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Thread: Supreme Court Strikes Down Abortion Clinic Buffer Zones

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    Re: Supreme Court Strikes Down Abortion Clinic Buffer Zones

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    An amusing action, if pointless if intended to be a protest to the PP clinic, since pro-choice people have absolutely zilch against both.
    Oh, I never, never thought it was pointless. And the clinic did shut down, but not before a worldwide organization was created and also the "40 Days for Life" campaign.

    But I should add here that I don't have any problem with a physical barrier such as a fence. There was a wrought iron one (and shrubs) at the PP clinic of which I speak, and it was both practical and attractive.

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    Re: Supreme Court Strikes Down Abortion Clinic Buffer Zones

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    Oh, yes it is.

    If I stand outside a health club and call every over-weight person who walks in a fatso, that's harassment. If they're on public property? Perhaps they could be arrested for being a public nuisance. I don't know the nuances of the law, but I do know that the fact we HAVE freedom of speech, the spoken word is responsible for an awful lot of harassment -- and most of it isn't illegal.
    By your reasoning, just having laws against harassment automatically infringes on free speech.

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    Re: Supreme Court Strikes Down Abortion Clinic Buffer Zones

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    Cardinal, you're holding the ball. You used the term. You define it.
    I asked you what harassment was.

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    Re: Supreme Court Strikes Down Abortion Clinic Buffer Zones

    Quote Originally Posted by nota bene View Post
    Oh, I never, never thought it was pointless. And the clinic did shut down, but not before a worldwide organization was created and also the "40 Days for Life" campaign.

    But I should add here that I don't have any problem with a physical barrier such as a fence. There was a wrought iron one (and shrubs) at the PP clinic of which I speak, and it was both practical and attractive.
    You're not being clear on what it was that eventually shut the clinic down (you're talking about the PP clinic, right?).

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    Re: Supreme Court Strikes Down Abortion Clinic Buffer Zones

    Quote Originally Posted by nota bene View Post
    Good. You tell that to all the places such as Walmart that allow folks to sit outside and sell flag pins and Girl Scout cookies and whatever. Seeing them annoys me and forces me face being engaged and having to ignore them or say no thanks.
    I don't know what conversation that's supposed to address, but it's absolutely not this one.

    Quote Originally Posted by nota bene View Post
    More seriously, I participated for 15 years--until the closing of this PP clinic, in fact--in silent protest against the abortions being performed there. In all those years, I never said one word, just stood on the sidewalk and prayed. Except for the occasional "sidewalk counselor," I never heard anybody say anything. People would pull into the parking lot, a waiting escort would walk to the car and escort the lady into the building, and that was that.

    No abuse, no rancor, just people standing and praying...and exercising their rights of freedom of assembly and speech.
    While you get some kudos for living up to a higher standard of civility, I suppose, the object of that protest was to target and discomfort other private citizens. It's no less harassment than if a crowd of people sat in silent protest outside my house because I have an ugly face.

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    Re: Supreme Court Strikes Down Abortion Clinic Buffer Zones

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    By your reasoning, just having laws against harassment automatically infringes on free speech.
    You don't understand criminal harassment laws. My understanding, which may or may not be correct, is that criminal harassment requires an ongoing pattern. Just calling someone an asshole doesn't rise to the level of criminal harassment (or civil, for that matter). Having a heated argument with someone does not rise to either level. Nor does name-calling. Neither does calling someone a baby killer. (Ouch, see how that hurts?) Here's more:

    Generally, criminal harassment entails intentionally targeting someone else with behavior that is meant to alarm, annoy, torment or terrorize them. Not all petty annoyances constitute harassment. Instead, most state laws require that the behavior cause a credible threat to the person's safety or their family's safety. - See more at: Harassment - FindLaw

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    Re: Supreme Court Strikes Down Abortion Clinic Buffer Zones

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    You're not being clear on what it was that eventually shut the clinic down (you're talking about the PP clinic, right?).
    No one asked me what caused the clinic shutdown. It was refusal to upgrade the facilities in accordance with the law.

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    Re: Supreme Court Strikes Down Abortion Clinic Buffer Zones

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    You don't understand criminal harassment laws. My understanding, which may or may not be correct, is that criminal harassment requires an ongoing pattern. Just calling someone an asshole doesn't rise to the level of criminal harassment (or civil, for that matter). Having a heated argument with someone does not rise to either level. Nor does name-calling. Neither does calling someone a baby killer. (Ouch, see how that hurts?) Here's more:
    (bold mine).

    Right! A heated argument or an isolated name calling would not in fact live up to harassment, but targeted, ongoing protests against private citizens would.

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    Re: Supreme Court Strikes Down Abortion Clinic Buffer Zones

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    I asked you what harassment was.
    Look at your conduct with me in these several posts. That's harassment.

    May I have you arrested? Sue you in civil court? Got a druthers?

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    Re: Supreme Court Strikes Down Abortion Clinic Buffer Zones

    Quote Originally Posted by nota bene View Post
    No one asked me what caused the clinic shutdown. It was refusal to upgrade the facilities in accordance with the law.
    Oh...kayyyyyy. I have no idea why you brought that adoption, pre-natal care clinic comment into it, then.

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