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Thread: College GOP chairman resigns, joining Democrats

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    Re: College GOP chairman resigns, joining Democrats

    Quote Originally Posted by mtm1963 View Post
    the guy seems naive. he is giving up and switching parties.
    I do not know if I would call it naive, but I agree with the giving up part. Stay and fight for what you believe in.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

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    Re: College GOP chairman resigns, joining Democrats

    Quote Originally Posted by Beaudreaux View Post
    Ummmm... No.

    Do some reading regarding Barry Goldwater, and you'll see why I said no. There's hardly anything that I believe in that even comes close to what the Democratic Party believes. From fiscal issues to social issues. Also, the difference between what I believe and what the right wing extremists believe is that I do not believe in hating anyone just because they're different than me, discriminating against anyone for any reason, or denying any other citizen of this country the exact same rights that I have under the Constitution. Additionally, unlike the extremist, I believe in the entire Constitution, not just the parts that agree with my opinion or position.:
    Those who you label as “extremists”, for the most part, do not believe in any of the things that you say you do not believe in. One has to wonder why you claim any allegiance to the Republican party, when you resort to such ridiculous and obviously-false Democrat-created stereotypes of those who actually stand for Republican values.

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    Re: College GOP chairman resigns, joining Democrats

    Quote Originally Posted by Beaudreaux View Post
    Amen.

    As I read more and more about Goldwater, I find that my opinions and feelings about issues is nothing new at all - that Goldwater got there a long time before I did. In fact, it was about ~25 years ago, at a local Republican party meeting, that when I gave my opinions about a number of issues (many of which were in contrast to the others there), that one of the men in the meeting asked if my name was Barry Goldwater. I knew who Goldwater was of course, but had not really read anything about him, until after that night.

    We sure need another Goldwater to rise up within the party, and quickly.
    A fiscal conservative and a social liberal. At least that is how one would look at Barry today. I have heard quite a few of today's conservatives say Barry wasn't a conservative at all, he was a Libertarian. To that I say he was a traditional conservative vs. today's neo-conservatives.
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

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    Re: College GOP chairman resigns, joining Democrats

    I can see the headlines now:

    "College Student Changes Mind"

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    Re: College GOP chairman resigns, joining Democrats

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    A sign of the times. The extremist elements in the GOP are driving some of the mainstream members away. So much for the big tent The Republican Party used to have.

    Article is here.
    Extremist elements? When did standing for the rule of law, constitutional first principles, fiscal responsibility and personal responsibility make a person an extremist?

    This is getting old. So this yahoo in Mississippi has decided to changed his affiliation. Big whoop! If he can't muster up the basics of the Republican party he should have done it a long time ago.

    Mississippi has a lot of problems of corruption brought to light over their latest run off election between two Republican candidates. Cochran is a big government guy known to bring home the bacon. McDaniels, a former state senator ran on a platform that is akin to what Republicans claim they believe such as fiscal responsibility, stopping corporatism from replacing capitalism, a smaller federal government, lower taxation and demanding amnesty laws already on the books be honored. The elites in the Republican party who often compromise those principles may be in for a world of hurt as the scandal of paying for Democrats to vote for Cochran unfolds.

    Glad to see this young chap change his party affiliation to Democrat. At least then he can be honest with himself of what he believes. Why have two parties when so many are willing to compromise their core beliefs?

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    Re: College GOP chairman resigns, joining Democrats

    Quote Originally Posted by Perotista View Post
    A fiscal conservative and a social liberal. At least that is how one would look at Barry today. I have heard quite a few of today's conservatives say Barry wasn't a conservative at all, he was a Libertarian. To that I say he was a traditional conservative vs. today's neo-conservatives.
    HE was a fiscal conservative, and by today's GOP standard, would be called a social liberal. However, he wasn't socially liberal, but rather a social pragmatist. And as for Libertarian, in certain ways, yes, but not the way Libertarians today define that term. He was a strict Constitutionalist, which could be mistaken for a Libertarian today. He was also for lessening the Federal governments impact on Americans. He once said:
    I have little interest in streamlining government or in making it more efficient, for I mean to reduce its size. I do not undertake to promote welfare, for I propose to extend freedom. My aim is not to pass laws, but to repeal them. It is not to inaugurate new programs, but to cancel old ones that do violence to the Constitution, or that have failed their purpose, or that impose on the people an unwarranted financial burden. I will not attempt to discover whether legislation is "needed" before I have first determined whether it is constitutionally permissible. And if I should later be attacked for neglecting my constituents' "interests," I shall reply that I was informed that their main interest is liberty and that in that cause I am doing the very best I can.

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    Re: College GOP chairman resigns, joining Democrats

    From reading the transcript of Alvarez's letter, it seems that his loss in what amounted to a sort of power struggle precipitated things. He accuses the individual of breaking rules, but appeared unwilling to accept that the impeachment process had its own rules and that the desired outcome was not attainable within that framework. Justice requires respect for principles and process.

    Moreover, even as the Tea Party was dealt a defeat in the Senate runoff vote and in most of the contested primaries nationwide, he chose to abandon the GOP at a time when the mainstream Party has begun to roll back the Tea Party's influence. Capitulation in the face of a Tea Party defeat amounts to pretty odd timing. Hence, the power struggle seems the more likely explanation for his resignation and announced departure from the GOP.

    Clearly, there are issues and economic conservatives, for instance, need not be cowed by those who claim conservatism demands an anti-immigrant position (something Alvarez complained about). Instead, economic conservatives can point to Reagan conservatism--a successful model that grew the conservative movement--and argue that conservatism does not require a rejection of balanced solutions that secure the border and treat undocumented immigrants in a humane fashion. Reagan carried out Reagan conservatism in office. Pretenders to the Reagan throne so to speak i.e., talk show hosts such as Hannity or Levin, do not have greater authority to speak for Reagan conservatism than the late President did through his speeches and decisions. That willingness to fight for principle, in my opinion, would have been the more courageous course.

    Nevertheless, it appears that Alvarez has made an impulsive choice, almost certainly on account of losing his power struggle of sorts, not only to leave the GOP but join the Democrats. That outcome suggests either his GOP affiliation was never strong to begin with (he could have switched to independent for example) or is too insecure for a leadership position to the extent that outcomes that cut against him (something most leaders face at one time or another) easily break him. The latter seems to be the more likely scenario given the Tea Party's recent string of defeats.

    Anyway, that's my read on the situation.

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    Re: College GOP chairman resigns, joining Democrats

    Quote Originally Posted by Beaudreaux View Post
    HE was a fiscal conservative, and by today's GOP standard, would be called a social liberal. However, he wasn't socially liberal, but rather a social pragmatist. And as for Libertarian, in certain ways, yes, but not the way Libertarians today define that term. He was a strict Constitutionalist, which could be mistaken for a Libertarian today. He was also for lessening the Federal governments impact on Americans. He once said:
    That is exactly the Barry I campaigned for and voted for.
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

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    Re: College GOP chairman resigns, joining Democrats

    Quote Originally Posted by donsutherland1 View Post
    From reading the transcript of Alvarez's letter, it seems that his loss in what amounted to a sort of power struggle precipitated things. He accuses the individual of breaking rules, but appeared unwilling to accept that the impeachment process had its own rules and that the desired outcome was not attainable within that framework. Justice requires respect for principles and process.

    Moreover, even as the Tea Party was dealt a defeat in the Senate runoff vote and in most of the contested primaries nationwide, he chose to abandon the GOP at a time when the mainstream Party has begun to roll back the Tea Party's influence. Capitulation in the face of a Tea Party defeat amounts to pretty odd timing. Hence, the power struggle seems the more likely explanation for his resignation and announced departure from the GOP.

    Clearly, there are issues and economic conservatives, for instance, need not be cowed by those who claim conservatism demands an anti-immigrant position (something Alvarez complained about). Instead, economic conservatives can point to Reagan conservatism--a successful model that grew the conservative movement--and argue that conservatism does not require a rejection of balanced solutions that secure the border and treat undocumented immigrants in a humane fashion. Reagan carried out Reagan conservatism in office. Pretenders to the Reagan throne so to speak i.e., talk show hosts such as Hannity or Levin, do not have greater authority to speak for Reagan conservatism than the late President did through his speeches and decisions. That willingness to fight for principle, in my opinion, would have been the more courageous course.

    Nevertheless, it appears that Alvarez has made an impulsive choice, almost certainly on account of losing his power struggle of sorts, not only to leave the GOP but join the Democrats. That outcome suggests either his GOP affiliation was never strong to begin with (he could have switched to independent for example) or is too insecure for a leadership position to the extent that outcomes that cut against him (something most leaders face at one time or another) easily break him. The latter seems to be the more likely scenario given the Tea Party's recent string of defeats.

    Anyway, that's my read on the situation.
    I tend to agree that the decision may have been impulsive and that his affiliation may not have been strong. College is a time of discovery, experimentation, and growth, and while students may be very mature in some ways, for example, academically, they aren't yet fully grown. Switching parties because you're butt-hurt doesn't demonstrate what I'd call "maturity."

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    Re: College GOP chairman resigns, joining Democrats

    Quote Originally Posted by Perotista View Post
    My first presidential vote went to Barry Goldwater back in 1964. The third tenet of a traditional conservative is: Small Government - Keeping government out of a citizens private business and lives. Barry, the supposedly father of modern day conservatism also was in favor of keeping government out of abortion, it is strictly up to the woman. Also, back then gay marriage wasn't even thought of, but gays in the military was. Barry was quoted either back in 1963 or 64, "You do not have to be straight to shoot straight."

    Goldwater is sort of a political mentor to me.
    Goldwater was also a staunch conservationist who believed that God made man a steward of the earth, and we must take care of it. Today he would be called an "Evul Leebral" by some, because of that belief.
    Last edited by danarhea; 07-03-14 at 03:16 PM.
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