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Thread: Snowden embraces American flag in WIRED photo shoot[W:511]

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    re: Snowden embraces American flag in WIRED photo shoot[W:511]

    Quote Originally Posted by TeleKat View Post
    Patriotism isn't about obeying the law or loyalty to the government. It's about being loyal to the country and the ideals it was founded on. Arguably, Snowden showed that more than any other scumbag in the NSA. At least he didn't feel the need to boldface lie to the American public about the government's surveillance habits.
    And he took all of America's secrets to Russia with him so that he could share them with that reknowned humanitarian Vladamir Putin. The most disappointing thing about this is the number of people who so hate their own government that they celebrate this traitor.
    "Groups with guitars are on the way out, Mr. Epstein"

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    re: Snowden embraces American flag in WIRED photo shoot[W:511]

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiggen View Post
    And he took all of America's secrets to Russia with him so that he could share them with that reknowned humanitarian Vladamir Putin. The most disappointing thing about this is the number of people who so hate their own government that they celebrate this traitor.
    Quote Originally Posted by Wiggen View Post
    Without bothering to read through all of the previous posts, let me summarize my feelings as follows:

    Screw Snowden. He took America's secrets to Russia and he can rot there as far as I'm concerned.



    You are being fed administraton propaganda. Where would you have him flee too? and if you say he should stay and stand trial, if he believes the game to be rigged wouldn't that be a poor choice?
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

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    re: Snowden embraces American flag in WIRED photo shoot[W:511]

    Quote Originally Posted by ReverendHellh0und View Post
    You are being fed administraton propaganda. Where would you have him flee too? and if you say he should stay and stand trial, if he believes the game to be rigged wouldn't that be a poor choice?
    Administration propaqanda? He took American secrets and he fled to Russia, a country currently run by a former KGB Colonel. Those are simply facts.

    You are incredibly nave or simply prone to not liking your country very much if you don't believe he took military secrets with him and that the Russians now have those secrets.
    "Groups with guitars are on the way out, Mr. Epstein"

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    re: Snowden embraces American flag in WIRED photo shoot[W:511]

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    National Defense Budget Estimates for 2015.

    Do you see how the funds allocated to the agencies within DOD are not "infinite"?
    When did I make the claim that the DOD, who I work for, had infinite funds?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Really. It amazes me how libertarians...


    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    can be so quick to grasp the fundamentals of public choice theory, of the institutional and deep reasons behind government failure, of how the incentives and structures of government keep it from ever being effective and efficient, but somehow maintain the ability to just turn off that part of their brain when discussing the parts of the government responsible for intelligence collection. THEN apparently government runs every bit as perfectly, omnisciently, and omnicompetently as the most radical marxist would insist it does.
    Yeah, it has nothing to do with our right to privacy, its just that we turn our brains off. Sorry about that, you've convinced me, ANYTHING for the sake of intelligence collection is the new game, our rights be damned!

    I couldn't roll me eyes at the likes of you enough.
    Haymarket's "support" of the 2nd Amendment, a right he believes we never had.
    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    no. You cannot lose rights you do not have in the first place. There is no such thing as the right to have any weapon of your choice regardless of any other consideration. It simply does not exist.

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    re: Snowden embraces American flag in WIRED photo shoot[W:511]

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiggen View Post
    Administration propaqanda? He took American secrets and he fled to Russia, a country currently run by a former KGB Colonel. Those are simply facts.

    You are incredibly nave or simply prone to not liking your country very much if you don't believe he took military secrets with him and that the Russians now have those secrets.
    Fled to Russia? Someone clearly doesn't have the facts...

    And you have the balls to call anyone else naive?
    Haymarket's "support" of the 2nd Amendment, a right he believes we never had.
    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    no. You cannot lose rights you do not have in the first place. There is no such thing as the right to have any weapon of your choice regardless of any other consideration. It simply does not exist.

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    re: Snowden embraces American flag in WIRED photo shoot[W:511]

    Quote Originally Posted by OldWorldOrder View Post
    A source for something that isn't happening?

    Do you have a source for your ignorant post, though? Did it actually just come from your brain or what?
    I need a source to ask someone for a source for THEIR claims?

    I'm not the one claiming to know a negative, perhaps you should read your own link before you bother to prattle about logic to your superiors.
    Haymarket's "support" of the 2nd Amendment, a right he believes we never had.
    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    no. You cannot lose rights you do not have in the first place. There is no such thing as the right to have any weapon of your choice regardless of any other consideration. It simply does not exist.

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    re: Snowden embraces American flag in WIRED photo shoot[W:511]

    Quote Originally Posted by ReverendHellh0und View Post
    You are being fed administraton propaganda. Where would you have him flee too? and if you say he should stay and stand trial, if he believes the game to be rigged wouldn't that be a poor choice?
    This is what cracks me up about these apologists for the government spying on the people. Why would anyone in their right mind who exposed government wrong doing trust that they would get a fair trial and why would they want to be punished for doing the right thing? It would be stupid to stay in that country and would be stupid to flee to a country that will either extradite to that country you just fled or not stop that country from snatching you up.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

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    re: Snowden embraces American flag in WIRED photo shoot[W:511]

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    I must be missing something with Snowden, because there are a lot of people on the left and right who are normally civil liberties advocates who despise the guy. We know the head of NSA has no problem looking into a camera and lying to the Congress and the public about what the agency is doing. We now know the CIA spies on Senators investigating past wrongdoing and is more than happy to delete/disappear documents that reveal wrongdoing. We know that going through the chain of command is futile. The Obama administration is brutally cracking down on leakers, and is as we speak threatening to jail journalists for failing to reveal their sources, in their prosecution of leakers who revealed illegal activity by the intelligence agencies.

    So in a broad sense, without endorsing everything Snowden has done, I'm not sure what someone wanting to expose the extent of the police state in the U.S. is supposed to do? The NSA was simply operating without meaningful restraints, including gathering near blanket coverage of all electronic communications in the U.S., of everyone. And every check on their ability to sift through the data from non-terrorists (aka innocent Americans charged and suspected of no crimes) has been shown to be window dressing, ineffective.

    I guess I don't understand how a person can complain about the near total police state we live under, with our government having nearly unrestricted access to ALL our communications, then demonize a person who took a huge risk to expose it all. Sure, he's imperfect, and undoubtedly has made mistakes, but the venom directed against him by civil liberties advocates is really puzzling to me. I don't like that he's hiding out in Russia, and before that China, but the U.S. makes it impossible for him to seek refuge in any other country, so we can't exactly complain that he's not traveling because the U.S. has made that impossible. And I don't expect him to be arrested and voluntarily go to solitary, never to be heard from again, which is what the U.S. did to Manning, for far LESS.
    I don't know of any consistent civil liberties advocate on the left who wants Snowden in prison/Guantanamo, just some centrists who are wrongly labeled as being on the left by the far right.

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    re: Snowden embraces American flag in WIRED photo shoot[W:511]

    Quote Originally Posted by Lachean View Post
    Fled to Russia? Someone clearly doesn't have the facts...

    And you have the balls to call anyone else naive?
    He didn't flee to Russia? Oh wait a minute, you're right. He first fled to Hong Kong, and then went from Hong Kong to Russia. Where Vlad met him with open arms. What is it about you Libertarians and your love for Vlad and your hatred for you own country?
    "Groups with guitars are on the way out, Mr. Epstein"

    Dick Rowe, A & R man
    Decca Records
    London, 1962

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    re: Snowden embraces American flag in WIRED photo shoot[W:511]

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    This is what cracks me up about these apologists for the government spying on the people. Why would anyone in their right mind who exposed government wrong doing trust that they would get a fair trial and why would they want to be punished for doing the right thing? It would be stupid to stay in that country and would be stupid to flee to a country that will either extradite to that country you just fled or not stop that country from snatching you up.
    Another lover of the freedoms enjoyed in Russia.
    "Groups with guitars are on the way out, Mr. Epstein"

    Dick Rowe, A & R man
    Decca Records
    London, 1962

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