberal Fascist For Life!


    Redress's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Georgia
    Last Seen
    Today @ 01:28 AM
    Lean
    Very Liberal
    Posts
    93,328
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Navy reverses Bible ban

    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl View Post
    Gideon Bibles are not government handouts. They are absolutely 100% privately funded.

    As nearly as I can determine after looking at a number of news sources from ABC to the AP to WAPO to several on line news sources, some Navy authority decided it was inappropriate to allow the Gideons to place the Bibles in Navy lodges and ordered them removed. Some sources referred to this as a 'removal of the Bibles' and some sources referred to it as a 'ban'. It seems pretty silly not to see the two terms as interchangeable.

    However, apparently some Navy families noticed the absence of the Bibles and inquired and, when they found out the Bibles were prohibited from being placed in the rooms, they protested. The Navy reversed the order and allowed the Bibles to be returned to the rooms.

    The Gideons have been around since 1899 and since that time have placed 1.9 billion and counting Bibles in hotel/motel rooms and have furnished Bibles to schools and colleges, prisons and jails, hospitals, and medical offices all over the world--they provide free Bibles to all who want or will accept them. They see their Christian ministry as sharing the word of God via speaking engagements, talking one on one with people, and making the scriptures available to all who need or want them.

    If a Mosque or Islamic group or another religious group wanted to place their holy books in the lodges, then no doubt the Navy would also allow that too. To the best of my knowledge, nobody but the Gideons engages in that particular ministry.
    Everything you say here is accurate, but still manages to miss where this is problematic. At issue is that with a bible in these rooms, it can appear as the government endorsing a particular religion. That would be a nono. Since from my reading the eventual outcome is not known, replacing the bibles, which may have to be removed again later, seems kinda silly. Probably should have waited for a final determination before deciding to do this.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

  3. #43
    Sage
    Navy Pride's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Pacific NW
    Last Seen
    05-07-15 @ 02:01 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    39,883

    Re: Navy reverses Bible ban

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    Just to clarify, Navy Lodge is not barracks for sailors or any other form of quarters unless it is special circumstances. Navy Lodges are onbase hotels for military personnel and their families that are generally cheaper. The times they act as quarters is generally for temporary duty where there are some sort of special circumstances or it is a really shortterm assignment.
    I have stayed at a Navy Lodge several times with my family and bibles were always in the rooms.
    "God Bless Our Troops in Harms Way."

  4. #44
    Sage
    Navy Pride's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Pacific NW
    Last Seen
    05-07-15 @ 02:01 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    39,883

    Re: Navy reverses Bible ban

    Quote Originally Posted by shrubnose View Post
    As long as no one is forced to read them, I don't have a problem with the Bible or any other book being there.
    How about the Koran?
    "God Bless Our Troops in Harms Way."

  5. #45
    Sage
    AlbqOwl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    New Mexico
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 09:30 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    17,532
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Navy reverses Bible ban

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    Everything you say here is accurate, but still manages to miss where this is problematic. At issue is that with a bible in these rooms, it can appear as the government endorsing a particular religion. That would be a nono. Since from my reading the eventual outcome is not known, replacing the bibles, which may have to be removed again later, seems kinda silly. Probably should have waited for a final determination before deciding to do this.
    But the government is not endorsing a particular religion. The government is not providing the Bibles. It is simply allowing the Gideons to do a kindness to those who use the Lodge rooms. Unless it would deny any others the ability to place their holy book in the rooms--and no other group has any inclination to do so--it is unreasonable to think the government is endorsing anything. The Bibles are not an establishment of religion, they pose no problem to natural security nor harm anybody, and to deny them a corner in a drawer, space needed by nobody, would be unnecessarily cruel and inhumane to people who draw on their faith to get them through whatever they have to face. And to deny them because somebody might be hateful enough or mean spirited enough to deny somebody that because they would erroneously say it established religion would just be plain dumb.
    "I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it." --Benjamin Franklin 1776

  6. #46
    Sage

    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 07:12 PM
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    43,336

    Re: Navy reverses Bible ban

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    I would support it 100%
    A pile of holy books?

  7. #47
    Liberal Fascist For Life!


    Redress's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Georgia
    Last Seen
    Today @ 01:28 AM
    Lean
    Very Liberal
    Posts
    93,328
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Navy reverses Bible ban

    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl View Post
    But the government is not endorsing a particular religion. The government is not providing the Bibles. It is simply allowing the Gideons to do a kindness to those who use the Lodge rooms. Unless it would deny any others the ability to place their holy book in the rooms--and no other group has any inclination to do so--it is unreasonable to think the government is endorsing anything. The Bibles are not an establishment of religion, they pose no problem to natural security nor harm anybody, and to deny them a corner in a drawer, space needed by nobody, would be unnecessarily cruel and inhumane to people who draw on their faith to get them through whatever they have to face. And to deny them because somebody might be hateful enough or mean spirited enough to deny somebody that because they would erroneously say it established religion would just be plain dumb.
    If I remember right, and I am not going to look it up before going to bed, so take this for what it is worth, the standard is whether a reasonable person could interpret it as an endorsement of a particular religion. If a reasonable person stays at a navy lodge and finds the bible in their room, would they see it as the navy endorsing Christianity? I would kinda think that is quite possible.

    Note: I am not suggesting the bibles are an endorsement, nor that it really was harmful, nor that it was worth the efforts of those who complained. I actually find it annoying that people target little stuff like this. However, once some one does complain, then you are in a situation where it does have to be taken seriously. I am not going to speculate on the outcome, but pending an actual outcome, it would have been best to keep the bibles out of the rooms.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

  8. #48
    Sage
    shrubnose's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Europe
    Last Seen
    11-29-17 @ 03:46 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    18,851
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Navy reverses Bible ban

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    How about the Koran?



    I said the Bible or any other book.

    Any other book would include the Koran, eh?

  9. #49
    The Dude
    Kobie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Western NY
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 09:01 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    42,895

    Re: Navy reverses Bible ban

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    Around 70-80% of our military personnel profess Christianity.

    I don't have the figures in front of me, but I'd guess less than 1% profess Islam.


    Yes, it does make a difference.
    So why can't they buy their own bibles?
    Freedom of speech is not freedom from criticism.

  10. #50
    Maquis Admiral
    maquiscat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 07:22 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    8,010

    Re: Navy reverses Bible ban

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Because the Giddeons donate those Bibles.
    The Giddeons are the suppliers and have continued to do so, but I suspect that the practice arose out of the McCarthy era.

    Now as to the thread in general, yes if the Giddeons are donating the bibles then I see no issue with them being placed in the lodge rooms. However, should other similar texts (Koran, Torah, etc) also be donated in a similar manner and are not placed within the rooms then we have an issue.
    Bi, Poly, Switch. I'm not indecisive, I'm greedy!

Page 5 of 28 FirstFirst ... 3456715 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •