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Thread: Ebola fears hit close to home

  1. #101
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    Re: Ebola fears hit close to home

    Quote Originally Posted by grip View Post
    I mean 'locally', as in Atlanta. The chances of it spreading are not much more from there, with protocols in place, than from a sicky coming here.

    In the US, we have the labs and facilities to experiment with the active virus and possibly come up with some preventative medicine. We can't ship all of that equipment and resources to remote Africa so easily.
    I disagree, because folks don't just magically teleport themselves from West Africa to Atlanta. And I thought we were talking about treating patients, not vaccine research.

  2. #102
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    Re: Ebola fears hit close to home

    Quote Originally Posted by grip View Post
    Oh, that's a lot safer, just transport the infected fluids over here instead.
    It is, by an order of magnitude. The fluids, the cultures can be safety contained. Infected people however, and their medical attendants, so many little things can go wrong.

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    Re: Ebola fears hit close to home

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
    --Why we've given wings to Ebola is beyond me.

    Why we've even taken the risk to load up two people infected with the virus on a G3 is a mystery.

    It makes zero sense.
    Your answer is below.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
    -- its about isolating the carriers and proper quarantine procedures.
    I worked in Nigeria for three years when consecutive outbreaks of Lassa fever broke out and patients were shipped to the town I was based in for treatment. They were shipped in for proper isolation and quarantine by local reps of the WHO and the fast moving outbreak stopped even when it looked like breaking out of control.

    The US and many western countries have perfectly adequate centres were patients can be isolated and treated - you may be forgetting that Ebola and other viruses are also stockpiled as biological weapons in the west and you need doctors to have experience of treating such outbreaks if the unthinkable happens and war breaks out where biological weapons break out.

  4. #104
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    Re: Ebola fears hit close to home

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    I disagree, because folks don't just magically teleport themselves from West Africa to Atlanta. And I thought we were talking about treating patients, not vaccine research.

    Excellent question !

    Who ever said the 2014 " Ebola Transatlantic Tour " was about vaccination ?

    I thought it was about treatment too.

    Somethings fishy if you ask me.

    Treatment for Ebola is IV hydration. They can do that in Africa.

  5. #105
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    Re: Ebola fears hit close to home

    Quote Originally Posted by Infinite Chaos View Post
    Your answer is below.



    I worked in Nigeria for three years when consecutive outbreaks of Lassa fever broke out and patients were shipped to the town I was based in for treatment. They were shipped in for proper isolation and quarantine by local reps of the WHO and the fast moving outbreak stopped even when it looked like breaking out of control.

    The US and many western countries have perfectly adequate centres were patients can be isolated and treated - you may be forgetting that Ebola and other viruses are also stockpiled as biological weapons in the west and you need doctors to have experience of treating such outbreaks if the unthinkable happens and war breaks out where biological weapons break out.
    Sorry but I dont buy it.

    You said they have adequate facilities to isolate and quarantine in Africa.

    So why are they being brought back to America ?

    To study the virus ? They can ship live cultures of the virus internationally.

    Still, no good answer to justify this

  6. #106
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    Re: Ebola fears hit close to home

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
    Sorry but I dont buy it.

    You said they have adequate facilities to isolate and quarantine in Africa.
    Lassa Fever yes - Ebola - no. The effects on the body are relatively similar though

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
    So why are they being brought back to America ?

    To study the virus ? They can ship live cultures of the virus internationally.

    Still, no good answer to justify this
    From my understanding, the patients are American and if they are with an aid agency there is usually an agreement to get people out fast and by whatever means. That was the health agreement that covered me when I worked over there. There would also be outrage at westerners left to die horrible deaths with their orifices haemorrhaging blood and other liquids in a 3rd world country.

    Anyhow, I think the original point I made is why - you can ship live cultures but understanding the disease / virus requires affected patients.

  7. #107
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    Re: Ebola fears hit close to home

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    I disagree, because folks don't just magically teleport themselves from West Africa to Atlanta. And I thought we were talking about treating patients, not vaccine research.
    They already gave one of the patients an experimental serum and I'm sure they'll want samples and to do more tests. And the other received a blood transfusion from a survivor.


    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
    Lol.....

    We're DOING THAT NOW !

    Two massive virus cultures in the form of two dumbasses who put themselves in harms way.
    So, what's the big deal?



    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    It is, by an order of magnitude. The fluids, the cultures can be safety contained. Infected people however, and their medical attendants, so many little things can go wrong.
    I'll agree, it's somewhat riskier, but not by that much magnitude of degree with our procedures. At least that's what a doctor from the CDC just said on CNN.
    Einstein, "science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."

  8. #108
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    Re: Ebola fears hit close to home

    Quote Originally Posted by Infinite Chaos View Post
    Lassa Fever yes - Ebola - no. The effects on the body are relatively similar though



    From my understanding, the patients are American and if they are with an aid agency there is usually an agreement to get people out fast and by whatever means. That was the health agreement that covered me when I worked over there. There would also be outrage at westerners left to die horrible deaths with their orifices haemorrhaging blood and other liquids in a 3rd world country.

    Anyhow, I think the original point I made is why - you can ship live cultures but understanding the disease / virus requires affected patients.
    Oh I think our Scientists are well educated on Ebola's effects on the patient.

    Its not a new disease by any stretch.

    And I think the majority of Americans wouldn't be terribly upset if these two people died in Zaire or the Congo.

    I have little sympathy for them.

    Look, Ebola can be prevented. Stop catching, slaughtering and eating fruit bats.

    Im sure the people in these villages have been warned once or twice about the dangers of hunting these winged vermin BUT, they dont listen.

  9. #109
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    Re: Ebola fears hit close to home

    Quote Originally Posted by WCH View Post
    I've heard that doctors are reusing needles as a common practice. Perhaps cleaning them is how some doctors have come down with the illness.
    The reason for high mortality at the moment in Liberia and Guinea is that the local cultural practice of washing the dead body before burial.

    Nothing to do with reusing needles. Some medical equipment is being reused but it is also being disinfected. There is a lot of local expertise but not enough equipment available so a lot of health workers are dying.

    Quote Originally Posted by WCH View Post
    Also, because they can't seem to abstain from sex when needed, the fact that Ebola can exist in their sperm for 2 months after the symptoms disappear comes into play.
    - the reason for the large number of deaths this time in contrast to other outbreaks in West Africa is specifically cultural - i.e. washing bodies before burial meaning close contact with bodily fluids.

    Quote Originally Posted by jmotivator View Post
    The incubation period of Ebola is 2 to 21 days according to the CDC. What limits the spread of the virus is not that it kills quickly, it's that it is not known to spread through aerosols. The only known spread in humans is through contact with a sick person. There is a known case of Ebola spreading in a research facility among chimpanzees through aerosol, though.
    Bingo.

    Lassa fever transfers to humans through very specific aerosol processes i.e. the virus in rat urine on mud is carried in water vapour into the nostrils when humans hunt rats for food by sticking their heads down or near a rat hole (not a wise thing even when Lassa isn't a threat)

    Ebola currently requires contact with liquids through very close contact. The chair of the WHO does sound the correct caution when she states that we must not allow the virus a chance to mutate.

    "Apart from this specific situation, the general public is not at high risk of infection by the Ebola virus," she said.

    "At the same time, it would be extremely unwise for national authorities and the international community to allow an Ebola virus to circulate widely and over a long period of time in human populations."

    She also said that:

    Constant mutation and adaptation are the survival mechanisms of viruses and it was important not to allow opportunities for them to deliver more surprises

  10. #110
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    Re: Ebola fears hit close to home

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
    Oh I think our Scientists are well educated on Ebola's effects on the patient.

    Its not a new disease by any stretch.

    And I think the majority of Americans wouldn't be terribly upset if these two people died in Zaire or the Congo.

    I have little sympathy for them.
    Why?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
    Look, Ebola can be prevented. Stop catching, slaughtering and eating fruit bats.

    Im sure the people in these villages have been warned once or twice about the dangers of hunting these winged vermin BUT, they dont listen.
    Same as rats in West Africa and Lassa Fever - Lassa only breaks out at certain times of the year (the dry hot period which gives the best condition for infected rat urine to become a dangerous aerosol.)

    Anyhow - I'm digressing - people need food, protein. It's not easy to suddenly find a new meat source. What would be more effective is to work on the culture of washing recently dead bodies by hand. That is the reason the numbers in West Africa are so high this time.

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