Page 10 of 37 FirstFirst ... 8910111220 ... LastLast
Results 91 to 100 of 366

Thread: Federal Court rules Most obamacare subsidies Illegal[W:286]

  1. #91
    Sage
    Perotista's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Georgia
    Last Seen
    Today @ 08:47 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    17,916
    Blog Entries
    24

    re: Federal Court rules Most obamacare subsidies Illegal[W:286]

    Quote Originally Posted by ludin View Post
    there are still good judges out there just few and far between. the law is suppose to be neutral and independant of ideology but you constantly have judges making crap up that doesn't even exist as long as it justifies them politically.
    Yep, I have seen so much of that I have given up completely on our judicial system. Heck, on our whole political system.
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

  2. #92
    Guru

    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    In a Blue State
    Last Seen
    12-07-17 @ 03:24 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    4,732

    re: Federal Court rules Most obamacare subsidies Illegal[W:286]

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    No, it's not



    No, it's not



    No, it's not
    From the law:

    26 U.S. Code § 36B, 2, a - the monthly premiums for such month for 1 or more qualified health plans offered in the individual market within a State which cover the taxpayer, the taxpayer’s spouse, or any dependent (as defined in section 152) of the taxpayer and which were enrolled in through an Exchange established by the State under 1311 [1] of the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act, or
    Black and white. It is the literal meaning of the words. The Federal Exchange does not receive the subsidies the way the law is written. It was written for State Exchanges.

    Probably should have read before we passed it.
    We went from sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me to safe spaces.

  3. #93
    Guru
    Samhain's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Northern Ohio
    Last Seen
    Today @ 02:33 PM
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    3,875

    re: Federal Court rules Most obamacare subsidies Illegal[W:286]

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    Yes, the one paragraph out of thousands and thousands of pages of text seems straightforward when you ignore those other million words.

    However, if you were to look at those other words, you'd find some that clearly suggest that the tax credits would also apply to people who bought through an exchange run by the feds. This creates "ambiguity" and the court has a process, established long before AVA was even proposed, to resolve such ambiguities. This process requires the court to defer to the agency's interpretation of the text unless one can provide a compelling case for why they should not be deferred to (such as the interpretation is clearly in conflict with any reasonable interpretation of the text, unconstitutionality, etc)

    In the decision that allows the subsidies, the court cites several examples of text that make no sense unless the authors intended the subsidies to apply to all of the exchanges, and not just those "established by the States". Ergo, "ambiguity"...Ergo "deference" to the IRS's interpretation
    The government added to the ambiguity by exempting US Territories from the law by stating that they aren't "States". That's sure to come up in the appeal.

  4. #94
    Sage


    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    SW Virginia
    Last Seen
    12-06-17 @ 11:37 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    18,258

    re: Federal Court rules Most obamacare subsidies Illegal[W:286]

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    No, it's not
    Yes, it is.



    No, it's not
    Yes, it is.



    No, it's not
    Yes, it is. I win.

  5. #95
    Sage

    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Republic of Florida
    Last Seen
    Today @ 01:40 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    14,007

    re: Federal Court rules Most obamacare subsidies Illegal[W:286]

    This is really all moot anyway, given the ACA is unconstitutional. There is no power in the constitution for the govt to spend money on healthcare. One court ruling isnt going to fix that.

  6. #96
    Sage

    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 10:21 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    30,561

    re: Federal Court rules Most obamacare subsidies Illegal[W:286]

    Quote Originally Posted by Samhain View Post
    The government added to the ambiguity by exempting US Territories from the law by stating that they aren't "States". That's sure to come up in the appeal.
    very much so that is going to come up in the appeal. that right there just unabiguously said that there is a difference between the federal exchange and the States.

    i found it right here.

    HHS suddenly finds ObamaCare exemptions for territories « Hot Air

    Almost exactly a year later, HHS has changed its mind. After a “careful review” of the statute — which presumably didn’t happen when this letter went out last year — HHS has discovered that “State” really does just mean states after all, and not any other level of government

    that right there is the nail in the coffin.

    State really means state and not any form of government. they can't constantly change the definitions willy nilly they have to be consistant.

  7. #97
    Sage


    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    SW Virginia
    Last Seen
    12-06-17 @ 11:37 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    18,258

    re: Federal Court rules Most obamacare subsidies Illegal[W:286]

    Quote Originally Posted by ludin View Post
    very much so that is going to come up in the appeal. that right there just unabiguously said that there is a difference between the federal exchange and the States.

    i found it right here.

    HHS suddenly finds ObamaCare exemptions for territories « Hot Air

    Almost exactly a year later, HHS has changed its mind. After a “careful review” of the statute — which presumably didn’t happen when this letter went out last year — HHS has discovered that “State” really does just mean states after all, and not any other level of government

    that right there is the nail in the coffin.

    State really means state and not any form of government. they can't constantly change the definitions willy nilly they have to be consistant.
    They can, and they have. The political left is heavily invested in the effort. The courts and government institutions have been very accommodating with that effort lately. Anyone bucking the effort is summarily smeared. It happens right here on DP all the time, too.

  8. #98
    Guru

    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    In a Blue State
    Last Seen
    12-07-17 @ 03:24 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    4,732

    re: Federal Court rules Most obamacare subsidies Illegal[W:286]

    Quote Originally Posted by ludin View Post
    very much so that is going to come up in the appeal. that right there just unabiguously said that there is a difference between the federal exchange and the States.

    i found it right here.

    HHS suddenly finds ObamaCare exemptions for territories « Hot Air

    Almost exactly a year later, HHS has changed its mind. After a “careful review” of the statute — which presumably didn’t happen when this letter went out last year — HHS has discovered that “State” really does just mean states after all, and not any other level of government

    that right there is the nail in the coffin.

    State really means state and not any form of government. they can't constantly change the definitions willy nilly they have to be consistant.
    Not like tax and penalty.
    We went from sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me to safe spaces.

  9. #99
    Sage
    sangha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Lower Hudson Valley, NY
    Last Seen
    09-17-17 @ 05:48 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    59,990

    re: Federal Court rules Most obamacare subsidies Illegal[W:286]

    Quote Originally Posted by Blue_State View Post
    From the law:



    Black and white. It is the literal meaning of the words. The Federal Exchange does not receive the subsidies the way the law is written. It was written for State Exchanges.

    Probably should have read before we passed it.
    That same provision says
    “[e]ach State shall, not
    later than January 1, 2014, establish an American Health Benefit
    Exchange (referred to in this title as an “Exchange”)[.]”
    Funny how, despite all your whining about the literal meaning of the words, you don't complain about how 36 states did not establish an exchange even though the law says they had to.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  10. #100
    Guru

    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    In a Blue State
    Last Seen
    12-07-17 @ 03:24 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    4,732

    re: Federal Court rules Most obamacare subsidies Illegal[W:286]

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    That same provision says


    Funny how, despite all your whining about the literal meaning of the words, you don't complain about how 36 states did not establish an exchange even though the law says they had to.
    I didn't know we were talking about states setting up exchanges or not. I was pretty sure we were talking about the wording in the document that allows for use of Federal subsidies. I thought we were talking about the court ruling. Funny how you are whining about something we aren't even talking about.
    We went from sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me to safe spaces.

Page 10 of 37 FirstFirst ... 8910111220 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •