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Thread: Judge strikes down Wisconsin gay marriage ban[W:287:411]

  1. #71
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    re: Judge strikes down Wisconsin gay marriage ban[W:287]

    Quote Originally Posted by blarg View Post
    unless marge stops conferring rights and benefits how's it become less relevent?

    if anything things like civil unions would be more of a threat as they supposedly would be competing institutions for such things
    I agree. That's why Ohio does not sanction either homosexual marriage or civil unions.
    You can't reason anyone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into in the first place.

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    re: Judge strikes down Wisconsin gay marriage ban[W:287]

    Quote Originally Posted by AJiveMan View Post
    Cardinal is correct, same sex marriage or unions has been happening for eons.

    History of same-sex unions - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    State sanctioned homosexual unions were not part of modern society until after the year 2000 and it's questionable that anything like our modern state-sanctioned marriage ever existed in any routine form among any society until now.
    You can't reason anyone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into in the first place.

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    re: Judge strikes down Wisconsin gay marriage ban[W:287]

    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    I disagree. Ultimately, it seems to be headed to the point of being irrelevant and once irrelevant, why support it with sanction? I think the current course, if maintained will see marriage wither away to an obscure social tradition eventually, provided society lasts long enough taking it's current course.
    So, if gay people get married, people will stop getting married entirely? I'm not sure I get what you're predicting.
    He touched her over her bra and underpants, she says, and guided her hand to touch him over his underwear
    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    We’ll say what? Something like “nothing happened” ... Yeah, we might say something like that.

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    re: Judge strikes down Wisconsin gay marriage ban[W:287]

    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    I agree. That's why Ohio does not sanction either homosexual marriage or civil unions.
    Ahh. So when people say gay people should be happy with civil unions, they're full of ****.
    He touched her over her bra and underpants, she says, and guided her hand to touch him over his underwear
    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    We’ll say what? Something like “nothing happened” ... Yeah, we might say something like that.

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    re: Judge strikes down Wisconsin gay marriage ban[W:287]

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    So, if gay people get married, people will stop getting married entirely? I'm not sure I get what you're predicting.
    I think state sanctioned marriage will eventually be just an archaic historic tradition. I don't think homosexuals are actually going to be doing much marrying. Most I've ever known thought marriage was a really stupid idea and except for the purpose of "normalizing" homosexuality or leveraging tax breaks like the Hawaiian couple did in the Supreme Court decision there, homosexual marriage makes little sense to virtually all the homosexuals I've known. Even my brother holds marriage in contempt as a heterosexual institution but is rabidly pro-homosexual marriage because it legitimizes homosexuality in a way nothing has before.

    As it stands marriage is already in trouble with high divorce rates and people feeling quite comfortable living together without marriage. Ultimately, I'm thinking this is just one more nail in the coffin of marriage, but possibly the last one that's needed to seal the it shut. It won't happen in my lifetime and, who knows? Maybe society will change it's mind at some point in time. It seems the popularity of homosexuality waxes and wanes over different periods.
    You can't reason anyone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into in the first place.

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    re: Judge strikes down Wisconsin gay marriage ban[W:287]

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    Ahh. So when people say gay people should be happy with civil unions, they're full of ****.
    I think homosexuals should be very happy with civil unions. It's the state that might not be happy with them. Hey, in my lifetime we went from homosexuality being illegal to civil unions. What's not to be happy about that for homosexuals?
    You can't reason anyone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into in the first place.

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    re: Judge strikes down Wisconsin gay marriage ban[W:287]

    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    Yes. These things were always unchanging.... until they changed. I'm of two minds on this with one mind agreeing that marriage must keep up with "the people" as an institution of "the people" and another mind confused about the new memes that are utterly at odds with what seemed to be the primary building block of society in a solid and "unchanging" formation. But the state of marriage actually did change. Maybe not so fundamentally as the basic structure of man and woman becoming something else, but the purpose and perspective of it certainly changed over time. So we do face some philosophical contradictions that something so basic and unchanging from our perspective, has and does, in fact, change. I think it is safe to say that no generation has seen such a sudden and drastic change as the one we're seeing, but the shifting of what marriage was, in essence, has been a slow and pretty constant thing over the course of history. Maybe it's that the change was so slow that it seemed like the moon would seem; rooted and locked in place even though it is constantly moving.

    My take on marriage is that it is a creation of the state in the form of a sanctioned entity and is, therefore, the domain of the state to establish definition and conditions. I am not against homosexual marriage per se as long as the state decrees that "the people" desire to establish and sanction it. I am against federal decree to all the states regarding it. As long as each state works out it's own needs in establishment of marriage it's all fair and good.
    I, on the other hand, believe any state action is subject to the US Constitution. I believe the Constitution is the supreme law of the nation.
    He touched her over her bra and underpants, she says, and guided her hand to touch him over his underwear
    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    We’ll say what? Something like “nothing happened” ... Yeah, we might say something like that.

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    re: Judge strikes down Wisconsin gay marriage ban[W:287]

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    I, on the other hand, believe any state action is subject to the US Constitution. I believe the Constitution is the supreme law of the nation.
    So do I and I've never seen the constitutional guarantee of state sanctioned homosexual marriage so it's moot point.
    You can't reason anyone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into in the first place.

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    re: Judge strikes down Wisconsin gay marriage ban[W:287]

    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    State sanctioned homosexual unions were not part of modern society until after the year 2000 and it's questionable that anything like our modern state-sanctioned marriage ever existed in any routine form among any society until now.
    This is part of the quote I responded to, nothing in this except says state sanctioned.

    Quote Originally Posted by Demon of Light View Post
    Legal marriage? No evidence of it ever occurring or being endorsed by any government until very recently. There are a few stories at certain points in history that sort of relate to it, but do not indicate it was seen as a legal marriage equivalent to that of a marriage between a man and a woman. All indications are that legal gay marriage is really a 20th Century invention that only came into practice in the 21st Century.
    I provided evidence that same sex marriage or unions existed throughout history. For all intents and purposes, ancients perform same sex marriages. see link I provided earlier

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    re: Judge strikes down Wisconsin gay marriage ban[W:287]

    Quote Originally Posted by AJiveMan View Post
    This is part of the quote I responded to, nothing in this except says state sanctioned.
    But the current battle is over STATE-SANCTIONED homosexual unions. Homosexual unions have always existed as some small percentage of unions, illicit or otherwise. But state sanctioned is what we're fighting over.
    You can't reason anyone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into in the first place.

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