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Thread: Judge rules Ten Commandments monument must go

  1. #161
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    Re: Judge rules Ten Commandments monument must go

    Quote Originally Posted by Swit View Post
    I don't understand what separation of church and state has to do with taxation. They were given a tax break NOT becuase of the separation of church and state but primarily because they were viewed as humanitarian institutions and basically non-profits. Once the televangelists and the mega-churches used religion as a cover to avoid paying taxes I believe that situation goes out the window. But it doesn't matter what I think. I would just prefer that those persons that are using religion to 1. scam people out of their money and 2. shelter themselves from tax liabilities on those gains should not be allowed to do so. Just my 2 cents.
    separation of church and state is to ensure neither has dominion over the other....taxing churches gives the government dominion over the churches

    the power to tax is the power to destroy.

    this is long settled law.

    wanting to tax churches is simply saying " I do not believe in the sepearation of church and state".. or " the state should control religion"

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    Re: Judge rules Ten Commandments monument must go

    Quote Originally Posted by Summerwind View Post
    Even before televangelists and such, the Catholic church surely gathered plenty of riches and land instead of pursuing humanitarian issues.
    Like I said tax em all.... I was just trying to point out that the "televangelists and such" are particularly aggregious do to the fact that they are utilizing religious tax incentives to dodge taxes and garner profit. I believe most religions honestly believe what they are preaching and aren't nessisarily doing it to amass wealth.

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    Re: Judge rules Ten Commandments monument must go

    Quote Originally Posted by Swit View Post
    Like I said tax em all.... I was just trying to point out that the "televangelists and such" are particularly aggregious do to the fact that they are utilizing religious tax incentives to doge taxes and garner profit. I believe most religions honestly believe what they are preaching and aren't nessisarily doing it to amass wealth.
    no, don't tax em... i kinda like hte separation of church and state intact.


    if they engage in non-religious commerce, you can tax them... like we do now.
    but taxing them on proceeds from religious activites is a big ass no-no.

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    Re: Judge rules Ten Commandments monument must go

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    separation of church and state is to ensure neither has dominion over the other....taxing churches gives the government dominion over the churches
    No the separation of church and state is to ensure that any particular religion doesn't have dominion over a religious diverse population.
    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    the power to tax is the power to destroy.
    No it's not it's the power to regulate.
    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    this is long settled law.
    Care to provide som back-up to this claim?
    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    wanting to tax churches is simply saying " I do not believe in the sepearation of church and state".. or " the state should control religion"
    No it's not. It's saying that if you are generating profit you should have the same obligation of all other profit generating institutions to provide for infrastructure. Not freeload off it.

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    Re: Judge rules Ten Commandments monument must go

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Nick View Post
    Outside of #2 was never a law in the United States.

    I mean #2 means don't be an arrogant clownish aristocratic fool. However even #2 could be considered treason, considering those guilty of being treasonous in history have often carried those traits...... Now, obviously in the US it's not illegal to be an arrogant fool, however that arrogance will certainly lead you to break the state laws that are based off the Ten Commandments.
    It doesn't mean "make yourself into an idol." It means "make an idol to worship."
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    Re: Judge rules Ten Commandments monument must go

    Quote Originally Posted by Summerwind View Post
    We belie all of them, so I'm figuring they are all pretty useless. Dittohead not! posted this analysis...



    But I'd go so far as to say that even the three he thinks are part of our society are not, and are instead conditionally accepted in our modern society, so really none of them apply, and it's an entirely useless list.
    Stealing, murdering, and committing perjury is illegal. It still goes on, of course, but it is illegal.
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    Re: Judge rules Ten Commandments monument must go

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    The thing you're missing is that atheists forcing religions to take monuments down is no different than religious groups forcing atheists to put religious monuments up.
    You are performing right up to my expectations of you talking around the q again. Once again, my question. Just answer it. Is that too much to ask, or are you only able to just keep dancing around it instead of giving an answer?

    Do you or do you not have a problem if Muslims in a town put verses from the Quran on their government walls?
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    Re: Judge rules Ten Commandments monument must go

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    You are performing right up to my expectations of you talking around the q again. Once again, my question. Just answer it. Is that too much to ask, or are you only able to just keep dancing around it instead of giving an answer?

    Do you or do you not have a problem if Muslims in a town put verses from the Quran on their government walls?
    For what it's worth apdst I am interested in your answer to this very straight forward question as well.

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    Re: Judge rules Ten Commandments monument must go

    Quote Originally Posted by Swit View Post
    No the separation of church and state is to ensure that any particular religion doesn't have dominion over a religious diverse population.
    so you are of the opinion the the goverbnment should have dominon over religion ?

    so much for the free exercise clause.

    No it's not it's the power to regulate.
    McCulloch v. Maryland, 1819, "the power to tax involves the power to destroy" Chief Justice John Marshal

    Care to provide som back-up to this claim?
    from our inception until 1970, no cases were brought forthchallengeing tax exempt status of churches.... in 1970, tax exemptions were found to be consitutional (Walz v. Tax Comm'n)
    this case contains the walz test

    the law allowing for the taxation of non-religious commerce/property was upheld in Differderfer v. Central Baptist Church

    No it's not. It's saying that if you are generating profit you should have the same obligation of all other profit generating institutions to provide for infrastructure. Not freeload off it.
    if churches engage in nonp0religious commerce, they can be taxed on that profit... otherwise, they hold a non-profit status and are accordingly tax exempt. (see Walz v Tax Comm'n)

    there is no "freeloading"... a tax exemption is not a subsidy, no matter how many time some lefty inaccurately argues as much.
    subsidies for churches are unconstitutional... tax exemptions are not.

  10. #170
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    Re: Judge rules Ten Commandments monument must go

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    What non religious reason could there be.. let's see.. perhaps the prohibition of adultery is there to remind the pols.. no, that can't be it. Maybe it's the injunction against working on the Sabbath... No, can't be that. It says they're supposed to work six days of the week. Could be the part about no idols, but no, their idol is the almighty dollar.

    Nope. Can't think of a single reason other than religion.
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