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Thread: Supreme Court backs Hobby Lobby in contraceptive mandate challenge[W:513,870]

  1. #471
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    Re: Supreme Court backs Hobby Lobby in contraceptive mandate challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by zgoldsmith23 View Post
    It gives someone / something with religion the decision-making power over those who might be a follower of a different religion or even someone who is non-religious. Sure, HL can practice their beliefs, no one is forcing them to take BC (last I checked ). But, how is it in their right to tell someone else they cannot because it will not be paid for?
    People can still go out and purchase their contraceptives with their own money. The general idea here is that people are equal in their rights. If I as your employer have some religious objection to abortion, it is perfectly within my right to not provide coverage that includes abortion. It is perfectly within your right to work elsewhere if this imposes some burden upon you.

    The simple truth here is that democrats injected this poison into the legislation for purely political reasons. Contraceptives are cheap and easily accessable to everyone. There is no reason whatsoever to make them part of health insurance.

  2. #472
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    Re: Supreme Court backs Hobby Lobby in contraceptive mandate challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    But they never said someone can't take birth control, so I'm not sure what that means.
    It means what it says. It gives the religious (in this case, HL) the control over someone else who may / may not share that belief. This doesn't appear to be a victory for religious freedom, but a blow to it.
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  3. #473
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    Re: Supreme Court backs Hobby Lobby in contraceptive mandate challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by zgoldsmith23 View Post
    It means what it says. It gives the religious (in this case, HL) the control over someone else who may / may not share that belief. This doesn't appear to be a victory for religious freedom, but a blow to it.
    It means what it said? But the problem is, what you said never happened. Hobby Lobby never told anyone that he/she couldn't take or use birth control.

  4. #474
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    Re: Supreme Court backs Hobby Lobby in contraceptive mandate challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
    People can still go out and purchase their contraceptives with their own money. The general idea here is that people are equal in their rights. If I as your employer have some religious objection to abortion, it is perfectly within my right to not provide coverage that includes abortion. It is perfectly within your right to work elsewhere if this imposes some burden upon you.

    The simple truth here is that democrats injected this poison into the legislation for purely political reasons. Contraceptives are cheap and easily accessable to everyone. There is no reason whatsoever to make them part of health insurance.
    Sure it does. IIRC, BC costs about $10+ less per month with insurance (at least). Of course, to get these you have to have exams and undergo a check. This isn't free, either. That is where insurance comes in. Again, how's this equal rights? I don't see how that's in your right. It's my medical insurance. Maybe include paying a bit more? But to deny me access to a medical procedure / prescription seems asinine. And yes, working elsewhere is perfectly viable for someone who is looking for a job or just started. But if I have seniority at this job, then that's a different story, too - at least, IMO.

    Some contraceptives are while others are not quite as easy.
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    Re: Supreme Court backs Hobby Lobby in contraceptive mandate challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by jimbo View Post
    So, should the SC have ruled by using precedent, or should they have ruled setting precedent? If the former, then what precedent? If, as you contend, they made a one time biased ruling which sets precedent, please explain.
    You are supposed to rule on precedent if there is a similar case you can refer to. I don't have one that I can put out there. So, if there isn't one then you basically create a precedent for future cases to refer to. This isn't a bad thing... it does happen sometimes when there isn't a precedent to refer to. The one off that they did was to say that this only applies to this specific religion in this specific way. To say that basically created a precedent for future cases to not need precedent any more.

    Apparently they were presented with a slippery slope argument and they basically did away with it by saying, this law only applies to this case where the religion of this size company and smaller can use their executive's religion as an excuse not to provide this part of an existing law... BUT it cannot apply to another religion who wants exemption (like Jehovah's Witnesses) to opt out of health care coverage because of their opposition to blood transfusions.

    Because this ruling does not apply across the board then it backs a specific religion's specific issue and therefore this ruling is making a law respecting an establishment of religion.

    1st Amendment...
    Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion

    I guess it doesn't matter when it's the scotus making the law.
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  6. #476
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    Re: Supreme Court backs Hobby Lobby in contraceptive mandate challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    It means what it said? But the problem is, what you said never happened. Hobby Lobby never told anyone that he/she couldn't take or use birth control.
    It will not be paid for / covered under insurance.
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    Re: Supreme Court backs Hobby Lobby in contraceptive mandate challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
    People can still go out and purchase their contraceptives with their own money. The general idea here is that people are equal in their rights. If I as your employer have some religious objection to abortion, it is perfectly within my right to not provide coverage that includes abortion. It is perfectly within your right to work elsewhere if this imposes some burden upon you.
    As an employer you're bound by all kinds of laws that apply to employment and benefits and insurance.

    The simple truth here is that democrats injected this poison into the legislation for purely political reasons. Contraceptives are cheap and easily accessable to everyone. There is no reason whatsoever to make them part of health insurance.[/QUOTE]

    The medical community and data contradict your baseless assertions, but that shouldn't be a barrier to making them I suppose.

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    Re: Supreme Court backs Hobby Lobby in contraceptive mandate challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by zgoldsmith23 View Post
    It will not be paid for / covered under insurance.
    That isn't the same thing as telling someone they can't use birth control.

    Birth control isn't an entitlement, and it isn't something that an employer should be obligated to offer - the ACA notwithstanding.

    The HL employees will still have covered birth control.

    There is no infringement on them. If the 16 covered forms aren't good enough, they can pay for them themselves. If they can't stand the idea of insurance not covering them, then they don't belong in a company like Hobby Lobby and would be wise to move on.

    Not paying for something in no way is the same thing as denying someone something.

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    Re: Supreme Court backs Hobby Lobby in contraceptive mandate challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    Sadly, this decision will probably result in an increase in abortions. Good job Christian lobby group!
    Maybe its time to make abortion illegal. In fact I would take it a step further and make abortion felony murder.
    When America is strong the world is calm, When America is weak tyrants and terrorist slaughter the meek. ~ SgtRock

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    Re: Supreme Court backs Hobby Lobby in contraceptive mandate challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    As an employer you're bound by all kinds of laws that apply to employment and benefits and insurance.

    The simple truth here is that democrats injected this poison into the legislation for purely political reasons. Contraceptives are cheap and easily accessable to everyone. There is no reason whatsoever to make them part of health insurance.
    The medical community and data contradict your baseless assertions, but that shouldn't be a barrier to making them I suppose.[/QUOTE]

    I'm curious - what "baseless assertion" did he make?

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