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Thread: Only 20% Think Debate About Global Warming Is Over

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    Re: Only 20% Think Debate About Global Warming Is Over

    Quote Originally Posted by Threegoofs View Post
    You really need to let every single major national and international scientific organization know of your findings.

    Climate Change: Consensus

    I can't wait to see what your thoughts are about gravitational wave theory, nuclear physics, and molecular biology are.
    The earth sucks. Its "nucular" physics. And who cares what moles do?
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    Re: Only 20% Think Debate About Global Warming Is Over

    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl View Post
    I was referring to the NSIDC funded by NOAA and NASA. Still hung up on that 97% I see. I have to wonder why people don't feel silly repeating that phony number again and again after the overwhelming evidence that it has been thoroughly disputed. But CanadaJohn is correct that the OP is about the debate itself and whether it is over, so I will continue to try to focus on that. The number of scientists promoting AGW, whether accurate or manufactured, is irrelevent to the OP. The fact that there are still a LOT of questions out there re what the AGW group is actively trying to sell is relevent.
    NOAA and NASA are quite clear on their stance on AGW.

    Because....there is an overwhelming consensus. In fact, NASA itself clarifies that 97% of scientists agree with AGW!!


    http://climate.nasa.gov/scientific-consensus/
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    Re: Only 20% Think Debate About Global Warming Is Over

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Nick View Post
    Yea, I cant prove a negative wrong........It just so happens that this nonsense is the biggest myth since the idea that the sun revolved round the earth.

    Believe me I would love to tell these quacks that they're idiots and call them out.... It doesn't take much intelligence to realize their game -- $$$$$$$$....
    So the scientists that reject AGW are working pro bono?
    Anyone wondering what I'm talking about start here:
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    Re: Only 20% Think Debate About Global Warming Is Over

    Quote Originally Posted by What if...? View Post
    So the scientists that reject AGW are working pro bono?
    Well, we should ask both of them.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Only 20% Think Debate About Global Warming Is Over

    Quote Originally Posted by What if...? View Post
    I would hope scientists refrain from simple manipulation of public opinion. I suspect letting the PR boys contribute led to much of the "evidence" that AGW is a hoax.

    Those whose fortunes ride on AGW NOT being real certainly do indulge in persuasive messaging.
    Really? You're selling that?

    The only people making money on the AGW scam are those pushing inefficient, costly, green energy "solutions" ignoring the whole picture while making a buck - billions of bucks - off people who mean well. That's what really makes me angry.

    I know, I live in Ontario, Canada, where the ignorant idiots in government have decided to go all in on solar and wind power, two of the most costly and inefficient sources of green energy, claiming it's replacing coal, when in fact nuclear, natural gas, and hydro-electric have replaced all the coal we were using and more. In addition to tossing billions at those who will put windmills on their land, they are paying them upwards of 10 times the market price for the energy they provide and wind power never provides energy when it's actually needed. As a result, Ontario is selling - that's right SELLING - excess power because you can't just shut down nuclear and hydro-electric generation on a dime and they are buying all wind power first, as part of their contracts. And that selling of extra power to other jurisdictions is not really selling because we have to PAY other jurisdictions to take that power out of our system.

    Add to this, the fact that home consumers have had their electricity bills double and the government has promised that their bills will increase again by at least 42% over the next 5 years. Add again, the fact that manufacturing in Ontario is bolting for the US and other neighbouring Canadian jurisdictions because electricity costs in Ontario aren't competitive. And guess what, with a reduced need for electricity by manufacturers who've closed shop, we have even more excess electricity to pay other jurisdictions to take.

    So as you can see, the brilliant minds in the green energy field are destroying the standard of living Ontario had in Canada and in North America. If America is smart, they'll look at the examples in Europe and Canada and run screaming for the exits before it's too late.
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." William F. Buckley Jr.

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    Re: Only 20% Think Debate About Global Warming Is Over

    Quote Originally Posted by Threegoofs View Post
    NOAA and NASA are quite clear on their stance on AGW.

    Because....there is an overwhelming consensus. In fact, NASA itself clarifies that 97% of scientists agree with AGW!!


    Climate Change: Consensus
    They clarified it, dishonestly, in 2009 after which it was thoroughly debunked.

    NASA satellite data from the years 2000 through 2011 show the Earth's atmosphere is allowing far more heat to be released into space than alarmist computer models have predicted, reports a new study in the peer-reviewed science journal Remote Sensing. The study indicates far less future global warming will occur than United Nations computer models have predicted, and supports prior studies indicating increases in atmospheric carbon dioxide trap far less heat than alarmists have claimed.
    New NASA Data Blow Gaping Hole In Global Warming Alarmism

    It is such expose's that are becoming the norm rather than the exception that no doubt has triggered that 20% number in the OP. And I'm quite confident that if all scientists who have any knowledge of climate and climate issues were polled, the number doggedly hanging onto the AGW doctrine would be a whole bunch less than 97% and the huge majority if not all of those who do are the ones receiving government funding as long as they promote the doctrine while Obama is in office. Put a President with healthy skepticism into office, and I'm pretty darn sure you'll see much different numbers coming out of those studies.
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    Re: Only 20% Think Debate About Global Warming Is Over

    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl View Post
    Maybe predictions that the ice caps will melt, coastal cities will flood, and all the other 'predictions' of runaway anthropogenic created CO2 aren't 'doomsday predictions' to you. But they sure look that way to me.

    I've been following this stuff since the 1970's and noting when this was supposed to happen or that was supposed to happen. Did you forget that in 2007 Al Gore was amassing his fortune by declaring that the Arctic ocean would be ice free by 2014? But non of the AGW religionists are criticizing him now are they?

    We are in the middle of summer in 2014 and the ice coverage is pretty normal--no danger that ice melt will be as much as that of at least five other years in the very short (33 years) period that records have been kept of ice melt. So everybody moved the goal posts to 2050 that the great melt is expected to be a done deal. That gives them another 35 or so years to take more liberties, choices, options, and opportunities away from the people and solidify their personal fortunes before they have to ignore how wrong they got that too and move the 'doomsday' prophecy dates again.
    For one, Al Gore is not a scientist, he is a communicator. If you want to know the official positions of the AGW community, I suggest you read the IPCC reports.

    For two, did Al Gore really say "the Arctic ice will be gone by 2014?". If so please provide a source. My experience with deniers tells me that Gore probably said something or other that was creatively interpreted to mean that but did not mean that at all and this is just a bunch of nonsense.

    For three, even if he did say that (which I doubt he did), who cares? He is one guy in this world. Do you really base your belief systems and information from what a single person says?

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    Re: Only 20% Think Debate About Global Warming Is Over

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    Really? You're selling that?

    The only people making money on the AGW scam are those pushing inefficient, costly, green energy "solutions" ignoring the whole picture while making a buck - billions of bucks - off people who mean well. That's what really makes me angry.

    I know, I live in Ontario, Canada, where the ignorant idiots in government have decided to go all in on solar and wind power, two of the most costly and inefficient sources of green energy, claiming it's replacing coal, when in fact nuclear, natural gas, and hydro-electric have replaced all the coal we were using and more. In addition to tossing billions at those who will put windmills on their land, they are paying them upwards of 10 times the market price for the energy they provide and wind power never provides energy when it's actually needed. As a result, Ontario is selling - that's right SELLING - excess power because you can't just shut down nuclear and hydro-electric generation on a dime and they are buying all wind power first, as part of their contracts. And that selling of extra power to other jurisdictions is not really selling because we have to PAY other jurisdictions to take that power out of our system.

    Add to this, the fact that home consumers have had their electricity bills double and the government has promised that their bills will increase again by at least 42% over the next 5 years. Add again, the fact that manufacturing in Ontario is bolting for the US and other neighbouring Canadian jurisdictions because electricity costs in Ontario aren't competitive. And guess what, with a reduced need for electricity by manufacturers who've closed shop, we have even more excess electricity to pay other jurisdictions to take.

    So as you can see, the brilliant minds in the green energy field are destroying the standard of living Ontario had in Canada and in North America. If America is smart, they'll look at the examples in Europe and Canada and run screaming for the exits before it's too late.
    Also not true.

    The largest, most-consistent money fueling the climate denial movement are a number of well-funded conservative foundations built with so-called "dark money," or concealed donations, according to an analysis released Friday afternoon.

    "Dark Money" Funds Climate Change Denial Effort - Scientific American

    Secret funding helped build vast network of climate denial thinktanks
    Anonymous billionaires donated $120m to more than 100 anti-climate groups working to discredit climate change science

    Secret funding helped build vast network of climate denial thinktanks | Environment | The Guardian

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    Re: Only 20% Think Debate About Global Warming Is Over

    Quote Originally Posted by Verax View Post
    This is the result of ignorance. People who don't understand science but think they do. I will never understand why people think that an idea they had while looking out the window is just as valid as a scientist... A professional, a person who went to college and got a degree, who spent many years studying after college and while working in the field many years as a career.

    I've said this many times in the environmental forum and I will say it again here. Almost all of the questions about global warming can be answered simply by reading an introductory science textbook. The remaining questions can be answered by studying climate science and reading the IPCC's reports.

    If you don't know anything about these things, you should not have an opinion that you think AGW is X(anything), because you have no idea. If you are going to have an opinion at least do a bare minimum of research and learn basic science first, it is not that hard at all. If you don't do this, you are at the mercy of whatever nonsense is spewed from television, radio, the internet. It is laughably stupid and you will immediately spot it once you learn a few basic things.
    I fully agree with your post.

    I am, however, shocked that it was you that said such a thing. I have not seen any evidence of a sound understanding of such basic science from you. I have seen a lot of religious support of the AGW hype.

  10. #120
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    Re: Only 20% Think Debate About Global Warming Is Over

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    Really? You're selling that?

    The only people making money on the AGW scam are those pushing inefficient, costly, green energy "solutions" ignoring the whole picture while making a buck - billions of bucks - off people who mean well. That's what really makes me angry.

    I know, I live in Ontario, Canada, where the ignorant idiots in government have decided to go all in on solar and wind power, two of the most costly and inefficient sources of green energy, claiming it's replacing coal, when in fact nuclear, natural gas, and hydro-electric have replaced all the coal we were using and more. In addition to tossing billions at those who will put windmills on their land, they are paying them upwards of 10 times the market price for the energy they provide and wind power never provides energy when it's actually needed. As a result, Ontario is selling - that's right SELLING - excess power because you can't just shut down nuclear and hydro-electric generation on a dime and they are buying all wind power first, as part of their contracts. And that selling of extra power to other jurisdictions is not really selling because we have to PAY other jurisdictions to take that power out of our system.

    Add to this, the fact that home consumers have had their electricity bills double and the government has promised that their bills will increase again by at least 42% over the next 5 years. Add again, the fact that manufacturing in Ontario is bolting for the US and other neighbouring Canadian jurisdictions because electricity costs in Ontario aren't competitive. And guess what, with a reduced need for electricity by manufacturers who've closed shop, we have even more excess electricity to pay other jurisdictions to take.

    So as you can see, the brilliant minds in the green energy field are destroying the standard of living Ontario had in Canada and in North America. If America is smart, they'll look at the examples in Europe and Canada and run screaming for the exits before it's too late.
    Seems you're shifting focus from what scientists are concerned about and what politicians and capitalists are doing in response.

    And the idea that an industry won't resort to manipulation through persuasion science every time it protects/improves their bottom lines is nonsense.

    Persuasion is a ten billion dollar a year business in the US outside of practitioners in direct employ
    Anyone wondering what I'm talking about start here:
    The Psychology of Persuasion

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