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Thread: Seven States Running Out of Water

  1. #51
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    Re: Seven States Running Out of Water

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    This really isn't overly surprising. Weather is cyclical. Ever read the novel Grapes of Wrath? Ever here about the depression and the dust bowl that was the American midwest?
    Yes, in fact I pointed to thousands of years of SW droughts and mentioned the Early Native American civilizations in that context.

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn
    Only thing changing now is that charlatans and snake oil salesmen like Al Gore want to convince you and the gullible in government that they can change the weather patterns and it will only cost you every living convenience and the wealth you worked hard for and built up in support of yourself and your family.
    Actually, no one politicized this until your post. No one even mentioned warming or the more loaded AGW.
    I should have added that disclaimer in my OP as well. The string was NOT meant to be political in any way.

    But what has changed now from the time of the failures of those early Native Americans and the days of Dust Bowl, is the amount of pressure on the resources despite our improved tech.
    How many (relatively new) cities like LA/Las Vegas/Phoenix can be even regionally supported in a 10 yr drought?
    How long is Cyclical? It could be 2/3/10 years or anything in between in some areas or perhaps, if less likely, even more.
    It's been 3+ for some areas already.
    If it lasts even one or two more in some areas, it's going to have huge impact on everyone.
    There's no infrastructure in place to stop regional problems if they continue.
    1000 years ago, Tens of Millions of Northeasterners weren't depending on Intensive agriculture of the Anasazi for their lettuce and other produce.
    Last edited by mbig; 06-03-14 at 01:47 PM.
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  2. #52
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    Re: Seven States Running Out of Water

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord of Planar View Post
    There is no way that desalinated water can be confused with the water we have here in the Pacific Northwest.
    Actually it really can. It's hard to believe for some people but its no different than wine sommeliers who claim with certainty they can tell the difference between a $500 bottle of wine and a $5 bottle of wine--it often isn't true. Most of the 'taste' from your local tap water comes from the pipes not the water itself. I dug up a great line I remembered from a leading expert on desalination out of the University of Melbourne (Australia has many desalination facilities):

    "SH If I gave you a glass of water from reclaimed sewage and a glass of water from a desal plant, would you be able to tell them apart?

    SK I wouldn’t be able to tell which one was which if they had both passed through the same sort of reverse osmosis at the end. I could tell them apart from, say, rainwater, because they would be purer than rainwater."

    And my favorite "You can taste the difference between rainwater and desalinated water, or reclaimed wastewater, because they are actually purer."

    Which really makes sense when you think about it.

    http://archive.uninews.unimelb.edu.au/news/5116/

  3. #53
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    Re: Seven States Running Out of Water

    Quote Originally Posted by Sherman123 View Post
    Actually it really can. It's hard to believe for some people but its no different than wine sommeliers who claim with certainty they can tell the difference between a $500 bottle of wine and a $5 bottle of wine--it often isn't true. Most of the 'taste' from your local tap water comes from the pipes not the water itself. I dug up a great line I remembered from a leading expert on desalination out of the University of Melbourne (Australia has many desalination facilities):

    "SH If I gave you a glass of water from reclaimed sewage and a glass of water from a desal plant, would you be able to tell them apart?

    SK I wouldn’t be able to tell which one was which if they had both passed through the same sort of reverse osmosis at the end. I could tell them apart from, say, rainwater, because they would be purer than rainwater."

    And my favorite "You can taste the difference between rainwater and desalinated water, or reclaimed wastewater, because they are actually purer."

    Which really makes sense when you think about it.

    Sandra Kentish on Water desalination : News : The University of Melbourne
    Believe as you wish.

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    Re: Seven States Running Out of Water

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    Once again, don't need desalinization. Besides by the time you build just one very expensive plant the droughts will be over until the next cycle. Just go to waterless toilets. Heck, you'll even save on sewerage.
    Waterless toilets have been around a long time. For some reason, no one wants to go back to them:



    and, as I said before, the state of California uses more water than nature gives us even in wet years. Conservation is all well and good, but, if agriculture is going to continue, water will have to be imported sooner or later, or a practical and inexpensive method of desalinization will have to be developed.

    If not, count on the price of groceries to go through the roof.
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    Re: Seven States Running Out of Water

    When I hear about these kinds of things, one thing keeps pissing me off: Are they looking into solutions like collecting condensation - like one idea I read about years ago involving pumping cold sea water through tubes on which the fresh water condenses, and is collected? If not, why not at least look into it - or making it viable on a large scale? Better than panicking, and running around like a chicken with its head cut off, a ***potential*** low tech solution.
    Nationalism in high dosages may be hazardous to your health. Please consult a psychiatrist before beginning a regular regimen, and if feelings of elitism and douchbaggery continue, discontinue immediately before you become unable to do so on your own.

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    Re: Seven States Running Out of Water

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord of Planar View Post
    Believe as you wish.
    Even if I was wrong I don't think it would be that big a deal. If the biggest obstacle to desalination is that some people aren't overly fond of the taste I'd say we've got a bright future ahead of us.

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    Re: Seven States Running Out of Water

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    Once again, don't need desalinization. Besides by the time you build just one very expensive plant the droughts will be over until the next cycle. Just go to waterless toilets. Heck, you'll even save on sewerage.
    That only works if you don't believe that this is part of a longer term trend in increased water requirement.

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    Re: Seven States Running Out of Water

    Quote Originally Posted by Sherman123 View Post
    Even if I was wrong I don't think it would be that big a deal. If the biggest obstacle to desalination is that some people aren't overly fond of the taste I'd say we've got a bright future ahead of us.
    People will use it if they must. The desalination process effectively removes salts, but not other things you find in ocean water.

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    Re: Seven States Running Out of Water

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord of Planar View Post
    People will use it if they must. The desalination process effectively removes salts, but not other things you find in ocean water.
    Actually reverse osmosis (RO) which is the process used in most desalination facilities is a comprehensive purification process. It is the same process used in most of your water treatment plants. So that isn't true.

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    Re: Seven States Running Out of Water

    Quote Originally Posted by Sherman123 View Post
    Even if I was wrong I don't think it would be that big a deal. If the biggest obstacle to desalination is that some people aren't overly fond of the taste I'd say we've got a bright future ahead of us.
    The biggest obstacle is cost. It might work for domestic use, but not for agriculture, at least not unless a much less expensive way can be found to accomplish it.
    "Donald Trump is a phony, a fraud... [he's] playing the American public for suckers." Mitt Romney

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