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Thread: US soldier freed from captivity in Afghanistan

  1. #441
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    Re: US soldier freed from captivity in Afghanistan

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    In which case it's still "good for him" since he'd be wanting to follow those orders as a good jihadist



    I'm sorry, but I have any desire to deal with tin foil hat types. There's absolutely zero reason, at this point, to believe he wasn't held captive or was anything other than a POW. Could one "speculate" otherwise? Sure, about as much as one could "speculate" that George Bush order the twin towers to be brought down. You can "speculate" about anything. If it's reasonable speculation is an entirely different thing.



    Doesn't matter if there's no testimony from anyone that he wasn't deserter. He's an American Citizen that would be tried under American law...he is presumed innocent until proven guilty. As it stands, it's ALLEDGED that he's a deserter, and being an alledged deserter does not present a 100% chance of being put into captivity no matter how badly you want to spin it.

    Yeah like equating reasonable speculation with Bush blowing up the Twin towers is the same thing.. Was good for a laugh though so thanks for that at least. Anyway, I say there is more than enough circumstantial evidence presented thus far to hold the speculative opinion I currently do. In fact, I think to have an opposite opinion brings into question your analytical credibility. I NEVER knee jerk, in fact it's a rule of mine, and I'd love for you to go back through all of my threads to show that I do. However, this one is very different in that I'd be shocked; outright shocked if he wasn't a deserter, and also in cohorts and a willing captive, albeit indoctrinated, and perhaps not thinking he was a captive at all... Too much is pointing in this direction. As to the motives of the President? Well, I stand by that as well This president has zero cred with me, he's a known liar, cheat, and proven to be so inept at being Prez that I can't think of anyone else in the history of American Presidents I'd list below him, not even Carter?

    Is he so inept that his handlers simply misjudged this one? Oh yeah, HELL yeah, he's already shown us that on many, MANY occasions. So, that said, is it so far fetched to believe that the President was so desperate for a win anywhere that he missed this one. Yep, I wouldn't have believed it 6 years ago, but I think I'm on solid ground here, Zyph.


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  2. #442
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    Re: US soldier freed from captivity in Afghanistan


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    Re: US soldier freed from captivity in Afghanistan

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    Could care less what he did in the military.
    Well, obviously.

    What he did now was amazing.
    What did he do? Not die?
    ”People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.” --- Ben Franklin

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    Sterotypes are mostly based on truths.

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    Re: US soldier freed from captivity in Afghanistan

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    If he is happy there, he could return or he could have refused to comply with American authorities.

    I think you're being wholey dishonest if you're suggesting stating he was in captivity there is somehow "speculating" on the same degree, or even speculation at all, as saying he'll be imprisoned here.

    I'm going off facts that are currently presented. The facts currently presented is that he WAS a captive. The facts currently presented is that he's alledgedly a deserter. One of those results in 100% certainty of being in captivity, one does not. That's simply a fact.
    he left a note saying he was deserting and going to the Taliban..

    thats a fact also

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    Re: US soldier freed from captivity in Afghanistan

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiggen View Post
    Or maybe he joined them willingly and provided information.
    That certainly appears to be the case at this point in time.

    I'm not certain what information he could provide them that they didn't already know, but I suspect that leaving allowed some sort of personal reconciliation for him.

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    Re: US soldier freed from captivity in Afghanistan

    Quote Originally Posted by jonny5 View Post
    Perhaps all politicians are idiots? Whats that go to do with this particular idiot?
    Which idiot do you refer to?

    My point is that the Bush administration was on friendly terms with the Taliban, until we invaded their country under fraud.

    That's the only point, and it is relevant in any calculation as to their inherent evil, as some people get anxious about.

    What will eventually happen in this Bergdahl case is that it will become public knowledge that he became a conscientious objector, either before or after he arrived in country. Most likely he understood that we invaded the country under fraud, but whatever his motivation it will become public and the debate will shift.

    In a way, this reminds me a bit of the case of Ehren Watada, 1LT USA, who refused orders to Iraq and was court martialed.

  7. #447
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    Re: US soldier freed from captivity in Afghanistan

    Quote Originally Posted by zyphlin View Post
    i'm sorry, but how exactly is it hyperpartisan for people to criticize you for legit feelings of happiness for the gentleman's family...but it's not hyperpartisan for you to complain about people criticizing obama for a legit concern?

    I would have no issue with your claims if you were criticizing people simply for attacking those that express happiness for the family. That's absolutely legitimate. One can disagree with how it was done and who it was done for...and still be happy on a personal level for the family that got their son back.

    But you're not just criticizing them for that...you're also criticizing them because they have the audacity to air legitimate greivances over something simply because there's a potential "good" personal level effect from it.

    It's entirely legitimate to suggest that trading 5 individuals who have cost american lives and have actively engaged to some degree with terrorist action for one pow, abscent all the other crap being talked about for said pow, is a poor foreign policy and defense decision. It is in no way unreasonable to suggest that doing such establishes a value of worth on the lives of american soldiers. It is in no way unreasonable to suggest that doing such may save the live of this pow, but has a legitimate potential to threaten the lives of multiple americans if these guys return to their previous ways. It'd be one thing if you were just criticizing those who may go over the top, suggesting obama is actively trying to "help the enemy" or something like this...but you're criticisms seem simply pointed at anyone who dares suggeset the president acted wrongly here.

    Its entirely legitimate to be upset and voice grievance over the president for a wanton violation of the law. Regardless of him doing a signing statement claiming he thinks the law is unconstitutional, the fact is he signed the bill into law...meaning it is law. The president does not have fiat power to simply declare something constitutional or not. There is nothing wrong, what so ever, in expressing anger or antipathy towards the administration for a violation of the law.

    Your anger at other peoples hyper partisanship seems to blind you of your own, and of others. Yes, people are wrongfully attacking folks for simply being happy for the pow's family that he's free, or for the pow himself for being free. And those people are likely doing it for partisan reasons. However, there are a multitude of people attacking individuals for criticizing legitimate policy and legal aspects of this simply because they think it's unfairly being aimed at obama. They, too, are doing it primarily for partisan reasons...specifically aggression towards the partisan leans of those making the accusations. If it wasn't for that reason then equal condemnation would be tossed at those attacking folks for daring to air a legitimate grievance towards an act of foreign policy.

    You sum it up by repeating your first post in this thread. I'll sum it up by highlighting your first sentence.

    "this is a good thing"

    that's a fine opinoin. Disagreeing with that opinion is not hyper partisan. You did not, in any way, cache that statement in specifics. You didn't say "it's a good thing" as it relates to the family. You didn't specifiy that it's a good thing specifically for the pow. You made a claim, in a broad sense, that this is a "good thing".

    And that absolutely can be legitimately challenged without it being "hyper partisan" in nature. I'm sorry that it seems to bother you that people can make judgements on political issues outside of their emotional gut reaction to the event on a personal level, but it absolutely can happen. One can absolutely feel happy for the family and still think this is a bad thing in terms of policy or legality.

    "it's a good thing for the family" is a hard thing to legitimately make an argument against, and attacking someone for feeling that way would be ridiculous.

    "it's a good thing", full stop, broadly stated is an easy thing to legitimately make an argument against, and it's absolutely not wrong in any way to attack someone for having that opinion on an issue.
    boom!!!!
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    Re: US soldier freed from captivity in Afghanistan

    Quote Originally Posted by Henry David View Post
    Which idiot do you refer to?

    My point is that the Bush administration was on friendly terms with the Taliban, until we invaded their country under fraud.

    That's the only point, and it is relevant in any calculation as to their inherent evil, as some people get anxious about.

    What will eventually happen in this Bergdahl case is that it will become public knowledge that he became a conscientious objector, either before or after he arrived in country. Most likely he understood that we invaded the country under fraud, but whatever his motivation it will become public and the debate will shift.

    In a way, this reminds me a bit of the case of Ehren Watada, 1LT USA, who refused orders to Iraq and was court martialed.
    Invaded under fraud??? What the...?
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

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    Re: US soldier freed from captivity in Afghanistan

    Nothing personal JMac, but read it and weep.

    Yes, under fraud. The predicate events for that invasion were very much a false flag operation.

  10. #450
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    Re: US soldier freed from captivity in Afghanistan

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    If he is happy there, he could return or he could have refused to comply with American authorities.
    That wasn't really an option that was given to him. You think he's got freedom of movement now? I would be extremely doubtful.

    I'm going off facts that are currently presented. The facts currently presented is that he WAS a captive.
    Sort of. He was a captive certainly at certain points. At other points he appears to have helped partake in the Jihad.


    I have no doubt his folks are glad to have him back. That just doesn't make him any less of a turd.

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