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Thread: Top Marine to Obama: Get in the Fight

  1. #91
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    Re: Top Marine to Obama: Get in the Fight

    Quote Originally Posted by APACHERAT View Post
    I wasn't around the DP back in 2003 either but I was on other boards and I also then didn't support putting boots on the ground in Iraq to enforce the law that Clinton signed.

    I kind of agreed with the military top brass at the time, we could accomplish the first two phases for going to war, the mission being regime change but would likely fail or have problems with fulfilling the other phases that follow after accomplishing the main mission.

    Bush and Rumsfeld were warned that you would need a minimum of 400,000 boots on the ground to occupy. Rumsfeld responded you go to war with the military you have.

    I never cared that much for Rumsfeld, he always reminded me of McNamara.

    But on the day our troops crossed the line and entered Iraq I had to support the troops because never again do I want to see Americans back stabbing our troops again like what happened during the Vietnam War.
    That didn't address your accusation that in hindsight it was easy for me to criticise the Iraq war. I made it clear that it was not hindsight. I opposed it from the outset until this moment.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Top Marine to Obama: Get in the Fight

    Quote Originally Posted by Risky Thicket View Post
    Certainement! But then that wasn't really a democracy.

    As to the other "democracies" popping up, probably not. I would not agree that they are democracies.
    what about tunisia?
    "If you can't stand the way this place is, Take yourself to higher places!"
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    Hilliary Clinton/Tim Kaine 2016

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    Re: Top Marine to Obama: Get in the Fight

    Quote Originally Posted by Hamster Buddha View Post
    I'd say we achieved our objectives, and for Iraq, it was to provide them an environment in which a democracy could thrive. It's not our responsibility to run their governments. Unless we wanted to have a true imperialist attitude and actually start annexing some of these places and putting them under our rule. That's the only way people in that part of the world won't start up killing one another.
    It's not our responsibility to pick what type of government people should live under. In fact all of our FP is self promoting and self appointed.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Top Marine to Obama: Get in the Fight

    Quote Originally Posted by Risky Thicket View Post
    Indeed. But democracy is a process, as it must come UP from the people, rather than DOWN on a people by being imposed on a nation by another government.
    At any rate, people are silly if they think our government has democracy and the well being of any people's at heart. It's a very different animal that drives foreign policy. Facades are a dime a dozen.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Top Marine to Obama: Get in the Fight

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    It's not our responsibility to pick what type of government people should live under. In fact all of our FP is self promoting and self appointed.
    It does become our concern when said created government is a threat to our National Security though.

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    Re: Top Marine to Obama: Get in the Fight

    Quote Originally Posted by Hamster Buddha View Post
    It does become our concern when said created government is a threat to our National Security though.
    Goodness, that again. Do we ever learn anything. The government of Iraq, ANY government in Iraq will not be a threat to your security or mine or our nations. You have no fear of mushroom clouds over a US city. You have far more reason to be concerned about your own government.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Top Marine to Obama: Get in the Fight

    Quote Originally Posted by Risky Thicket View Post
    Certainement! But then that wasn't really a democracy.

    As to the other "democracies" popping up, probably not. I would not agree that they are democracies.
    It was a democracy, because people were elected and everyone got a seat at the table and worked together. Not sure what else it would be under that circumstance. And I'm not sure what else you would call what happened in Egypt in regards to their elections, or that of Hamas in the Gaza Stripe. You and me may just have differing definitions of what a democracy is.

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    Re: Top Marine to Obama: Get in the Fight

    Quote Originally Posted by poweRob View Post
    Of course they were scared. Their revolution made a very very unstable country out of one that was reatively stable (per the region) and when a voting populace wants stability they tend to go for the toughest talking mo-fo out there.
    Oh malarkey! They wanted this change. Do these people look scared to you:


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    Re: Top Marine to Obama: Get in the Fight

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    That didn't address your accusation that in hindsight it was easy for me to criticise the Iraq war. I made it clear that it was not hindsight. I opposed it from the outset until this moment.
    I take your word for it.

    But there seems to be more today who say they always opposed going to war in Iraq than there was in 2003.

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    Re: Top Marine to Obama: Get in the Fight

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Goodness, that again. Do we ever learn anything. The government of Iraq, ANY government in Iraq will not be a threat to your security or mine or our nations. You have no fear of mushroom clouds over a US city. You have far more reason to be concerned about your own government.
    Actually I wasn't referring to Iraq in this case; we would of been better off leaving Saddam in power. Afghanistan however is where 9/11 was planned and executed from.

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