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Thread: Boehner plans to file suit against Obama over alleged abuse of executive power

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    Re: Boehner plans to file suit against Obama over alleged abuse of executive power

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Oh please, their were/are plenty of people who said Bush issued executive orders "believed to be unconstitutional".
    Yep. There were definitly questionable executive action taken under Bush. The entire policy of the administration as it relates to renditions was one such example of an action, not an order, that would apply.

    Suggesting Bush didn't do questionable things is a poor argument imho. However, equally poor is suggesting that somehow Obama's transgressions should be ignored, allowed, or not called out simply because Bush did it. EVEN if someone wants to harp on Republicans being hypocritical (while ignoring the inverse hypocracy of the outcry by many Democrats for 8 years under Bush for this kind of thing and large silence under Obama), it still doesn't change whether or not their arguments against what Obama is doing are legitimate or not.

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    Re: Boehner plans to file suit against Obama over alleged abuse of executive power

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    And again this mantra "what about the Bush administration" and yet not a single example of a Bush executive order that was believed to be unconstitutional. I can't say there weren't any, for surety, but you'd think that the guys pumping this meme would be able to give at least one example.
    The real big problem here, and the reason why Obama's on steroids with this is because partisans never hold their OWN accountable when they break the law. So, expect more of the same.

    NEWS
    Reagan to Use Executive Orders to Bypass Congress
    August 21, 1987 | JACK NELSON, Times Washington Bureau Chief
    With 17 months of his presidency remaining, Ronald Reagan will bank on executive orders and judicial action to implement social policies that he cannot persuade Congress to enact, Gary L. Bauer, the President's chief domestic policy adviser, declared Thursday.

    http://articles.latimes.com/keyword/executive-orders
    Last edited by Montecresto; 06-26-14 at 04:16 PM.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Boehner plans to file suit against Obama over alleged abuse of executive power

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    I have no trouble with the courts doing so. I have trouble with selective exaggeration. The courts ruled on Obama concern appointments, and I am fine with that.
    Then we're in agreement - all is good. I believe our discussion started with the chart posted by Amadeus and the relevance, but we got down to the gist of the matter where agreement could be found. Now, if you could get your government to work things out as smoothly, all would be good.
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." William F. Buckley Jr.

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    Re: Boehner plans to file suit against Obama over alleged abuse of executive power

    Quote Originally Posted by NIMBY View Post
    You military guys call this a preemptive strike.
    Btw, I like this new Press Secretary.
    They don't have a very long shelf-life do they?


    The real moment of truth will come if Boehner ever breaks the Hastert rule again--such as not defaulting on our debt.
    Did you see that Sen. Baker died--good man .
    No, I didn't know Baker died. I really do not like the Hastert rule, it smacks too much of the senate. If Sam Rayburn, Mike McCormick and the rest didn't need it, neither does any Speaker today. In my mind, the Speaker is not the majority leader of any party, his job is to be the Speaker for the whole house with includes both parties and even third parties if any can get elected today.
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

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    Re: Boehner plans to file suit against Obama over alleged abuse of executive power

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    Yep. There were definitly questionable executive action taken under Bush. The entire policy of the administration as it relates to renditions was one such example of an action, not an order, that would apply.

    Suggesting Bush didn't do questionable things is a poor argument imho. However, equally poor is suggesting that somehow Obama's transgressions should be ignored, allowed, or not called out simply because Bush did it. EVEN if someone wants to harp on Republicans being hypocritical (while ignoring the inverse hypocracy of the outcry by many Democrats for 8 years under Bush for this kind of thing and large silence under Obama), it still doesn't change whether or not their arguments against what Obama is doing are legitimate or not.
    Don't include me in the group that thinks Obama's unconstitutional actions should be ignored. I think they need to bust his chops and any future president that tries to do the same, whether a republican or a democrat!!
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Boehner plans to file suit against Obama over alleged abuse of executive power

    Quote Originally Posted by BMCM View Post
    Not sure of the Canadian law but here you have to have standing and prove you were harmed in some way. This is nothing more then a political stunt to feed the sheep.

    Why Boehner Can

    But Boehner may not be able to do so. According to Erwin Chemerinsky, the dean of the University of California, Irvine Law School, the speaker of the House does not have the ability to sue the president in this situation, even if Congress says he does. Chemerinsky says “standing,” the doctrine that allows a person to file a lawsuit in federal court by demonstrating that real harm has been caused to them, is defined by the Constitution. As a result, even if Congress passes a law, or in this case a resolution, which only requires approval by the House, it will not be binding on federal courts, as the Constitution trumps any law, let alone a resolution, and does not give members of Congress the ability to sue if they cannot prove real harm.
    I don't disagree in principle - here in Canada we have similar need to show damage in order to sue. But we're talking here about governmental authority and constitutionality. In Canada, our government frequently sends issues to our Supreme Court to rule on the constitutionality prior to legislation or action being taken. It's a far less adversarial system when it comes to constitutional issues. When the public sues, however, it's a matter of showing how the government action has harmed or affected them.

    Perhaps it's just a matter of a different culture - you could say we like to get permission before we act where as Americans like to act before they get permission, following the old principle that "it's easier to seek forgiveness than to seek approval".
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." William F. Buckley Jr.

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    Re: Boehner plans to file suit against Obama over alleged abuse of executive power

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    The real big problem here, and the reason why Obama's on steroids with this is because partisans never hold their OWN accountable when they break the law. So, expect more of the same.

    NEWS
    Reagan to Use Executive Orders to Bypass Congress
    August 21, 1987 | JACK NELSON, Times Washington Bureau Chief
    With 17 months of his presidency remaining, Ronald Reagan will bank on executive orders and judicial action to implement social policies that he cannot persuade Congress to enact, Gary L. Bauer, the President's chief domestic policy adviser, declared Thursday.

    Articles about Executive Orders - Los Angeles Times
    I don't think we disagree here - as I stated with Boo - my comments originally came out of a challenge to the Amadeus chart which simply showed quantity of executive orders as if that was the relevant issue. All Presidents, particularly in this past century, try to push the bounds of their authority and congress or groups of citizens take them to task through lawsuits. It's how the system's supposed to work and I see nothing wrong with it.
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." William F. Buckley Jr.

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    Re: Boehner plans to file suit against Obama over alleged abuse of executive power

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    Then we're in agreement - all is good. I believe our discussion started with the chart posted by Amadeus and the relevance, but we got down to the gist of the matter where agreement could be found. Now, if you could get your government to work things out as smoothly, all would be good.
    And I'd bottle that and become a trillionare.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Boehner plans to file suit against Obama over alleged abuse of executive power

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    I don't disagree in principle - here in Canada we have similar need to show damage in order to sue. But we're talking here about governmental authority and constitutionality. In Canada, our government frequently sends issues to our Supreme Court to rule on the constitutionality prior to legislation or action being taken. It's a far less adversarial system when it comes to constitutional issues. When the public sues, however, it's a matter of showing how the government action has harmed or affected them.

    Perhaps it's just a matter of a different culture - you could say we like to get permission before we act where as Americans like to act before they get permission, following the old principle that "it's easier to seek forgiveness than to seek approval".
    Sounds like your Supreme Court has more power then your Government does.
    If the GOP does file this law suit without "Standing" then it will most likely be viewed as nothing more then a political disagreement and the courts won't waste their time with it.
    I confess, I did it, I let the dogs out.

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    Re: Boehner plans to file suit against Obama over alleged abuse of executive power

    Quote Originally Posted by Amadeus View Post
    Obama is out of control and must be stopped.

    True, but this is a waste of time. And time to look like the stunt that it is.

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