Page 2 of 22 FirstFirst 123412 ... LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 220

Thread: Obama, With Reluctance, Returns to Action in Iraq

  1. #11
    Sage
    Perotista's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Georgia
    Last Seen
    Today @ 07:34 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    17,931
    Blog Entries
    25

    Re: Obama, With Reluctance, Returns to Action in Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by Swit View Post
    It doesn't matter if Iraqi military advised him to stay. They fact of the matter is he did in fact try to extend the agreement on the grounds that ALL American forces (military and contrator) were immun to Iraqi persecution. The Iraqi parliment refused to grant that and so never extended the SOFA agreement.... seriously... you can look this up. Obama supporters were furious that he was trying to extend the stay.
    link]U.S. Troops Are Leaving Because Iraq Doesn't Want Them There - The Atlantic
    from wiki:
    As reported on Saturday, October 15, 2011, the Obama Administration proceeded with the plan to withdraw American forces from Iraq (barring some last-minute move in the Iraqi parliament when they returned from a break in late November 2011 shortly before the end-of-the-year withdrawal date) because of concerns that they would not have be given immunity from Iraqi courts, a concern for American commanders in the field who also had to worry about the Sadrist response should troops stay and the general state of Iraq's readiness for transfer of power. link
    and another link
    That's weird. I served 20 years in the military in 4 different countries and the military personnel and contractors serving in those countries did not have immunity from prosecution by the local government. If you broke a local government law, you stood trial in their court. Most of the SOFA revolved on who had jurisdiction on the American military bases which housed the troops and equipment, the leased hotels and buildings etc. SOFA can also include rules of engagement and a whole bunch of other things. No one ever had immunity except those Embassy Personnel with diplomatic passports. Usually military personnel serving in a foreign country are subject to the laws of that country just like an American tourist would be.

    Are you sure President Obama wanted immunity for all the military and contractors? If so you are putting all of the military and contractors in the same category as the Ambassador and the Embassy staff. I never heard of this ever being requested. But there is always a first time for everything. Even when I was an Assistant Attache, I did not have immunity although I carried an embassy ID.
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

  2. #12
    Gradualist

    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Last Seen
    09-25-17 @ 12:48 PM
    Lean
    Socialist
    Posts
    34,949
    Blog Entries
    6

    Re: Obama, With Reluctance, Returns to Action in Iraq

    For ****s sake can someone actually know recent history!? How we got in this war, how we pulled out, etc?!??!?!


  3. #13
    Banned
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Location
    Ask the NSA
    Last Seen
    07-24-16 @ 01:41 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Slightly Liberal
    Posts
    5,849
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Obama, With Reluctance, Returns to Action in Iraq

    This whole situation spawned from the US getting involved there in the first place.

  4. #14
    Advisor Swit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Chicago, Illinois
    Last Seen
    10-13-16 @ 12:44 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    390

    Re: Obama, With Reluctance, Returns to Action in Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by Perotista View Post
    That's weird. I served 20 years in the military in 4 different countries and the military personnel and contractors serving in those countries did not have immunity from prosecution by the local government. If you broke a local government law, you stood trial in their court. Most of the SOFA revolved on who had jurisdiction on the American military bases which housed the troops and equipment, the leased hotels and buildings etc. SOFA can also include rules of engagement and a whole bunch of other things. No one ever had immunity except those Embassy Personnel with diplomatic passports. Usually military personnel serving in a foreign country are subject to the laws of that country just like an American tourist would be.

    Are you sure President Obama wanted immunity for all the military and contractors? If so you are putting all of the military and contractors in the same category as the Ambassador and the Embassy staff. I never heard of this ever being requested. But there is always a first time for everything. Even when I was an Assistant Attache, I did not have immunity although I carried an embassy ID.
    I must admit I never saw / read any of the actual SOFA proposals, but there was alot of controversy over Blackwater's allegedly killing of civillians as well as the Apache mowing down civilians movie that got exposed by wiki leaks. My understanding was that due to (at the time) the current SOFA agreemnt dis-allowed the Iraqi goverment from prosecuting those individuals and our Governments refusal to allow the prosecucution of the "casualties of war" type scenarios was the deal killer in the Iraqi parliments point of view. I can attempt and go dig up the articles if you wish.

  5. #15
    Advisor Swit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Chicago, Illinois
    Last Seen
    10-13-16 @ 12:44 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    390

    Re: Obama, With Reluctance, Returns to Action in Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by TeleKat View Post
    This whole situation spawned from the US getting involved there in the first place.
    agreed

  6. #16
    Banned
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Between Athens and Jerusalem
    Last Seen
    05-18-16 @ 07:06 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    33,522

    Re: Obama, With Reluctance, Returns to Action in Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by Swit View Post
    It doesn't matter if Iraqi military advised him to stay. They fact of the matter is he did in fact try to extend the agreement on the grounds that ALL American forces (military and contrator) were immun to Iraqi persecution. The Iraqi parliment refused to grant that and so never extended the SOFA agreement.... seriously... you can look this up. Obama supporters were furious that he was trying to extend the stay.
    link]U.S. Troops Are Leaving Because Iraq Doesn't Want Them There - The Atlantic
    from wiki:
    As reported on Saturday, October 15, 2011, the Obama Administration proceeded with the plan to withdraw American forces from Iraq (barring some last-minute move in the Iraqi parliament when they returned from a break in late November 2011 shortly before the end-of-the-year withdrawal date) because of concerns that they would not have be given immunity from Iraqi courts, a concern for American commanders in the field who also had to worry about the Sadrist response should troops stay and the general state of Iraq's readiness for transfer of power. link
    and another link
    Facts, are stubborn things...

    President Obama took credit in 2012 for withdrawing all troops from Iraq. Today he said something different. - The Washington Post


    "With regards to Iraq, you and I agreed, I believe, that there should be a status of forces agreement," Romney told Obama as the two convened on the Lynn University campus in Boca Raton, Fla., that October evening. "That’s not true," Obama interjected. “Oh, you didn't want a status of forces agreement?” Romney asked as an argument ensued. “No,” Obama said. “What I would not have done is left 10,000 troops in Iraq that would tie us down. That certainly would not help us in the Middle East.”

    On Thursday, Obama addressed reporters in the White House Briefing Room about Iraq’s latest crisis. “Do you wish you had left a residual force in Iraq? Any regrets about that decision in 2011?” a reporter asked. “Well, keep in mind that wasn’t a decision made by me,” Obama said. “That was a decision made by the Iraqi government.”
    President Obama took credit in 2012 for withdrawing all troops from Iraq. Today he said something different. - The Washington Post
    Obama is shucking and jiving, while innocent children are dying. Politics, is all this was to him.

  7. #17
    Banned
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Between Athens and Jerusalem
    Last Seen
    05-18-16 @ 07:06 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    33,522

    Re: Obama, With Reluctance, Returns to Action in Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter King View Post
    Another partisan story, how creative.

    Let's see, Obama does not send troops into a situation that he may not have known about (Benghazi) and there is a months and months long complain fest by the republicans/conservatives in congress.

    Now, a lot of Americans in possible danger and loads of the worlds most favorite people to the conservatives (Christians, what else) and Obama chooses to do airstrikes? And what do the conservatives/republicans do? Whine about him daring to take action in Iraq.

    Let's be honest, if Obama decided to but border forces up at the border to keep all those illegal immigrants out he would be trashed by the conservatives/republicans for taking away the freedom of the Southern states by deploying Obama's jackbooted dictatorial occupation army in the South to revenge slavery and out of hatred for the conservatives living there. Obama can never do anything right so I think he should just do what he thinks best and ignore the tea party and a large part of the republican party.
    You are falsely equating two very different scenarios-the Benghazi attacks and the Iraqi genocide occurring now under Obama. They do share a common factor though-the death of innocents for Obama's PERSONAL political benefit.

  8. #18
    Banned
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Between Athens and Jerusalem
    Last Seen
    05-18-16 @ 07:06 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    33,522

    Re: Obama, With Reluctance, Returns to Action in Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by Swit View Post
    I must admit I never saw / read any of the actual SOFA proposals, but there was alot of controversy over Blackwater's allegedly killing of civillians as well as the Apache mowing down civilians movie that got exposed by wiki leaks. My understanding was that due to (at the time) the current SOFA agreemnt dis-allowed the Iraqi goverment from prosecuting those individuals and our Governments refusal to allow the prosecucution of the "casualties of war" type scenarios was the deal killer in the Iraqi parliments point of view. I can attempt and go dig up the articles if you wish.
    That was nothing new, especially in 2011. Obama decided to USE SOFA as an excuse-even though his own military advisors and Iraq said it would result in the very massacre's we see now. Thanks a lot Obama.

  9. #19
    Banned
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Between Athens and Jerusalem
    Last Seen
    05-18-16 @ 07:06 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    33,522

    Re: Obama, With Reluctance, Returns to Action in Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by TeleKat View Post
    This whole situation spawned from the US getting involved there in the first place.
    ISIS didn't exist when we got involved there, they came into prominence under Obama, rapidly expanding like all of these terrorist organizations do. This is what a weak leader does to the world.

  10. #20
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Canada, Costa Rica
    Last Seen
    05-16-16 @ 09:45 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    31,645

    Re: Obama, With Reluctance, Returns to Action in Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by Swit View Post
    Actually, Obama tried to extend the SOFA agreement but due to the contraversies re: Americam Miliary contractors and immunity from Iraqi prosecution the SOFA agreement extension was denied by the Iraqi government.
    Those could have easily resolved and were expected to be.

Page 2 of 22 FirstFirst 123412 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •