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New York Healthcare Premiums Are About To Explode

New York Healthcare Premiums Are About To Explode

By Brett LoGiurato 7/15/2014

Insurance companies operating in New York State's marketplace are expected to ask for double-digit premium hikes next year, according to new filings from the companies.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/york-healthcare-premiums-explode-132658547.html

Insurance premiums will still be lower than they were pre-ACA

Here’s why health insurance premiums are tumbling in New York - The Washington Post

Nearly all stories about the health-care overhaul and insurance premiums tend to be about the cost of health insurance rising. That's what makes this front page story in the New York Times all the more unexpected: "Health Plan Cost For New Yorkers Set to Fall 50 Percent."

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/07/17/health/health-plan-cost-for-new-yorkers-set-to-fall-50.html?hp
 
I didn't say you can't make the international comparisons. I said that if you do make international comparisons, you need to do so much research and provide so many qualifiers that the comparisons will become less meaningful. My post was pretty clear on this.

By stating my thoughts, edited by your method and intention, and then rewording the conclusions as you did, that eliminated the meaning I applied and then you applied a meaning you preferred. Disingenuous is a generous definition of your effort.

I also provided a link from a real news source with editorial staff review and real world example that undermined your cartoon's conclusion and supported my assertion that international comparisons are often suspect.

If you only want to throw out assertions and not actually respond to my thoughts, why did you quote me?
The percent of people who have to wait more than 6 days to see a doctor seems to be an easy measurement that's cut and dry without room to interpret.
 
American Enterprise Institute - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

(The American, which you cited, is the online arm of the AEI. I think they have a certain bias.)

"Its stated mission is "to defend the principles and improve the institutions of American freedom and democratic capitalism—limited government, private enterprise, individual liberty and responsibility, vigilant and effective defense and foreign policies, political accountability, and open debate"."

"Some AEI scholars are considered to be some of the leading architects of the second Bush administration's public policy.[3] More than twenty AEI scholars and fellows served either in a Bush administration policy post or on one of the government's many panels and commissions. Among the prominent former government officials now affiliated with AEI are former U.S. ambassador to the U.N. John Bolton, now an AEI senior fellow; former chairman of the National Endowment for the Humanities Lynne Cheney, a longtime AEI senior fellow; former House Speaker Newt Gingrich,"

___

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/documents/american_journal_of_medicine_09.pdf

The link I posted was to the 60% percent of Bankrupticies caused by medical expenses***

Sorry, forgot to type that xP
 
Comparing any international statistics on anything is pretty much meaningless. The methodology of getting the stats and the definitions of what particular things mean change in many cases when you cross a border.

I was trying once to follow up on a life expectancy figure and found that infant mortality is recorded in different ways by different countries. For instance, in the European countries that I ran into, infant morality was recorded by hospitals and calculated more as a measure of staff effectiveness and less as a simple counting function. Effect of this change?

If the baby was DOA, the stat was not recorded anywhere. The Staff could not re-animate the corpse, so the stat would not fit into their columns and was ignored. It died somewhere else. That baby dies and would therefore be a drag on the life expectancy numbers, but that 1 life at zero years did not hit the averages.

This does not indicate any devious conspiracy. It's just the analysis of the numbers as they exist and are collected by the rules of whatever bureaucracy is trying to whatever it does. Similarly, in the USA, an unborn is not counted as a death. Just the way it is.

Your chart might be perfect, but the anecdotal stories are in conflict with it. I would need to see more evidence than one blogger.

Three-week wait to see your doctor: Millions of patients are denied a prompt appointment to see their GP | Mail Online

<snip>
Millions of patients wait as long as three weeks to see their GP, a Daily Mail survey reveals today.
Only one in three manages to secure a same-day appointment, despite Government promises to make such slots routinely available. One in five cannot get a consultation within seven days.
>nip>

Read more: Three-week wait to see your doctor: Millions of patients are denied a prompt appointment to see their GP | Mail Online
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

Honestly, if anything, your citation makes it obvious that the Current UK system was not built with the Age Demographical Shift considerations and that more funding needs to go into access and medical teaching schools because the Aging Population is relying more on the system than it has before, and what it's been constructed to deal with.

But you know, tomato, tamato.
 

Yes, really... No part at all

Who wrote the legislation?
Democrats

Who voted to pass the legislation in the Senate?
60 Democrats, 0 Republicans

Who voted to pass the legislation in the House?
219 Democrats, 0 Republicans.

Who supported and signed that legislation into law?
President Obama

Democrats own this turd... The entire steaming pile.
 
Yes, really... No part at all

Who wrote the legislation?
Democrats

Who voted to pass the legislation in the Senate?
60 Democrats, 0 Republicans

Who voted to pass the legislation in the House?
219 Democrats, 0 Republicans.

Who supported and signed that legislation into law?
President Obama

Democrats own this turd... The entire steaming pile.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/07/17/h...t-for-new-yorkers-set-to-fall-50.html?hp&_r=0

^ Democrat's fault :O

Also, I thought your avatar was an Elephant xP
 
The fact you take a year old story from the NY Times, that quotes a politician who made a prediction that was incorrect, tells me all I need to know about what being a communist is all about.

Well, you are right about one thing. I did not look at the date. :3oops:
 
Yes, really... No part at all

Who wrote the legislation?
Democrats

Who voted to pass the legislation in the Senate?
60 Democrats, 0 Republicans

Who voted to pass the legislation in the House?
219 Democrats, 0 Republicans.

Who supported and signed that legislation into law?
President Obama

Democrats own this turd... The entire steaming pile.

Democrats in congress sure do. Actual citizens.. the democrats out here in the real world did not want this turd either. They wanted single payer.
 



A good place to start the correction of the underfunding would be to increase the productivity by 8 times to the AVERAGE of the private sector.

The VA receives enough funding to care for patients. They waste enough to create a disaster.

The current cost per visit to a VA hospital as measured in 2008 was about $666. The vast majority of visits are not in-patient. of the 60 million visits, only 773,600 were in-patient. That is about 1% of the visits that actually required in patient care.

I need to be clear here that I am not begrudging any care to a veteran on any any level for any reason. I am only pointing out that this is about the worst efficiency in the world of medicine.

http://www.va.gov/opa/publications/factsheets/fs_department_of_veterans_affairs.pdf

(selected snipets):

VA's fiscal year 2009 spending is projected to be approximately $93.4 billion, including $40 billion for health care, $46.9 billion for benefits, and $230 million for the national cemetery system. This is more than a 7 percent increase from the department’s $87.6 billion budget for fiscal year 2009.

Almost 5.5 million people received care in VA health care facilities in 2008. By the end of fiscal year 2008, 78 percent of all disabled and low-income veterans had enrolled with VA for health care; 65 percent of them were treated by VA. In 2008, VA inpatient facilities treated 773,600 patients. VA’s outpatient clinics registered over 60 million visits.
 
The percent of people who have to wait more than 6 days to see a doctor seems to be an easy measurement that's cut and dry without room to interpret.



That would seem to be an accurate statement and yet the article I linked to and the graph you posted seem to be in disagreement.
 
Honestly, if anything, your citation makes it obvious that the Current UK system was not built with the Age Demographical Shift considerations and that more funding needs to go into access and medical teaching schools because the Aging Population is relying more on the system than it has before, and what it's been constructed to deal with.

But you know, tomato, tamato.



What will be interesting is what actually happens to the health care costs, not the insurance premiums although that will also be interesting, to the actual costs.

There are various ways to use technology to reduce medical costs and to extend coverless to those that currently have trouble getting treated.

The insertion of the political monstrosity of the ACA is only going to hurt this and the primary reason is the politicians who needed to get paid off. They don't care a bit about you and me. If you thought that they did, I'm sorry that I may be bursting your bubble.

The simple insertion of the free birth control into this politically motivated and contrived system of bribes and paybacks says all that needs to be said.

With respect to the rabid free birth control control, if you can afford a tattoo or a pack of smokes or a couple beers, you can afford Birth Control Pills bought from the open market.

A good place to start would be to offer cafeteria plans like almost every carrier in the USA used to.

Attention Media: Walmart and Target Have Been Offering $9 Birth Control Since 2007 | NewsBusters

In all this fuss and distraction from the real problems this nation is facing, nobody noticed that since 2007 Walmart has been offering a month's worth of birth control pills for only $9 (emphasis added):

Read more: Attention Media: Walmart and Target Have Been Offering $9 Birth Control Since 2007 | NewsBusters
 
A good place to start the correction of the underfunding would be to increase the productivity by 8 times to the AVERAGE of the private sector.

The VA receives enough funding to care for patients. They waste enough to create a disaster.

The current cost per visit to a VA hospital as measured in 2008 was about $666. The vast majority of visits are not in-patient. of the 60 million visits, only 773,600 were in-patient. That is about 1% of the visits that actually required in patient care.

I need to be clear here that I am not begrudging any care to a veteran on any any level for any reason. I am only pointing out that this is about the worst efficiency in the world of medicine.

http://www.va.gov/opa/publications/factsheets/fs_department_of_veterans_affairs.pdf

(selected snipets):

VA's fiscal year 2009 spending is projected to be approximately $93.4 billion, including $40 billion for health care, $46.9 billion for benefits, and $230 million for the national cemetery system. This is more than a 7 percent increase from the department’s $87.6 billion budget for fiscal year 2009.

Almost 5.5 million people received care in VA health care facilities in 2008. By the end of fiscal year 2008, 78 percent of all disabled and low-income veterans had enrolled with VA for health care; 65 percent of them were treated by VA. In 2008, VA inpatient facilities treated 773,600 patients. VA’s outpatient clinics registered over 60 million visits.

While I find the VA needing reform immensely, I still hold that it in no way adduces toward the disprovement of the efficient administration of Universal Healthcare. The simple fact of the matter is that UHC has and is continuing to work, albeit with a lag to adjust for longer life times and associated increased in need for access and medical costs, and I don't see how one corrupt organization can act as a proper reason to put down all the systems.

"The VA was given responsibility not only for health care—which was extended to include outpatient and psychiatric services, substance abuse treatment, and care for non-service related illnesses—but also for all other veterans affairs. Additional legislation passed after World War II even contained measures such as unemployment compensation and educational allowances.

While the VA’s budget, payroll, and number of facilities expanded rapidly to become “by far the most extensive [medical program] in the country,” its standard of care stagnated, and complaints of inefficiency and negligence mounted. A 1949 commission “uncovered a staggering amount of waste,” a result of the highly political nature of the VA’s health care system."

Veteran's Administration: Case Study in Government Inefficiency - Patriot UpdatePatriot Update

KEVIN McCARTHY: Holding the VA accountable for a culture of inefficiency - Kevin McCarthy for Congress

"Veterans currently must wait until they have been denied benefits before they are allowed to pay an attorney to assist them. I assume this is because VA claims their system is non-adversarial, and there is a presumption that attorneys are taking advantage of veterans. Veterans are left to fend for themselves or to use a Veterans Service Organization. The VSOs are a wonderful resource, but they cannot do what an attorney, even a mediocre one, could do for the veteran. They represent way too many veterans to allow any real consideration of each individual claim."

The real causes of inefficiency in the VA claims process | Law Update | Veterans Claims Law - Attorney Shana Dunn
 
American Enterprise Institute - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

(The American, which you cited, is the online arm of the AEI. I think they have a certain bias.)

"Its stated mission is "to defend the principles and improve the institutions of American freedom and democratic capitalism—limited government, private enterprise, individual liberty and responsibility, vigilant and effective defense and foreign policies, political accountability, and open debate"."

"Some AEI scholars are considered to be some of the leading architects of the second Bush administration's public policy.[3] More than twenty AEI scholars and fellows served either in a Bush administration policy post or on one of the government's many panels and commissions. Among the prominent former government officials now affiliated with AEI are former U.S. ambassador to the U.N. John Bolton, now an AEI senior fellow; former chairman of the National Endowment for the Humanities Lynne Cheney, a longtime AEI senior fellow; former House Speaker Newt Gingrich,"

___

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/documents/american_journal_of_medicine_09.pdf

There is no bias. they looked at the data that was issued where you get your 65% number. those doctors took anyone that listed medical in their bankruptcy as the cause of their bankruptcy. if you would have read the second article most their medical expense was no more than 10% of their total debt.

i think it take what the department of justice says over 2 doctors pushing their political ideology.

way to not read the article and educate yourself though.
 
What will be interesting is what actually happens to the health care costs, not the insurance premiums although that will also be interesting, to the actual costs.
There are various ways to use technology to reduce medical costs and to extend coverless to those that currently have trouble getting treated.

The insertion of the political monstrosity of the ACA is only going to hurt this and the primary reason is the politicians who needed to get paid off. They don't care a bit about you and me. If you thought that they did, I'm sorry that I may be bursting your bubble.

-snip-

Bolded: In terms of UHC, it would go down by likely 40%, at the minimum per capita. In terms of ACA? No clue.

Underlined: I know they don't give a ****. Why do you think I'm a Socialist? Why do you think I believe in a Very, Very, Very Liberal interpretation of the 1st and more importantly 2nd Amendments? Because one day these Politicians will need to pay for their iniquities. I don't trust ACA, if we want an insurance system we should mirror the German model but otherwise I support UHC near unamiously.
 
There is no bias. they looked at the data that was issued where you get your 65% number. those doctors took anyone that listed medical in their bankruptcy as the cause of their bankruptcy. if you would have read the second article most their medical expense was no more than 10% of their total debt.

i think it take what the department of justice says over 2 doctors pushing their political ideology.

way to not read the article and educate yourself though.

Unbaised?

"According to a 2013 study by NerdWallet Health, unpaid medical bills are expected to be the No.1 cause of bankruptcy filings, surpassing both credit card and mortgage debt."

Medical Bankruptcies are Still a Problem, Here's What to Expect | Fox Business
 
Unbaised?

"According to a 2013 study by NerdWallet Health, unpaid medical bills are expected to be the No.1 cause of bankruptcy filings, surpassing both credit card and mortgage debt."

Medical Bankruptcies are Still a Problem, Here's What to Expect | Fox Business

read the links i posted it proves this wrong.

someone has 60k in credit cards and 5k in medical expense how is that a medical bankruptcy again i will believe what the independant researches have said.

go read the links i posted and educate yourself. this has been refuted time and time and time again, but the liberal myth still exists.

only 17% of bankruptcies are a result of actual medical expenses as the majority of the debt and this is only in homes whose income barely qualify as middle class.

out of about 1000 cases looked at by the DOJ medical debt was only about 10% of the overall debt owed.
 
read the links i posted it proves this wrong.

someone has 60k in credit cards and 5k in medical expense how is that a medical bankruptcy again i will believe what the independant researches have said.

go read the links i posted and educate yourself. this has been refuted time and time and time again, but the liberal myth still exists.

only 17% of bankruptcies are a result of actual medical expenses as the majority of the debt and this is only in homes whose income barely qualify as middle class.

I quoted a 2013 study, not the old 2007 Study.

But I'll give you this: My math *was* incorrect (or rather citations, I actually originally read 67% in a reader's digest while I was in the bathroom). Medical-caused bankruptcies are still FAR too high, no one should ever have to go into bankruptcy because they needed to seek medical care and bankruptcy is a drain on the economy at large. But, my math was wrong. It doesn't dilute the point much, but it does change the exact severity of the large issue. It does not in any way make it a small or even moderate issue, however.
 
I quoted a 2013 study, not the old 2007 Study.

But I'll give you this: My math *was* incorrect (or rather citations, I actually originally read 67% in a reader's digest while I was in the bathroom). Medical-caused bankruptcies are still FAR too high, no one should ever have to go into bankruptcy because they needed to seek medical care and bankruptcy is a drain on the economy at large. But, my math was wrong. It doesn't dilute the point much, but it does change the exact severity of the large issue. It does not in any way make it a small or even moderate issue, however.

17% of all bankruptcies are medical that would mean the other 83% are not medical that is not a majority or even most.

i don't call that a severity or a large issue.
 
17% of all bankruptcies are medical that would mean the other 83% are not medical that is not a majority or even most.

i don't call that a severity or a large issue.

Then we differ in opinion, but destroying the history of borrowers for 7 years because they needed to care of themselves seems amoral to me. But, that's an opinion (and economically if we could get rid of it, it would indeed be beneficial to be rid of most of the near 1/5ths of bankruptcies. Especially when they're unnecessary.)
 
Then we differ in opinion, but destroying the history of borrowers for 7 years because they needed to care of themselves seems amoral to me. But, that's an opinion (and economically if we could get rid of it, it would indeed be beneficial to be rid of most of the near 1/5ths of bankruptcies. Especially when they're unnecessary.)

so you think people shouldn't be responsible for their debts?
or what they owe?

i know that the majority of hospitals will setup payment plans and work with people in order to be paid because it costs more to not get paid.
 
so you think people shouldn't be responsible for their debts?
or what they owe?

i know that the majority of hospitals will setup payment plans and work with people in order to be paid because it costs more to not get paid.

Well, in actuality they just pass the cost of non-payers to people insured, which increases the cost of insurance premiums.

You know my opinion on the medical system.

When did I say "so you think people shouldn't be responsible for their debts?
or what they owe?"

Let's try and steer away from subreption, if you wouldn't mind.
 
While I find the VA needing reform immensely, I still hold that it in no way adduces toward the disprovement of the efficient administration of Universal Healthcare. The simple fact of the matter is that UHC has and is continuing to work, albeit with a lag to adjust for longer life times and associated increased in need for access and medical costs, and I don't see how one corrupt organization can act as a proper reason to put down all the systems.

"The VA was given responsibility not only for health care—which was extended to include outpatient and psychiatric services, substance abuse treatment, and care for non-service related illnesses—but also for all other veterans affairs. Additional legislation passed after World War II even contained measures such as unemployment compensation and educational allowances.

While the VA’s budget, payroll, and number of facilities expanded rapidly to become “by far the most extensive [medical program] in the country,” its standard of care stagnated, and complaints of inefficiency and negligence mounted. A 1949 commission “uncovered a staggering amount of waste,” a result of the highly political nature of the VA’s health care system."

Veteran's Administration: Case Study in Government Inefficiency - Patriot UpdatePatriot Update

KEVIN McCARTHY: Holding the VA accountable for a culture of inefficiency - Kevin McCarthy for Congress

"Veterans currently must wait until they have been denied benefits before they are allowed to pay an attorney to assist them. I assume this is because VA claims their system is non-adversarial, and there is a presumption that attorneys are taking advantage of veterans. Veterans are left to fend for themselves or to use a Veterans Service Organization. The VSOs are a wonderful resource, but they cannot do what an attorney, even a mediocre one, could do for the veteran. They represent way too many veterans to allow any real consideration of each individual claim."

The real causes of inefficiency in the VA claims process | Law Update | Veterans Claims Law - Attorney Shana Dunn



It seems that we are in agreement that the VA is poorly run, racked by corruption and providing problems to to many veterans.

I would prefer to see at least the hospital part of it shut down and give the veterans whatever they need in the way on insurance to get their care throughout the private sector.

Of this is going to be less helpful to them as Obamacare becomes the law of the land.

With all of the expertise demonstrated by the obama administration in every part of every effort they make, what could possibly go wrong?
 
Bolded: In terms of UHC, it would go down by likely 40%, at the minimum per capita. In terms of ACA? No clue.

Underlined: I know they don't give a ****. Why do you think I'm a Socialist? Why do you think I believe in a Very, Very, Very Liberal interpretation of the 1st and more importantly 2nd Amendments? Because one day these Politicians will need to pay for their iniquities. I don't trust ACA, if we want an insurance system we should mirror the German model but otherwise I support UHC near unamiously.




You don't trust government and you are a Socialist? Socialism demands government control of everything to assure that everything is in accord with the fairness they define.

Believing that the governing elite are corrupt and wanting them to have more power makes no sense to me.

If you don't trust government, you should be a Libertarian.

A very Liberal interpretation of the First Amendment allows for very wide interpretation of what it means. A very conservative interpretation allows only for exactly what it says. The four most beautiful words in the English language are: "Congress shall make no law…"

A very liberal interpretation would have us all gagged and in chains before noon tomorrow if Obama could get Holder organized enough to do it. Oh, and we'd also be forced to watch only those television shows that are approved. We'd see a lot of commentators that get a tickle up their leg when they think about Obama.
 
You don't trust government and you are a Socialist? Socialism demands government control of everything to assure that everything is in accord with the fairness they define.

Believing that the governing elite are corrupt and wanting them to have more power makes no sense to me.

If you don't trust government, you should be a Libertarian.

A very Liberal interpretation of the First Amendment allows for very wide interpretation of what it means. A very conservative interpretation allows only for exactly what it says. The four most beautiful words in the English language are: "Congress shall make no law…"

A very liberal interpretation would have us all gagged and in chains before noon tomorrow if Obama could get Holder organized enough to do it. Oh, and we'd also be forced to watch only those television shows that are approved. We'd see a lot of commentators that get a tickle up their leg when they think about Obama.

Bolded is wildly incorrect.

Second line: I want them to have more public goods managed by the public. I also want them to fear the "Proles' " guns to keep them on the "straight and narrow".

I think you need to look up the world liberal for my context, friend.

As for Holder. I hate him.
 
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