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Protests over Missouri teen's death turn violent[W:647,807]

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CanadaJohn said:
Unarmed protestors exercising their first amendment rights don't throw firebombs and loot businesses. I find that disturbing.
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They do if they are convinced that they are living under police occupation, with no other resort. If they watch their young men being shot down in the street for no apparent reason. If they see a police force that in no way is representative of them. Frustration and anger can make people do things they might not ordinarily do.
 
Wiggen said:
53 cops, of which 50 are white and 3 are black. Policing a population that is 70% African American. Cops generally aren't the most understanding people in the world, and their normal reaction is to shoot first and ask questions later. When the cop is white and the victim black, you get a reaction from people who are convinced the system is rigged against them. That you can't see that makes your lean of 'slightly conservative' to be an understatement.
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How many black people applied to be cops in that city? Is it that they're applying and being rejected - or is it that they don't even want to be cops?

If the normal reaction of a cop is to shoot first and ask questions later, why aren't we hearing these stories daily? When was the last instance of a cop shooting an unarmed person - yesterday? Monday? if it's their normal reaction, then why aren't the 900,000 of them who work as cops doing it enough that we hear and read about it daily? Hourly, in fact.
 
apdst said:
What's disturbing, is that you think stealing and burning are protected by the 1st Amendment.

Where were you on the Bundy protests?
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Ted Bundy? He got what he deserved.
 
Wiggen said:
They do if they are convinced that they are living under police occupation, with no other resort. If they watch their young men being shot down in the street for no apparent reason. If they see a police force that in no way is representative of them. Frustration and anger can make people do things they might not ordinarily do.
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Didnt MLK say they exact oppositie, that there is no excuse for violence? That change can be achieved through peaceful protest no matter what your enemy does?

Returning violence for violence multiplies violence,
adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars.
Darkness cannot drive out darkness:
only light can do that.
Hate cannot drive out hate: only love can do that.
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tres borrachos said:
How many black people applied to be cops in that city? Is it that they're applying and being rejected - or is it that they don't even want to be cops?

If the normal reaction of a cop is to shoot first and ask questions later, why aren't we hearing these stories daily? When was the last instance of a cop shooting an unarmed person - yesterday? Monday? if it's their normal reaction, then why aren't the 900,000 of them who work as cops doing it enough that we hear and read about it daily? Hourly, in fact.
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I didn't say shoot first. I said their normal reaction, due to the fact that they are decked out like combat infantrymen, is to react with far more force than is needed. They are exacerbating the situation in Missouri and I think it's intentional.

http://news.yahoo.com/why-do-ferguson-s-police-officers-look-like-soldiers-184517098.html
 
jonny5 said:
Didnt MLK say they exact oppositie, that there is no excuse for violence? That change can be achieved through peaceful protest no matter what your enemy does?
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Yeah, whatever happened to MLK?
 
Wiggen said:
I didn't say shoot first. I said their normal reaction, due to the fact that they are decked out like combat infantrymen, is to react with far more force than is needed. They are exacerbating the situation in Missouri and I think it's intentional.
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Did the National Guard " exacerbate " the situation in South Central in 1992 ?
 
Wiggen said:
They do if they are convinced that they are living under police occupation, with no other resort. If they watch their young men being shot down in the street for no apparent reason. If they see a police force that in no way is representative of them. Frustration and anger can make people do things they might not ordinarily do.
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Perhaps so - that doesn't mean it's anything related to exercising a free speech right. The fact that you would equate the two or justify one as the other is an illustration of faulty logic and a reason why the ignorant and poorly educated consider it their right to do so. Using your logic, if I'm frustrated with my neighbour, I should simply burn his house down or murder him because my irrational frustration gives me justification for acting like a criminal.
 
Wiggen said:
I didn't say shoot first. I said their normal reaction, due to the fact that they are decked out like combat infantrymen, is to react with far more force than is needed. They are exacerbating the situation in Missouri and I think it's intentional.

Why do Ferguson
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If they don't do it, then it isn't their normal reaction, Wiggen.

How many blacks applied to the Ferguson police force?
 
Wiggen said:
They do if they are convinced that they are living under police occupation, with no other resort. If they watch their young men being shot down in the street for no apparent reason. If they see a police force that in no way is representative of them. Frustration and anger can make people do things they might not ordinarily do.
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Oh FFS, we all get angry and frustrated. I'm frustrated right now with one of my customers. And very angry about something they did. Should I go to their headquarters and start throwing things and wrecking the place?

Normal, decent people control their anger and don't lash out. And the people in Ferguson aren't controlling their anger and frustration. That speaks volumes about them. There is NO excuse for this behavior - period.
 
Wiggen said:
Hey, you're the one that suggested it. Meanwhile, do you give a damn that an unarmed kid was gunned down in the street by a trigger happy cop? Or was he guilty of the crime of being a black teenager and therefore he got what he deserved.
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I'm sure he was completely innocent and did nothing whatsoever to instigate any of this. As usual.
 
Wiggen said:
And what you don't get is any concept of why the riot occurred. To you it's just another bunch of out of control black people that need to be kept in their place.
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There no "concept" to a riot.
 
Montecresto said:
FREEDOM, is risky, I'll take the risks while you capitulate.
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Don't get me wrong, I'm all for freedom, like the ones these guys were demonstrating:

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Don't we all though want a society ruled by SOME law and order? I'm assuming your not advocating anarchy are you? Where a group of thugs can run up on you or your family and take what they want.



but do we really want anarchy

Wiggen said:
We aren't talking about riots in LA 20 years ago. We're talking about today and a bunch of white cops that dress up like combat soldiers and behave like they're in enemy country, regardless of who they're dealing with.
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But the same principle applies. As much as you may want to hero worship about a bunch of looters that wouldn't hesitate to come in and take your stuff... no matter what your views are. Face it, these people are just a bunch of thugs looking to make a quick buck. At least with the Rodney King deal, the people had the common sense to wait for a verdict.
 
Wiggen said:
Yeah, whatever happened to MLK?
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There's a reason we have a day honoring MLK and not the Black Panthers and Malcom X. It's because violence will only result in more violence.
 
Mason66 said:
What percentage of the people rioting actually care about racial tensions as opposed to those who want free stuff?
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I don't know. What was the % in 1968? A riot is a riot. It starts with civil unrest and degenerates from there. My point stands, there is an underlying racial tension in this country that seems to be getting markably worse. The unintended consequences of an Obama impeachment will be to ignite these tensions; which will lead to all of our major cities being "ignited".
 
CanadaJohn said:
Perhaps so - that doesn't mean it's anything related to exercising a free speech right. The fact that you would equate the two or justify one as the other is an illustration of faulty logic and a reason why the ignorant and poorly educated consider it their right to do so. Using your logic, if I'm frustrated with my neighbour, I should simply burn his house down or murder him because my irrational frustration gives me justification for acting like a criminal.
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I've wondered how people justify looting, in their own minds, under any conditions! It's theft, plain and simple! All of us have been frustrated at some point in our lives, but frustration isn't relieved by doing this, but it is an opportunity to steal to get something for nothing. Those business owners had nothing to do with the shooting, yet their stores were ransacked and burned. Same when the levees failed during Katrina. Very sad to see....

Greetings, CJ. :2wave:
 
polgara said:
I've wondered how people justify looting, in their own minds, under any conditions! It's theft, plain and simple! All of us have been frustrated at some point in our lives, but frustration isn't relieved by doing this, but it is an opportunity to steal to get something for nothing. Those business owners had nothing to do with the shooting, yet their stores were ransacked and burned. Same when the levees failed during Katrina. Very sad to see....

Greetings, CJ. :2wave:
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I'm not sure that they have to justify it in their own minds. They see an opportunity to go on a rampage looting and destroying other people's property, and go for it.
 
Dittohead not! said:
I'm not sure that they have to justify it in their own minds. They see an opportunity to go on a rampage looting and destroying other people's property, and go for it.
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That's what I see here too, ditto. This is an opportunity, an excuse. Unlike the riots during the civil rights era, they aren't fighting for anything. They aren't protesting anything. They are using this as an excuse to steal from others, and it's really a bit shocking to see many people attempting to justify this behavior.
 
polgara said:
I've wondered how people justify looting, in their own minds, under any conditions! It's theft, plain and simple! All of us have been frustrated at some point in our lives, but frustration isn't relieved by doing this, but it is an opportunity to steal to get something for nothing. Those business owners had nothing to do with the shooting, yet their stores were ransacked and burned. Same when the levees failed during Katrina. Very sad to see....

Greetings, CJ. :2wave:
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Good afternoon Lady P. - I don't wonder why people justify looting. I'm just thankful my parents raised and nurtured me in such a way that looting and that kind of violence would never enter my mind, ever.
 
Wiggen said:
53 cops, of which 50 are white and 3 are black. Policing a population that is 70% African American. Cops generally aren't the most understanding people in the world, and their normal reaction is to shoot first and ask questions later. When the cop is white and the victim black, you get a reaction from people who are convinced the system is rigged against them. That you can't see that makes your lean of 'slightly conservative' to be an understatement.
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The above bolded part demonstrates the understatement of your own stated lean of "slightly liberal", and is an absurd characterization.
 
tres borrachos said:
That's what I see here too, ditto. This is an opportunity, an excuse. Unlike the riots during the civil rights era, they aren't fighting for anything. They aren't protesting anything. They are using this as an excuse to steal from others, and it's really a bit shocking to see many people attempting to justify this behavior.
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Exactly. If they want to protest what they see as, what most likely is, unjustified actions by the police, then let them picket, pack city hall meetings, write editorials and letters to the editor, demand that the cops involved be tried for murder. That sort of thing can result in positive changes. Stealing and vandalism doesn't justify anything.
 
polgara said:
I've wondered how people justify looting, in their own minds, under any conditions! It's theft, plain and simple! All of us have been frustrated at some point in our lives, but frustration isn't relieved by doing this, but it is an opportunity to steal to get something for nothing. Those business owners had nothing to do with the shooting, yet their stores were ransacked and burned. Same when the levees failed during Katrina. Very sad to see....
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It's because in our society, we have been made to feel guilty if someone is lacking in anything, no matter the reason for that being the case, and there has been a push for the past few decades to "equalize" the socioeconomic status of the masses, and make people who succeed feel guilty for doing so. That is how they justify it. It isn't "fair" that some people have more than others, so in their minds, looting is just people who have been unfairly treated, getting what is rightfully theirs. It's disgusting.
 
Wiggen said:
Works for me. Of course at some point somebody is going to have to answer the question of why an unarmed black kid walking away from the cops was shot multiple times. For some reason these kinds of issues never bother conservatives.
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Of course they do and that last is a ridiculous statement. And "at some point" is generally AFTER the investigation of the incident is concluded and not in response to riots and press field day.
 
tres borrachos said:
That's what I see here too, ditto. This is an opportunity, an excuse. Unlike the riots during the civil rights era, they aren't fighting for anything. They aren't protesting anything. They are using this as an excuse to steal from others, and it's really a bit shocking to see many people attempting to justify this behavior.
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I worked with a older black guy who was in Detroit when the 67 riots happened. He told me and I quote " those niggas was stealin TVs it had nothing to do with civil rights" so take that for whatever its worth.
 
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