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Thread: Judge throws out Pennsylvania's ban on gay marriage

  1. #621
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    Re: Judge throws out Pennsylvania's ban on gay marriage

    Quote Originally Posted by vesper View Post
    And the sad part of this is you don't even realize you have violated his rights.
    because theres ZERO facts to support that lie LMAO

    if you disagree simply post the facts now that support that i violated anybody's rights, I cant wait to read this humor.
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    Re: Judge throws out Pennsylvania's ban on gay marriage

    Quote Originally Posted by vesper View Post
    Judge Spencer said in his written order, “At first blush, it may seem reasonable that a private business should be able to refuse service to anyone it chooses. This view, however, fails to take into account the cost to society and the hurt caused to persons who are denied service simply because of who they are.”

    In other words, it’s all about “feelings.” The “hurt feelings” of Craig and Mullins are more important than a privately-owned business’ freedom of choice as to whom the business would serve.


    Oh for the love of Ted, that's what you are going with.

    You inability to ignore the extensive precedence and citations of the law to support the decision while focusing on one word of dicta in an introductory paragraph should be embarrassing to you.


    With that it's time to get ready for bed. You have a good evening Vesper.


    >>>>

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    Re: Judge throws out Pennsylvania's ban on gay marriage

    Quote Originally Posted by WorldWatcher View Post


    Oh for the love of Ted, that's what you are going with.

    You inability to ignore the extensive precedence and citations of the law to support the decision while focusing on one word of dicta in an introductory paragraph should be embarrassing to you.


    With that it's time to get ready for bed. You have a good evening Vesper.


    >>>>
    Quit being intellectually dishonest. It wasn't just one word. The judge clearly made it about hurt feelings in part. You have a peaceful night too WorldWatcher. Peace

  4. #624
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    Re: Judge throws out Pennsylvania's ban on gay marriage

    Quote Originally Posted by vesper View Post
    And the sad part of this is you don't even realize you have violated his rights.
    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    because theres ZERO facts to support that lie LMAO

    if you disagree simply post the facts now that support that i violated anybody's rights, I cant wait to read this humor.
    Still waiting for you to factually rove your statement?
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  5. #625
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    Re: Judge throws out Pennsylvania's ban on gay marriage

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    You've evolved. They haven't. And they also represent, if polls are to be believed, almost 1/2 of the population of this country.

    They are also entitled to believe what they do without being degraded for it.

    I was born in 1962. I can assure you, through the bulk of my 50+ years on this Earth, when the word "marriage" came into my mind, I pictured a man and a woman, because that's what was the norm when I was born and for many years after that. Does it make me narrow minded that my mind defaults to Dan & Susan and not Dan & Stephen? The mention of a random group of native Americans or a couple of Roman emporers marrying someone of the same sex doesn't change the fact that the bulk of our citizens were born into a society with opposite sex people in marriage, and it will take decades if not generations to change that.

    You certainly don't expect the accepted national perception of something to turn on a dime, do you?
    And the bulk of many who are older than you would not picture (nor like) interracial couples when it comes to being married. My own grandparents were very much against interracial dating, let alone marriage. As were my best friend's grandparents (who were raising her, she couldn't even hang out with black guys). I've met many people my own age who think that interracial dating is wrong.

    It isn't an issue that it "defaults", as you put it, to opposite sex couples. It is an issue if you think that "defaulting" means that marriage can only be and has ever only been opposite sex couples (and, I'm not saying you do believe this, only that when others do, that is the issue).

    The "accepted national perception" of relationships were within your own race less than 50 years ago. That didn't change to a majority acceptance level until the 1990s. I was alive and in my teens when a majority of people finally started to see interracial relationships/marriages as "acceptable".
    Last edited by roguenuke; 05-22-14 at 08:48 AM.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

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    Re: Judge throws out Pennsylvania's ban on gay marriage

    Quote Originally Posted by vesper View Post
    But people are losing their jobs if they refuse to participate in things that violate their moral conscience especially small business owners that the state has made law. By you stating that we should get rid of the law proves you realize this to be a fact.
    Actually my point on changing the law refers to the business owner having the right to refuse service to anyone for any reason. Your point of a person losing their job because they refuse to do something against their conscience however...well, I have no problem with someone being fired for refusing to do the work that they voluntarily signed up for. If they were forced to work in that business that would be one thing. But they are there voluntarily. As such I have no problem with them being fired for refusing to do the work because of a moral decision that they no doubt had before even applying for the job. For instance any Muslim that works at a grocery store is inevitibally going to have to handle pork and beer. Yet knowing that they still willingly apply for the job. If they refuse then it is their fault for applying for a job that they knew involved handling those two products that went against their religion. There are a billion jobs out there. There is no valid reason to apply to one that you know is going to conflict with your beliefs. And to get all pissy about it after the fact is just BS.
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    Re: Judge throws out Pennsylvania's ban on gay marriage

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    I don't believe judges are infallible. And I believe the argument in support of marriage for all would resonate better if it came from people's own beliefs and not those of judges, unless you or anyone else plans to never question the rulings of any judges on anything again. Me, I would never commit to that.

    I'll be asleep later (soon) so have a good night and we'll talk again soon!
    I'm under no illision as to the fallibility of judges. I fully believe that Obamacare mandate is unconstitutional and state it often. But I think we're getting mixed up in what we are talking about here. 1 judge I have no problem contesting. A panel of 9 judges I have no problem contesting. But I do start to think that maybe my reasoning may be off when 30+ judges that are not related or associated with each other in any way shape or form other than their rulings and them being a judge says that I'm wrong. I apply the same reasoning to many subjects. For instance climate change. I doubt that climate change is due to the result of mankind for various reasons which I won't get into here as this thread is not about that. But I rarely participate in that section on these forums because there are so many scientists saying that I'm wrong. I still believe that I'm right, but there is still a chance that I'm wrong also. Because I am human and fallible also. As such I pretty much keep my mouth closed except on rare occasions.
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    Re: Judge throws out Pennsylvania's ban on gay marriage

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Actually my point on changing the law refers to the business owner having the right to refuse service to anyone for any reason. Your point of a person losing their job because they refuse to do something against their conscience however...well, I have no problem with someone being fired for refusing to do the work that they voluntarily signed up for. If they were forced to work in that business that would be one thing. But they are there voluntarily. As such I have no problem with them being fired for refusing to do the work because of a moral decision that they no doubt had before even applying for the job. For instance any Muslim that works at a grocery store is inevitibally going to have to handle pork and beer. Yet knowing that they still willingly apply for the job. If they refuse then it is their fault for applying for a job that they knew involved handling those two products that went against their religion. There are a billion jobs out there. There is no valid reason to apply to one that you know is going to conflict with your beliefs. And to get all pissy about it after the fact is just BS.
    And my point was directed mainly to the small business owner who does not answer to another. And to the health care provider that faces multiple moral dilemmas within that profession or to those who work in social welfare positions where state/federal mandates force them to close their doors or because of moral conscience can no longer meet the mandates for funding so they shut down at the loss to society. All facets where moral conscience is not being protected.
    Last edited by vesper; 05-22-14 at 09:40 AM.

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    Re: Judge throws out Pennsylvania's ban on gay marriage

    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa View Post
    Thanks. Please point out anything in this passage that cant be applied to a gay couple as well?

    "The term “one flesh” means that just as our bodies are one whole entity and cannot be divided into pieces and still be a whole, so God intended it to be with the marriage relationship. There are no longer two entities (two individuals), but now there is one entity (a married couple). There are a number of aspects to this new union.

    As far as emotional attachments are concerned, the new unit takes precedence over all previous and future relationships (Genesis 2:24). Some marriage partners continue to place greater weight upon ties with parents than with the new partner. This is a recipe for disaster in the marriage and is a perversion of God’s original intention of “leaving and cleaving.” A similar problem can develop when a spouse begins to draw closer to a child to meet emotional needs rather than to his or her partner.

    Emotionally, spiritually, intellectually, financially, and in every other way, the couple is to become one."
    It mentions 'husband and wife' or 'man and woman' more then a few times but, never man and man or woman and woman.

    Catch the drift.
    32 “Whoever acknowledges me before others, I will also acknowledge before my Father in heaven. 33 But whoever disowns me before others, I will disown before my Father in heaven.
    Matt. 10:32-33

  10. #630
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    Re: Judge throws out Pennsylvania's ban on gay marriage

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    The difference between me & you, Deuce, is I pointed out your hypocrisy. As I said (and you apparently missed), you are free to insult them all you want. But be prepared to have it called out that you are insuting their protected Constitutional rights.

    I don't expect you to understand the distinction.
    You are the one misunderstanding. I'm not insulting their right. I'm not suggesting it's bad that they express their opinion. I'm suggesting their opinion is bad. Quit trying to play the victim card about someone else's right that isn't being attacked. They get to talk all day long about how much they hate gay people. I encourage them to express their opinions, in fact, because every GOP candidate who goes rabidly anti-equality is just another potential target in the next election. The social ultraconservatives keep snatching defeat from the jaws of victory for the Republicans.

    How come you haven't said one word about those types insulting people like me? Or homosexuals? How come you haven't cried about them attacking my rights? How come you are attacking my rights right now?
    He touched her over her bra and underpants, she says, and guided her hand to touch him over his underwear
    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    We’ll say what? Something like “nothing happened” ... Yeah, we might say something like that.

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