Page 20 of 63 FirstFirst ... 10181920212230 ... LastLast
Results 191 to 200 of 623

Thread: Snowden embraces American flag in WIRED photo shoot[W:511]

  1. #191
    Sage
    OldWorldOrder's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Last Seen
    10-12-15 @ 12:13 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    5,820

    re: Snowden embraces American flag in WIRED photo shoot[W:511]

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Are you trying to say that privacy is not essential? As for "a little temporary"....that's exactly what the NSA is. They cannot guarantee 100% safety.
    Complete privacy isn't essential, no. Ask anyone who takes credit applications. And "not 100%"= "a little temporary" in your mind? Oooookay. I think I'll be saying this a lot in this post: too bad actual decision makers don't agree.

    Like I said before, "I'm pretty sure that it doesn't mean squat to those that would suppress them."
    Okay?

    You never answered my question. How would any other court, particularly SCOTUS, rule on those warrants? I would bet you that they wouldn't have OK'd it.
    I don't know? Do you have anything other than a random ass opinion? Either way, they're actual federal judges, so what rule as legal trumps your gut feeling. Sorry, you can wish it was illegal but it wasn't and as of right now it's not. IT IS NOT ILLEGAL. You just wish it was. Here it comes: too bad actual decision makers don't agree.

    And FYI, yes, actually I can. Ever hear of Jury Nullification? I can make anyone that actually did commit a crime a free man with it. IE: Making what they did legal for them.
    hahahahahaha and are you now introducing a new facet of legality that no one's ever heard of: The Kal'Stang Internet Legality Clause, wherein things are legal or illegal just because you say so? NSA! Be wary of the KILC! Make sure your office of general counsel consults with people regarding the KILC! You don't want to do anything that Kal'Stang might say is illegal, because that makes it illegal! Be careful guys!
    Last edited by OldWorldOrder; 08-15-14 at 04:57 PM.
    The whole modern world has divided itself into Conservatives and Progressives. The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of Conservatives is to prevent mistakes from being corrected.
    -GK Chesterton

  2. #192
    Global Moderator
    The Truth is out there.
    Kal'Stang's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Bonners Ferry ID USA
    Last Seen
    @
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    32,856
    Blog Entries
    1

    re: Snowden embraces American flag in WIRED photo shoot[W:511]

    Quote Originally Posted by OldWorldOrder View Post
    Complete privacy isn't essential, no. Ask anyone who takes credit applications. And "not 100%"= "a little temporary" in your mind? Oooookay. I think I'll be saying this a lot in this post: too bad actual decision makers don't agree.
    Yes, it is. This shows that you have no problem with ignoring peoples Rights.

    Quote Originally Posted by OldWorldOrder View Post
    I don't know? Do you have anything other than a random ass opinion? Either way, they're actual federal judges, so what rule as legal trumps your gut feeling. Sorry, you can wish it was illegal but it wasn't and as of right now it's not. [i]IT IS NOT ILLEGAL[/b]. You just wish it was. Here it comes: too bad actual decision makers don't agree.
    Roe V Wade is a perfect example that the Government does NOT have the ability to arbitrarily invade peoples privacy...even at the expense of another's life.

    Quote Originally Posted by OldWorldOrder View Post
    hahahahahaha and are you now introducing a new facet of legality that no one's ever heard of: The Kal'Stang Internet Legality Clause, wherein things are legal or illegal just because you say so? NSA! Be wary of the KILC! Make sure your office of general counsel consults with people regarding the KILC! You don't want to do anything that Kal'Stang might say is illegal, because that makes it illegal! Be careful guys!
    New facet? Actually its quite old and has been used numerous times through out history and is still even being used today. Some examples of prominent times and issues where it was used: It was used a lot towards the end of slavery when jurors would use jury nullification despite the evidence that a person that helped black slaves get to freedom. It was also used during the Prohibition era, so much so that lawmakers had no choice but to repeal that amendment. And it is used today quite a bit for marijuana users. And those are just the ones that I could think of off the top of my head.

    Here's a couple of links to education yourself on...

    umkc.edu
    Wiki ~ Jury Nullification
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

    My mind and my heart are saying I'm in my twenties. My body is pointing at my mind and heart and laughing its ass off. ~ Kal'Stang

  3. #193
    Sage
    OldWorldOrder's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Last Seen
    10-12-15 @ 12:13 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    5,820

    re: Snowden embraces American flag in WIRED photo shoot[W:511]

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Yes, it is. This shows that you have no problem with ignoring peoples Rights.
    Mhmm, whatever hyperbole you need to feel better.

    Roe V Wade is a perfect example that the Government does NOT have the ability to arbitrarily invade peoples privacy...even at the expense of another's life.
    I guess 'arbitrarily' would be the keyword here, wouldn't it? Also: this isn't Roe V Wade.

    New facet? Actually its quite old and has been used numerous times through out history and is still even being used today. Some examples of prominent times and issues where it was used: It was used a lot towards the end of slavery when jurors would use jury nullification despite the evidence that a person that helped black slaves get to freedom. It was also used during the Prohibition era, so much so that lawmakers had no choice but to repeal that amendment. And it is used today quite a bit for marijuana users. And those are just the ones that I could think of off the top of my head.

    Here's a couple of links to education yourself on...

    umkc.edu
    Wiki ~ Jury Nullification
    I'm not talking about jury nullification, I know what that is- I'm talking about this new thing wherein something is illegal simply because you, Kal'Stang, say it is. As opposed to, ya know, saying you think it should be illegal. Do you have any links to the KILC? The Kal'Stang Internet Legality Clause?
    The whole modern world has divided itself into Conservatives and Progressives. The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of Conservatives is to prevent mistakes from being corrected.
    -GK Chesterton

  4. #194
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Last Seen
    01-17-16 @ 05:09 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    9,122

    re: Snowden embraces American flag in WIRED photo shoot[W:511]

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    That is incorrect. Since the claim that the FISA court ruling allowing the collection of metadata in the form of point-to-point transmission records is a violation of the 4th Amendment, it's adherents have to deal with the fact that SCOTUS already dealt with that exact same data base, and ruled that it did not fall under 4th Amendment protection. The FISA court derived its' ruling from SCOTUS direction.



    you can call it whatever epithet you like. Announcing to Mullah Omar McJihad that we intend to watch your gmail account from now on because we know that is where you are planning your CONUS-based attacks is amazingly stupid CT practice, which is why no administration of either party no matter what their personal inclinations or backgrounds will do it.
    Straw man argument: notice of search warrants are not given to the suspect until the search is about to commence.

  5. #195
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Last Seen
    01-17-16 @ 05:09 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    9,122

    re: Snowden embraces American flag in WIRED photo shoot[W:511]

    Quote Originally Posted by Rentoc View Post
    This is my first post. So, hello to all.
    As for Mr. Snowden. I would have to say the word "traitor" comes to mind. While the NSA may have been up to some no good, there are options available to a true "whistleblower" other than running off to our two biggest "rivals/enemies" seeking refuge giving up only he knows what information. I believe he should be captured, tried and judged accordingly.
    This Hero Worship of him in my mind is not only silly, but downright scary. It worries me that so many citizens find this country so, well, disgusting? Not really sure what word to use there.
    Are you aware that he did make some efforts to go through 'proper' channels to complain about the illegal activities. Exactly what do you think he should have done differently?

    "...Snowden said that, using "internal channels of dissent", he had told multiple employees and two supervisors about his concerns that the NSA programs were unconstitutional. An NSA spokesperson responded, saying they had "not found any evidence to support Mr. Snowden's contention that he brought these matters to anyone's attention."[60] Snowden elaborated in January 2014, saying "[I] made tremendous efforts to report these programs to co-workers, supervisors, and anyone with the proper clearance who would listen. The reactions of those I told about the scale of the constitutional violations ranged from deeply concerned to appalled, but no one was willing to risk their jobs, families, and possibly even freedom to go to through what Drake did."[99] In March 2014, during testimony to the European Parliament, Snowden wrote that before revealing classified information he had reported "clearly problematic programs" to ten officials, who he said did nothing in response.[100] In a May 2014 interview, Snowden told NBC News that after bringing his concerns about the legality of the NSA spying programs to officials, he was told to stay silent on the matter. Snowden said:

    The NSA has records—they have copies of emails right now to their Office of General Counsel, to their oversight and compliance folks from me raising concerns about the NSA's interpretations of its legal authorities. I had raised these complaints not just officially in writing through email, but to my supervisors, to my colleagues, in more than one office. I did it in Fort Meade. I did it in Hawaii. And many, many of these individuals were shocked by these programs. They had never seen them themselves. And the ones who had, went, 'You know, you're right. … But if you say something about this, they're going to destroy you......."
    Wikipedia

  6. #196
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Last Seen
    01-17-16 @ 05:09 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    9,122

    re: Snowden embraces American flag in WIRED photo shoot[W:511]

    There is no reason to debate with trollish self proclaimed know-it-alls who support every government invasion of privacy with the justification that it hasn't been found illegal yet. Such people may be paid to post on-line and no evidence or argument will change their position.

  7. #197
    Global Moderator
    The Truth is out there.
    Kal'Stang's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Bonners Ferry ID USA
    Last Seen
    @
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    32,856
    Blog Entries
    1

    re: Snowden embraces American flag in WIRED photo shoot[W:511]

    Quote Originally Posted by OldWorldOrder View Post
    I guess 'arbitrarily' would be the keyword here, wouldn't it? Also: this isn't Roe V Wade.
    A word that I used. Not the court. You can look it up I'm sure. And it still pertains to our Right to Privacy. Is there anything about it that would cause you to think that SCOTUS would hand out such a warrant as the NSA used to use mass surveillance on innocent people? If SCOTUS isn't going to allow the government to ban abortion due to privacy concerns...what makes you think that it would allow the NSA to do what it did?

    Quote Originally Posted by OldWorldOrder View Post
    I'm not talking about jury nullification, I know what that is- I'm talking about this new thing wherein something is illegal simply because you, Kal'Stang, say it is. As opposed to, ya know, saying you think it should be illegal. Do you have any links to the KILC? The Kal'Stang Internet Legality Clause?
    Wait you weren't talking about Jury Nullification despite your quotation of me talking about it and not only claiming that it was some "new facet of legality" that I had made up? Do you really expect me to believe that?
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

    My mind and my heart are saying I'm in my twenties. My body is pointing at my mind and heart and laughing its ass off. ~ Kal'Stang

  8. #198
    Global Moderator
    The Truth is out there.
    Kal'Stang's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Bonners Ferry ID USA
    Last Seen
    @
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    32,856
    Blog Entries
    1

    re: Snowden embraces American flag in WIRED photo shoot[W:511]

    Quote Originally Posted by Hard Truth View Post
    There is no reason to debate with trollish self proclaimed know-it-alls who support every government invasion of privacy with the justification that it hasn't been found illegal yet. Such people may be paid to post on-line and no evidence or argument will change their position.
    I agree. I'm done here.
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

    My mind and my heart are saying I'm in my twenties. My body is pointing at my mind and heart and laughing its ass off. ~ Kal'Stang

  9. #199
    Sage
    OldWorldOrder's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Last Seen
    10-12-15 @ 12:13 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    5,820

    re: Snowden embraces American flag in WIRED photo shoot[W:511]

    There's also no reason to listen to people who don't know anything about intelligence operations wax on about what they think about them. It's useless. Unfortunately for them, the programs were and are legal. Cry about it more.

    I love the idea of Snowden going to someone and saying "Hey guys, I think this might be unconstitutional" and just not listening when people are like "Yeah dude, we have an entire Office of General Counsel that goes over all these things with a fine tooth comb and an entire federal court system that's been overseeing this, but I appreciate your concerns...were you pre law or...no? Oh...okay, well thanks. We have like hundreds of people paid precisely to keep us Consitutional and weigh in on that, but I appreciate your concern, IT guy." Then Snowden angrily decides to grab all kinds of data on not only domestic metadata storage but information about on-going overseas operations and gives it to China and Russia....and some folks in the US think he's a hero.

    One born every minute, PT Barnum was right.
    Last edited by OldWorldOrder; 08-15-14 at 05:26 PM.
    The whole modern world has divided itself into Conservatives and Progressives. The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of Conservatives is to prevent mistakes from being corrected.
    -GK Chesterton

  10. #200
    Sage
    OldWorldOrder's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Last Seen
    10-12-15 @ 12:13 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    5,820

    re: Snowden embraces American flag in WIRED photo shoot[W:511]

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    A word that I used. Not the court. You can look it up I'm sure. And it still pertains to our Right to Privacy. Is there anything about it that would cause you to think that SCOTUS would hand out such a warrant as the NSA used to use mass surveillance on innocent people? If SCOTUS isn't going to allow the government to ban abortion due to privacy concerns...what makes you think that it would allow the NSA to do what it did?
    Well, maybe because it's made up of federal judges? Ya know, the same kind of people that ruled what the NSA does is legal? But there's no need to get into hypothetical situations: what's the law right now regarding those programs?

    You and I both know you won't answer that extremely simple question because you know it's going to refute what you said about it being 'illegal'. And that says a lot that you can't answer it. In our future discussions about this, if I'm unlucky enough to have any, I'll just ask you that, and you can ignore it, and we'll both know the truth, and we'll both be sad about your inability to answer it, but in different ways.

    Wait you weren't talking about Jury Nullification despite your quotation of me talking about it and not only claiming that it was some "new facet of legality" that I had made up? Do you really expect me to believe that?
    Can you read?

    "are you now introducing a new facet of legality that no one's ever heard of: The Kal'Stang Internet Legality Clause, wherein things are legal or illegal just because you say so?" As in, "in this thread are you now introducing a new facet of legality that no one's ever heard of: The Kal'Stang Internet Legality Clause, wherein things are legal or illegal just because you say so?" It's right there in black and white. That's what the colon means: Colon (punctuation) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. (See, I used it again)
    The whole modern world has divided itself into Conservatives and Progressives. The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of Conservatives is to prevent mistakes from being corrected.
    -GK Chesterton

Page 20 of 63 FirstFirst ... 10181920212230 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •