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Thread: Should Target take action to keep rifles out of their stores?[W:37]

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    Re: Should Target take action to keep rifles out of their stores?[W:37]

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    no doubt i'm in the minority on this... the majority does tend to **** it's pant in fear when they see a firearm in the open... well, unless it's attached to a government agent , anyways.
    No need to pat yourself on the back for being a manly real man who ain't skeered of guns, by gosh. I've described my problem with it above. If you have any comments on that, fine.

    Americans, in general, are a scared people... so it's doesn't strike me as odd that many would be scared at the sight of a firearm.
    at this point, it's an automatic condition for many.
    Well, while we're throwing around personal insults against people we don't know and making sweeping generalizations of strangers, I have another observation - it's the people who feel a need to carry a firearm with them at all time who are the one's "****ing their pants" on a daily basis. The OP's story has a quote from a guy who obviously is a frightened, cowardly, paranoid individual because he claimed he wouldn't take his family into a department store unless he was carrying his blanky, his firearm, because otherwise the experience is too scary, why there might be a criminal in there! In Somalia or many places in Israel, such fear might be justified. In 99.9% of America, it's irrational. I'm 50 and have gone a lifetime without carrying a firearm anywhere except to hunt or to the shooting range. It's never occurred to me to be skeered in a department store while shopping for a shirt and some toiletries.

    I wouldn't carry a rifle shopping, because, well, it's too bulky and not very practical.... but every day i walk into a store.. usually Target or HEB.. i'm carrying.

    these guys were obviously making a political statement... and it's a legal political statement... and i'm ok with that.

    nobody was shot, nobody was killed...the rifles remained slung..nothing bad happened.
    Yes, and of course, for the vast majority of those of us who don't carry a firearm daily, nobody was shot, nobody was killed, nothing bad happened, we didn't need a weapon.

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    Re: Should Target take action to keep rifles out of their stores?[W:37]

    Quote Originally Posted by CRUE CAB View Post
    The 2A trumps scaredy cat soccer moms.

    Until those scaredy cats start voting for people who are determined to make your life difficult.
    Don't be a grammar nazi - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations, Book 1 #7

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    Re: Should Target take action to keep rifles out of their stores?[W:37]

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    it's true that just because you can do something doesn't mean you should.. absolutely.

    then again, i'm not sure we need only to entertain the irrational fears of people to determine what we can or should do.

    while i would not carry a rifle as a matter of practicality, we might want to look into whether these fears that folks so ardently express are valid.

    now of course we all see the stories of mass killings, etc..but what is never emphasized is that your odds of this happening are extraordinarily rare... yet some believe that every gun they see is one that will shortly be used against them.
    but, meh, it's to be expected when you have a decades long active fear campaign working towards that end.

    that's not to say that vigilance should be abandoned... one absolutely should be vigilant... I fully expect for people to eyeball me if they find out i'm carrying.. i appreciate their vigilance, in fact.
    it's just as irrational to completely ignore these guys as it is to be automatically be fearful of them.

    of course, i can say this because i remember a day when these fears were not ever-present... when guns were carried without the masses going absolutely nuts over it.
    hell, I can remember as a child of 11 or 12 walking into Mcdonalds with my rifle slung over my shoulder to get an ice cream cone after an afternoon of shooting cans.. and nobody batting an eye... no national media attention... nothin'
    seeing a person openly carrying a handgun was fairly common.. it was simply no big deal.


    but i do agree that in todays environment, it wasn't the smartest political stunt to pull... as evident by folks losing their everloving minds over this, including people who were not there.
    Those fears need to be entertained insofar as those with irrational fears may act on them in ways that make life difficult for us. By voting for local politicians who might try to restrict your rights for example. And those restrictions might not pass constitutional muster but overturning even obviously bad laws takes time and money. Why create a problem where none existed?

    Irrational fears should be dealt with by education, not by playing right into those fears.
    Don't be a grammar nazi - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations, Book 1 #7

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    Re: Should Target take action to keep rifles out of their stores?[W:37]

    Quote Originally Posted by rocket88 View Post
    Gays are people, guns are objects. Nobody's saying they should be allowed to not serve gun owners, the objection is to guns in the store. Similarly, you may have to accept gay customers, but you don't have to accept them having gay sex in the store. People vs. objects and actions.
    gun are objects.. sure... they also happen to be one of the very few objects that we are afforded a constitutionally protected right to keep and bear... that makes them a lil different from most other objects.

    I still think you comparing gay sex in the aisles to carrying a firearm is utterly ridiculous.



    I was trying to pick a religion that might have an objection to firearms. If a business owner has a religious conviction against guns, why would they have to put up with it?
    there are plenty of religions that object to violence... but ,again, firearms =/= violence..I'm unaware of any religion that has an express objection to a firearm in and of itself.
    hell, i'm opposed to violence, well at least the initiation of violence ( i'm a big big fan of justifiable violence).. but i have no objections to firearms.

    the actions of the person who has the firearm is what is important.... using your comparison... gays are fine, but gay sex in the aisle is not fine. ( the action is paramount)
    but somehow, a gun is not fine.. regardless of action ( action is now of no importance whatsoever)

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    Re: Should Target take action to keep rifles out of their stores?[W:37]

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    I dunno, ask someone who holds that belief.
    in the same token, why is ok to have to serve gays, but not ok to allow firearms?
    Because one is a person and the other is an object. Not serving a gay person affects the person not being able to purchase an item. Not allowing a gun in the store does not restrict the person from purchasing an item.

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    Re: Should Target take action to keep rifles out of their stores?[W:37]

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    a predictable non-response.
    Of course it is, your ignorance is on display.

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    Re: Should Target take action to keep rifles out of their stores?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa View Post
    How do you know they are unnecessary? Do you know if you'll be in a car accident before it happens? And if loaded guns are strapped to their hips or slung over shoulders, it seems they are properly secured....like you described. So what's your problem again?
    True, there is a trivial chance of a mad gunman going off inside a department store, so you should prepare. And you should be always prepared a fire (a bottle of oxygen to survive the smoke would be helpful), and maybe wear a helmet in case a tile falls from above, and perhaps a first aid kit with one of the new heart deals that will restart yours should you have a heart attack. I'm sure you're wearing bullet proof vest, to survive the shootout or an attack by knife, etc. Can't be too prepared!

    And I explained my core problem - I do not know who these people are, so why would I trust them? I recognize two things - the gun toter doesn't make the shopping experience more than trivially safer or more dangerous. But he or she introduces a problem I have to deal with. I can't know if the person is sane, has been trained, follows the training, and will handle the weapon safely, so I'll feel a need to keep an eye on him or her. Not obsessively, but if there are 100 people in the target I'll be watching the rifle a bit more than the woman with a kid getting milk. It's something I don't want or need while shopping. I won't leave the store or promise never to come back till they ban weapons, but it's just added stress, however small, I prefer to avoid. And there is no reason for it. No one needs a firearm to shop safely.

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    Re: Should Target take action to keep rifles out of their stores?[W:37]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaius46 View Post
    Those fears need to be entertained insofar as those with irrational fears may act on them in ways that make life difficult for us. By voting for local politicians who might try to restrict your rights for example. And those restrictions might not pass constitutional muster but overturning even obviously bad laws takes time and money. Why create a problem where none existed?

    Irrational fears should be dealt with by education, not by playing right into those fears.
    I don't disagree....but i think we might disagree on how to educate.

    as with most things, familiarity has the habit of assuaging fears.


    not a direct comparison or anything, but i kinda see it similar to early civil rights battles... segregation didn't work to alleviate any fears or misconceptions of blacks or whites... tossing them all together , while a bit painful at first, has been a net benefit in terms of education and such.
    when my school was desegregated, i had a leg up.. a lived in a predominately black neighborhood... I was familiar with them, and them with I.. me.. whatever.
    many had irrational fears .. fears that subsided over time...well, for most of my peers anyways, there were still some around that were scared that dem darkies was coming to take da white wimminz or some such nonsense.
    anyways, that was just a quick observation on the issue of education and how i see it... familiarity must be a part of the equation or it will be doomed to failure.

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    Re: Should Target take action to keep rifles out of their stores?[W:37]

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    oh, I think of you thought about it long and hard you would come to the correct conclusion that private parties are not afforded the right or authority to violate civil liberties without fear of legal repercussions.
    So, I can use my First Amendment rights to hold a church service on your private property?
    Or, do I need to have your permission to do so?

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    Re: Should Target take action to keep rifles out of their stores?[W:37]

    Quote Originally Posted by Sababa View Post
    Of course it is, your ignorance is on display.
    another predictable non-response.

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