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Thread: Supreme Court backs Hobby Lobby in contraceptive mandate challenge[W:513,870]

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    Re: Supreme Court backs Hobby Lobby in contraceptive mandate challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    I also loathe organized religions.

    But the owners of this company have religious beliefs that are protected by the Constitution, and since SCOTUS is tasked with upholding the Constitution, they made the right decision here. The owners of HL shouldn't be forced to give up their religious beliefs because of government any more than government should be forced to hold and/or agree with their religious beliefs.

    How does this influence your children?
    If common sense prevailed one would realize this doesn't effect anything. A woman can still go buy any birth control they want, this ruling does not stop that. Almost all companies except for a very few companies run by a religious family which can opt out of the contraceptives will provide them in their health insurance plans. I heard on the news today that what a lot of the religious companies were doing prior to the ACA was allowing the employee to buy a rider to their existing health insurance plan to cover contraceptives. The idea with the rider is the religious company owners didn't have to pay for something that was against their religion, but the employee could if they so elected by means of a rider.
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

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    Re: Supreme Court backs Hobby Lobby in contraceptive mandate challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    Any woman who works at Hobby Lobby became a second class citizen who's legal right to free contraception was taken away. Those pills are not only to prevent pregnancy either.
    First off, there is no legal right to free contraception. There is no such thing as "free contraception" anyway (the insurance costs are shared by the employer and employee). Last, Hobby Lobby's insurance plans offer 16 forms of contraception.

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    Re: Supreme Court backs Hobby Lobby in contraceptive mandate challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    That would be pretty cool. The STFU part. But let's not let the facts get in the way. When you say "You guys", I'll assume you are referring to me as one of those who oppose this move. And yes I do. I loathe organized religion. I loathe the idea that your delusional beliefs in a book of fairy tales is influencing my life or that of my children. And as to the other religions, keep them the **** out of my government.
    get your peanut butter out of my chocolate

    no , you get your chocolate out of my peanut butter

    for those few business owners that this will affect, it is now your choice

    it is also the choice of your employees, on whether to stay or leave

    i like the decision....i realize a lot of you dont

    whether you like it or not, this country was founded on the principal of religious freesom

    that is all this ruling is allowing....a closely held company (family owned) can make "some" choices regarding the healthcare of their employees based upon their religious beliefs

    the employees are still free to do whatever they want or like....they just cant force the business to pay for it any longer

    i dont see anything wrong with the decision

    it is narrow enough that the numbers of people affected will be small, and the market will let the companies that make these decisions whether or not they agree with their choice
    “Most of the shadows of this life are caused by standing in one's own sunshine.”

    Ralph Waldo Emerson

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    Re: Supreme Court backs Hobby Lobby in contraceptive mandate challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    Any woman who works at Hobby Lobby became a second class citizen who's legal right to free contraception was taken away. Those pills are not only to prevent pregnancy either.
    Anyone that works at a closely-held private corporation will not be able to get 4 of 18 contraception drugs for free because that requirement violated the RLFA.

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    Re: Supreme Court backs Hobby Lobby in contraceptive mandate challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    Any woman who works at Hobby Lobby became a second class citizen who's legal right to free contraception was taken away. Those pills are not only to prevent pregnancy either.
    Exactly where in the Constitution is the right to "free contraception" mentioned?

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    Re: Supreme Court backs Hobby Lobby in contraceptive mandate challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    I have two daughters, one is 17, the other 21. Depends on where they move to. Right now it won't since they both reside in good sized cities that will provide them options. But the future for them is obviously an unknown.

    There are two things that piss me off about this. Limiting distribution of vital medical help. And the very idea that religion is impacting someone's ability to access what they need.

    I disagree with the ruling. The religious folks are inflicting their values on others. They don't have to buy what they are selling. But if they choose to be in the business, then they should have to.
    It only impacts their employees, it only impacts their employees who purchase insurance through Hobby Lobby, the employees still get 16 forms of contraception provided for them in the plan, and in a free market, people choose who they work for. I have kids too but I'm struggling to see how this decision would impact them in any way.

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    Re: Supreme Court backs Hobby Lobby in contraceptive mandate challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    Do you understand what this case was about? It appears not from all of your posts.

    Whose health is in jeopardy?

    I don't know what the contraception=abortion bandwagon is.
    There's a lot you don't know. Like these health conditions that are treated with birth control pills. Pills that Hobby Lobby are now free to refuse to provide.

    Polycystic Ovary Syndrome (PCOS): is a hormonal imbalance which causes irregular menstrual periods, acne, and excess hair growth. Birth control pills work by lowering certain hormone levels to regulate menstrual periods. When hormone levels are decreased to normal, acne and hair growth often improve.

    Endometriosis: Most girls with endometriosis have cramps or pelvic pain during their menstrual cycle. Birth control pills are often prescribed continuously to treat endometriosis and work by temporarily preventing periods. Since periods can cause pain for young women with endometriosis, stopping periods will usually improve cramps and pelvic pain.
    Lack of periods (“amenorrhea”) from low weight, stress, excessive exercise, or damage to the ovaries from radiation or chemotherapy: With any of these conditions, the hormone “estrogen” is not made in normal amounts by the body. Birth control pills may be prescribed to replace estrogen, which helps to regulate the menstrual cycle. For girls whose menstrual periods are irregular (too few - or not at all), birth control pills can help to regulate the menstrual cycle to every 28 days and provide the body with normal amounts of estrogen. Normal estrogen levels are important for healthy bones.
    Menstrual Cramps: When over-the-counter medications don't help with severe cramps, birth control pills may be the solution because they prevent ovulation and lighten periods.
    Premenstrual Syndrome (PMS): Symptoms of PMS such as mood swings, breast soreness, and bloating, along with acne can occur up to 2 weeks before a young women's period. Birth control pills may be prescribed to stop ovulation and keep hormone levels balanced. Symptoms may improve, particularly when oral contraceptive pills are prescribed continuously.
    Heavy Menstrual Periods: Birth control pills can reduce the amount and length of menstrual bleeding.
    Acne: For moderate to severe acne, which over-the-counter and prescription medications haven't cured, birth control pills may be prescribed. The hormones in the Pill can help stop acne from forming. Be patient though, since it takes several months for birth control pills to work.

    Other Medical Benefits

    Because there is less menstrual bleeding when taking birth control pills, you are less likely to get anemia (low number of red blood cells, which carry oxygen from the lungs to the tissues). Birth control pills also lower your chance of getting endometrial (lining of the uterus) cancer, ovarian cancer, and ovarian cysts.
    Read more: Medical Uses of the Birth Control Pill

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    Re: Supreme Court backs Hobby Lobby in contraceptive mandate challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    I have two daughters, one is 17, the other 21. Depends on where they move to. Right now it won't since they both reside in good sized cities that will provide them options. But the future for them is obviously an unknown.

    There are two things that piss me off about this. Limiting distribution of vital medical help. And the very idea that religion is impacting someone's ability to access what they need.

    I disagree with the ruling. The religious folks are inflicting their values on others. They don't have to buy what they are selling. But if they choose to be in the business, then they should have to.
    you have no idea what this ruling means. this ruling does not affect your daughters in any way shape or form. no more than mine.

    HL actually does provide contraception and b/c they objected to having to supply plan b and other drugs that would stop attachment after conception took place.

    1. this only affect privately owned businesses or corporations. publicly traded companies such as walmart, etc ... are not affected by this.
    2. it only affects contraception.

    so unless your daughters to go work for a catholic organization or something they won't have issues getting birth control.

    actually it doesn't. no way does this ruling stop people from getting birth control. it just says that the government can't mandate companies provide it.
    constitution protects religious beliefs and practices that is what the court upheld.

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    Re: Supreme Court backs Hobby Lobby in contraceptive mandate challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by DB20 View Post
    Exactly where in the Constitution is the right to "free contraception" mentioned?
    It is a Federal law.

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    Re: Supreme Court backs Hobby Lobby in contraceptive mandate challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    Your arguments don't address the point. It has nothing to do with responsible v. irresponsible or what people did in the past. I agree that people should have responsibility for their choices and behavior. However, it does not change the bottom line that limiting access to contraceptives will result in an increase in unwanted pregnancies....that is just stating the obvious. While you and I may not like it....this will in turn lead to increased numbers of abortions. That is just the reality.
    I am pretty dang sure that Hobby Lobby not wanting to condone four contraceptives they consider objectionable will have zero effect on unwanted pregnancies. They are limiting nobody's access to anything. They are simply saying they aren't willing to pay for something they consider immoral and the Supreme Court agreed that such was their right. Anybody who wants those four contraceptives has just as much access to them as before, but they'll have to find somebody else to pay for them or - my god what a nightmare!!!! gasp!!!! - they might have to give up a pack of cigarettes or something and pay for them themselves.

    Just because the government does not pay for something or does not require somebody in the private sector to pay for something does not limit access to anything.
    "I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it." --Benjamin Franklin 1776

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