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Thread: Iraq insurgents take Saddam's home town in lightning advance [W:246, 565, *656*]

  1. #301
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    Re: Iraq insurgents take Saddam's home town in lightning advance

    Quote Originally Posted by notquiteright View Post
    I asked a few times- just how big a force are you talking about? What happens when Maliki refused to extend the Status of Forces agreement with exemption from Iraqi law for Troops and 'contractors'?

    Maliki doesn't need a HD big screen 'picture' (and with our intel track record are ya sure it is a help???), he needs guys who will fight, he routinely ignored our advice, he routinely rewarded political cronies and relatives, from day one not once we left ...

    'We' didn't steer crap, we CREATED the crap fest with disenfranchised Sunnis....

    BushII/Bremmer threw all the Sunnis out of work, gutted the police and administrative forces- how quickly some forget....

    You can train and train and train, but unless the trained troops are willing to fight and face death....
    Our intel performance in Iraq while US forces were deployed was superb. Moreover, while we were there he followed our advice more often than not. Our outreach to the Sunnis was the basis of the success of the Surge. A Status of Forces agreement could have been reached had our side not been so eager to use those negotiations as a pretext to leave.
    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

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    Re: Iraq insurgents take Saddam's home town in lightning advance

    Don't worry........Barack has got this.....as soon as he comes off the back nine

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    Re: Iraq insurgents take Saddam's home town in lightning advance

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    Our intel performance in Iraq while US forces were deployed was superb. Moreover, while we were there he followed our advice more often than not. Our outreach to the Sunnis was the basis of the success of the Surge. A Status of Forces agreement could have been reached had our side not been so eager to use those negotiations as a pretext to leave.
    True. And the outreach was making nice. Something many say won't work.

    I'll also say this, back then, early in the effort, a commander said we could leave in a day or two, or in a century or two, and it wouldn't matter. The place would fight a war whenever we did.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  4. #304
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    Re: Iraq insurgents take Saddam's home town in lightning advance

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    True. And the outreach was making nice. Something many say won't work.

    I'll also say this, back then, early in the effort, a commander said we could leave in a day or two, or in a century or two, and it wouldn't matter. The place would fight a war whenever we did.
    The outreach worked like a charm. Ending it was what created the problem. And that commander, whoever he was, was a lazy idiot.
    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

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    Re: Iraq insurgents take Saddam's home town in lightning advance

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    The outreach worked like a charm. Ending it was what created the problem. And that commander, whoever he was, was a lazy idiot.
    He seems more accurate than most. And no, we could not stay forever. And Iraq takes a forever effort. The mistake was going in.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  6. #306
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    Re: Iraq insurgents take Saddam's home town in lightning advance

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    He seems more accurate than most. And no, we could not stay forever. And Iraq takes a forever effort. The mistake was going in.
    We have stayed in Germany and Korea for over half a century and that worked out well. Much less of a presence would have been required in Iraq to avert the current crisis and influence regional evolution positively.
    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

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    Re: Iraq insurgents take Saddam's home town in lightning advance

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    We have stayed in Germany and Korea for over half a century and that worked out well. Much less of a presence would have been required in Iraq to avert the current crisis and influence regional evolution positively.
    A false comparison. Nations and situations are not alike. Iraq was a completely different situation, lacking a people that had enough similarities to ever adjust as those countries did. They have a long history of being divided, or having differing beliefs and holding grudges. It's a logical mistake to make that comparison.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Iraq insurgents take Saddam's home town in lightning advance

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    He never really wanted us to leave.
    On June 13, 2008, Iraqi Prime Minister Nuri al-Maliki said that negotiations with the United States on a long-term security pact were deadlocked because of concern the deal infringes Iraqi sovereignty. "We have reached an impasse because when we opened these negotiations we did not realize that the U.S. demands would so deeply affect Iraqi sovereignty and this is something we can never accept", he said in Amman, Jordan. "We cannot allow U..S forces to have the right to jail Iraqis or assume, alone, the responsibility of fighting against terrorism", Maliki told Jordanian newspaper editors, according to a journalist present at the meeting
    Malaki didn't want to play by US rules, so, screw him, let him fight the terrorists in his country with his own resources. He either played by our conditions or not at all, in time of fighting terrorists in foreign countries, these countries need to learn if they want US help, they use our playbook and not their own.

    I sure hope Obama doesn't put boots back in that cesspool, it would be the wrong thing to do.

    I heard house speaker Boner talking **** today about Obama not doing anything, this is proof the the republican chicken hawks still want boots there, which is another hatched bad idea.

  9. #309
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    Re: Iraq insurgents take Saddam's home town in lightning advance

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    A false comparison. Nations and situations are not alike. Iraq was a completely different situation, lacking a people that had enough similarities to ever adjust as those countries did. They have a long history of being divided, or having differing beliefs and holding grudges. It's a logical mistake to make that comparison.

    Germany too too had a long history of division and grudges, and Korea was more unlike us than is Iraq. Sorry, but your claim falls short.
    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

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    Re: Iraq insurgents take Saddam's home town in lightning advance

    Quote Originally Posted by AJiveMan View Post
    Malaki didn't want to play by US rules, so, screw him, let him fight the terrorists in his country with his own resources. He either played by our conditions or not at all, in time of fighting terrorists in foreign countries, these countries need to learn if they want US help, they use our playbook and not their own.

    I sure hope Obama doesn't put boots back in that cesspool, it would be the wrong thing to do.

    I heard house speaker Boner talking **** today about Obama not doing anything, this is proof the the republican chicken hawks still want boots there, which is another hatched bad idea.
    A Status of Forces Agreement was within reach had our side not wanted so badly to leave. Maliki was just putting the best face on an outcome he did not want.
    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

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