Page 8 of 10 FirstFirst ... 678910 LastLast
Results 71 to 80 of 91

Thread: Measles Hits Amish Communities, And U.S. Cases Reach 20-Year High

  1. #71
    Professor
    Tettsuo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Brooklyn, NY
    Last Seen
    Today @ 06:58 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    2,320

    Re: Measles Hits Amish Communities, And U.S. Cases Reach 20-Year High

    Quote Originally Posted by Maenad View Post
    122,000 deaths globally compared to over 7 billion people living on Earth.

    Yeah... rare as rare can be.
    A man without fear is a fool, a man that succumbs to his fear is a coward and a brave man acknowledges fear yet presses on.
    http://soulinblackandwhite.blogspot.com/

  2. #72
    Sayonara!
    Maenad's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    By the water.
    Last Seen
    07-09-14 @ 10:18 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    3,259

    Re: Measles Hits Amish Communities, And U.S. Cases Reach 20-Year High

    Quote Originally Posted by Tettsuo View Post
    122,000 deaths globally compared to over 7 billion people living on Earth.

    Yeah... rare as rare can be.
    For the ones who died, it was 100%. Just sayin'.
    Redneck, hillbilly, fundie, Bible thumper, cracker, split tails, geezer, loon, xenophobe, islamaphobe, and homophobe are not words of tolerance.

  3. #73
    Professor
    Tettsuo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Brooklyn, NY
    Last Seen
    Today @ 06:58 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    2,320

    Re: Measles Hits Amish Communities, And U.S. Cases Reach 20-Year High

    Quote Originally Posted by Maenad View Post
    For the ones who died, it was 100%. Just sayin'.
    Do you feel that same way for those that died from vaccines?

    I'm just sayin' as well.

    You risk one for the other. My question remains, is it worth it? Both are dangerous and trading the life of one child to save another isn't worth it to me to start crowing about forced vaccinations.
    A man without fear is a fool, a man that succumbs to his fear is a coward and a brave man acknowledges fear yet presses on.
    http://soulinblackandwhite.blogspot.com/

  4. #74
    Kinky
    tres borrachos's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    New England
    Last Seen
    Today @ 05:21 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    39,095

    Re: Measles Hits Amish Communities, And U.S. Cases Reach 20-Year High

    Quote Originally Posted by Maenad View Post
    According to recent data, none, but in reality we don't know how many in the US actually had measles. The fact remains that it can be a deadly disease and that is why a vaccine was developed for it.
    My kids are all vaccinated, and so are my husband & I. But it was our choice.

    I don't see how this Amish situation is indicative of a national crisis, and I certainly don't subscribe to the idea that they should be attacked (as some in here are). I saw a religious dig in the OP, intentional or otherwise.

  5. #75
    Sayonara!
    Maenad's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    By the water.
    Last Seen
    07-09-14 @ 10:18 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    3,259

    Re: Measles Hits Amish Communities, And U.S. Cases Reach 20-Year High

    Quote Originally Posted by Tettsuo View Post
    Do you feel that same way for those that died from vaccines?

    I'm just sayin' as well.

    You risk one for the other. My question remains, is it worth it? Both are dangerous and trading the life of one child to save another isn't worth it.
    You are in denial about how serious measles is:

    Measles can be prevented by the combination MMR (measles, mumps, and rubella) vaccine. In the decade before the measles vaccination program began, an estimated 34 million people in the United States were infected each year, of whom 400500 died, 48,000 were hospitalized, and another 1,000 developed chronic disability from measles encephalitis.
    CDC - Measles: Vaccination

    As far as the vaccine goes, any medicine carries with it the risk of death. You cannot argue that it is just measles vaccine because any foreign substance you put in your body can cause a deadly reaction.
    Redneck, hillbilly, fundie, Bible thumper, cracker, split tails, geezer, loon, xenophobe, islamaphobe, and homophobe are not words of tolerance.

  6. #76
    Bat Chain Puller
    beefheart's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    The burning sands of the desert southwest.
    Last Seen
    Today @ 09:10 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    19,254

    Re: Measles Hits Amish Communities, And U.S. Cases Reach 20-Year High

    This just in:
    Religious Objections To Vaccines Can't Threaten Public Health, Judge Kuntz Rules

    Religious Objections To Vaccines Can't Threaten Public Health, Judge Kuntz Rules
    The Huffington Post | By Yasmine Hafiz

    Posted: 06/24/2014

    Judge William F. Kuntz II has ruled to uphold a New York City policy that bars unvaccinated children from attending school when another student has a disease preventable by a vaccination, reports The New York Times.

    In the ruling, Kuntz wrote that the Supreme Court, "strongly suggested that religious objectors are not constitutionally exempt from vaccinations."

    Three families filing suit contended that the school policy preventing their unvaccinated children from attending school at risky times is a First Amendment violation of religious freedom. The Brooklyn Eagle reported that Nicole Phillips, Fabian Mendoza-Vaca and Dina Check had decided not to vaccinate their children on the grounds of "sincere religious belief."

    From a public health standpoint, the small unvaccinated percentage of the population threatens efforts to eradicate preventable diseases from society. Depending on the contagiousness of the specific disease, a certain percentage of the population must be vaccinated in order to prevent an outbreak, due to a phenomenon known as "herd immunity," reports The Times. For highly contagious diseases like measles, that percentage is as high as 95%, which means that even a few unvaccinated children could pose a hazard to an entire school.
    "Those who do not remember the past are condemned to repeat it." George Santayana

  7. #77
    Professor
    Tettsuo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Brooklyn, NY
    Last Seen
    Today @ 06:58 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    2,320

    Re: Measles Hits Amish Communities, And U.S. Cases Reach 20-Year High

    Quote Originally Posted by Maenad View Post
    You are in denial about how serious measles is:

    CDC - Measles: Vaccination

    As far as the vaccine goes, any medicine carries with it the risk of death. You cannot argue that it is just measles vaccine because any foreign substance you put in your body can cause a deadly reaction.
    Measles can be prevented by the combination MMR (measles, mumps, and rubella) vaccine. In the decade before the measles vaccination program began, an estimated 3–4 million people in the United States were infected each year, of whom 400–500 died, 48,000 were hospitalized, and another 1,000 developed chronic disability from measles encephalitis.
    500 (choosing the higher number) died out of 3 million (choosing the lower number). That equals 0.0167% chance of death.
    48,000 hospitalized out of 3 million. That equals 1.6% chance of developing severe complications.

    No, I'm not scare. Try harder.
    A man without fear is a fool, a man that succumbs to his fear is a coward and a brave man acknowledges fear yet presses on.
    http://soulinblackandwhite.blogspot.com/

  8. #78
    Sage



    Join Date
    May 2013
    Last Seen
    Today @ 09:42 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Progressive
    Posts
    12,216

    Re: Measles Hits Amish Communities, And U.S. Cases Reach 20-Year High

    Quote Originally Posted by AliHajiSheik View Post
    Yes, and the effects are also different between the two. My response is related to having the government forcing a course of action on people to prevent either one. Would HIV have spread as rapidly if people with HIV were isolated? I'm wasn't advocating for that, but you have to admit that it was discussed as a course of action.
    Again, the communicability was quite different. If you are in a room with someone with measles (and you are not immunized) about 90% will end up with measles - with NO direct contact. In the same situation with a person with AIDS - sharing room, nothing else, no one will get AIDS.

    I have absolutely no issue with the government taking appropriate reasonable action to prevent the spread of the disease. But you must understand that at the time, nobody knew they were infected until they showed some very drastic signs. The government intervention at the time was understanding of the disease and education to the population as things are known.

    The lack of significant government intervention brought us a crossover into the blood supply as well - creating new risk groups and spread.

    I am entirely for appropriate government intervention. Sometimes that would include quarantine. But way back when the AIDS crisis began - would not have helped at all. People didn't know they were sick until they were on the dying path.

  9. #79
    Sage
    Lursa's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Outside Seattle
    Last Seen
    Today @ 07:34 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    29,781

    Re: Measles Hits Amish Communities, And U.S. Cases Reach 20-Year High

    Quote Originally Posted by Tettsuo View Post
    You mean just like the risks the vaccine itself presents?
    As I already wrote and you ignored....those are 'individual' risks (not contagious).

    Non-vaccination carries societal risks as well as individual.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    I have felt pain when I was in the womb. So when you say they are incapable of feeling pain, that is based on junk science.
    Quote Originally Posted by applejuicefool View Post
    A murderer putting a bullet through someone's brain is a medical procedure too.

  10. #80
    Sage
    Sherman123's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Northeast US
    Last Seen
    11-23-17 @ 11:12 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    7,774

    Re: Measles Hits Amish Communities, And U.S. Cases Reach 20-Year High

    Quote Originally Posted by Tettsuo View Post
    I could ask the same of you.

    Moderate Problems
    Seizure (jerking or staring) caused by fever (about 1 out of 3,000 doses) - Are you suggesting that someone having a seizure is not a serious problem?
    Temporary pain and stiffness in the joints, mostly in teenage or adult women (up to 1 out of 4)
    Temporary low platelet count, which can cause a bleeding disorder (about 1 out of 30,000 doses) - Are you suggesting that having a bleeding disorder is not a serious problem?

    Severe Problems (Very Rare)
    Serious allergic reaction (less than 1 out of a million doses)
    Several other severe problems have been reported after a child gets MMR vaccine, including:
    Deafness
    Long-term seizures, coma, or lowered consciousness
    Permanent brain damage

    What exactly is a serious problem to you then? Does it square with the very rare complications that occur when someone contracts measles (which is also a rarity)?
    Yes of course it squares. The side-effects are so rare that they are virtually unheard of while the benefit of vaccination greatly outweighs that minuscule risk. In order to ensure uniform application of vaccines and therefore to retain herd immunity there should not be exceptions save for medical cause. Picking and choosing which vaccines people are and aren't allowed to opt out of is a bad path to tread. Nor are these harmless diseases. For example the rubella epidemics of the early 1960's were brutal resulting in a little over 2,000 deaths in the space of a year.

    Maintain herd immunity. Vaccinate or don't go to school. Even then I'm in favor of suspending welfare and other benefits to people who choose not to vaccinate.

Page 8 of 10 FirstFirst ... 678910 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •