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Thread: Geithner: White House Wanted Me to Lie on Sunday Shows

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    Re: Geithner: White House Wanted Me to Lie on Sunday Shows

    Quote Originally Posted by jonny5 View Post
    So you intentionally embrace the dishonest party that screws you over 80% of the time, because at least you arent getting screwed 100% of the time. Can you understand why we independents shake our heads?
    yet you independents continue to play the game of politics regardless.
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    Re: Geithner: White House Wanted Me to Lie on Sunday Shows

    Quote Originally Posted by Fearandloathing View Post
    And this perpetuates the myth...To reverse the debate to one of the right demanding proof [thanks for the buzzword "empirical"] of the "lack" of bias is dishonest. and typical of the academic based socialist ideologue. You simply cannot prove a negative. Ever, even in the socialist universe.YOU must first show what can be shown, that FOX is biased in its news reporting, as, I believe has been adequately demonstrated that "Media Matters" is a self described left wing ideological outlet with no distinction made between news and op ed. and there is where the left continues to fail, one is not knowing the difference and two, not actually watching Fox, it's news OR opinion shows, but rather repeat the talking point meme...
    `
    You want to see another big word and be really impressed? You sir, are a classic example of Epistemic Closure. What, you may ask, is that?

    Well; to put it in the colloquial, it means reality is defined by a multimedia array of interconnected and cross promoting conservative blogs, radio programs, magazines, and of course, faux news. Whatever conflicts with that reality can be dismissed out of hand because it comes from the liberal media, and is therefore ipso facto not to be trusted. (How do you know they’re liberal? Well, they disagree with the conservative media!) This is epistemic closure.

    Another point, Media Matters isn't the only organization that keeps an eye on what faux news says, to wit;

    NewsHounds - NewsHounds

    FoxAttacks - FOX Attacks: They Distort. We Reply.

    FauxNewsChannel - FOX: The Most Ridiculed Name in News

    Fauxnewsboycott - Fox News Boycott | FNC truth, lies and advertisers exposed!

    News Corpse - News Corpse | The Internet's Chronicle of Media Decay

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    Re: Geithner: White House Wanted Me to Lie on Sunday Shows

    Quote Originally Posted by Paxaeon View Post
    `
    You want to see another big word and be really impressed? You sir, are a classic example of Epistemic Closure. What, you may ask, is that?

    Well; to put it in the colloquial, it means reality is defined by a multimedia array of interconnected and cross promoting conservative blogs, radio programs, magazines, and of course, faux news. Whatever conflicts with that reality can be dismissed out of hand because it comes from the liberal media, and is therefore ipso facto not to be trusted. (How do you know they’re liberal? Well, they disagree with the conservative media!) This is epistemic closure.

    Another point, Media Matters isn't the only organization that keeps an eye on what faux news says, to wit;

    NewsHounds - NewsHounds

    FoxAttacks - FOX Attacks: They Distort. We Reply.

    FauxNewsChannel - FOX: The Most Ridiculed Name in News

    Fauxnewsboycott - Fox News Boycott | FNC truth, lies and advertisers exposed!

    News Corpse - News Corpse | The Internet's Chronicle of Media Decay



    fast track to ignore...

    personal insults are childish, have fun in the sand box
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    Re: Geithner: White House Wanted Me to Lie on Sunday Shows

    Quote Originally Posted by jonny5 View Post
    So you intentionally embrace the dishonest party that screws you over 80% of the time, because at least you arent getting screwed 100% of the time. Can you understand why we independents shake our heads?
    I could vote for independents, but we have a two party system in this country. I don't care who's running in 2016, I'd bet my house and all I own that a democrat or a republican will win, but am quite sure I won't find a fool to take the other side of that bet. So, given that reality, I choose between one of the two who can win an election. Ron Paul even gets that - he a REPUBLICAN Congressman, and ran last time as a REPUBLICAN candidate for POTUS, not as a libertarian.

    During the primary, I vote for my preferred candidate even if it's my opinion that candidate will not win. Doesn't matter, I want to express my preference at that point in the process. But when it comes to the general election, I vote between the two major party candidates - don't see any strategic value in casting a protest vote for a candidate that might pull 10% on a record day. And, yes, the lesser of bad options is less bad.

    BTW, the Green Party pushes for instant run off voting. If libertarians or other third parties really want their candidates to have a chance to win, it's a mystery why they don't actively push for this system. It allows people to cast a vote for a long shot, and still have their vote count if as expected (and is nearly always the case) the race comes down to one of the two major party candidates
    Last edited by JasperL; 05-15-14 at 02:25 PM.

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    Re: Geithner: White House Wanted Me to Lie on Sunday Shows

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    I could vote for independents, but we have a two party system in this country. I don't care who's running in 2016, I'd bet my house and all I own that a democrat or a republican will win, but am quite sure I won't find a fool to take the other side of that bet. So, given that reality, I choose between one of the two who can win an election. Ron Paul even gets that - he a REPUBLICAN Congressman, and ran last time as a REPUBLICAN candidate for POTUS, not as a libertarian.

    During the primary, I vote for my preferred candidate even if it's my opinion that candidate will not win. Doesn't matter, I want to express my preference at that point in the process. But when it comes to the general election, I vote between the two major party candidates - don't see any strategic value in casting a protest vote for a candidate that might pull 10% on a record day. And, yes, the lesser of bad options is less bad.

    BTW, the Green Party pushes for instant run off voting. If libertarians or other third parties really want their candidates to have a chance to win, it's a mystery why they don't actively push for this system. It allows people to cast a vote for a long shot, and still have their vote count if as expected (and is nearly always the case) the race comes down to one of the two major party candidates
    Case in point. All you care about is winning. Youre just as bad as the people you hate.

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    Re: Geithner: White House Wanted Me to Lie on Sunday Shows

    Quote Originally Posted by Unitedwestand13 View Post
    yet you independents continue to play the game of politics regardless.
    There is nothing wrong with politics. Only how the two parties have abused it.

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    Re: Geithner: White House Wanted Me to Lie on Sunday Shows

    Quote Originally Posted by jonny5 View Post
    There is nothing wrong with politics. Only how the two parties have abused it.
    and yet independents don't form their own party and try to change the system.
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    Re: Geithner: White House Wanted Me to Lie on Sunday Shows

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    I'm choosing between the two available choices, and it's my view that the GOP (and right wing in general) is pursuing ends that are actively destructive and has no positive agenda at all. I'm not naive enough to believe that as a rule, results under Democrats are much better, but the difference is Republicans openly embrace the faults that Democrats try to hide - namely that they're owned and respond only to the interests of the plutocrats.

    And I am sympathetic to libertarian ideas, but as a practical matter believe they'd be disastrous if applied in the real world. A simple example why is pollution. Libertarians would eliminate the EPA, and then assert that people damaged by pollution simply sue to protect their own property rights and to get reimbursed when a polluter damages them. OK, great plan. But in general the harm I can demonstrate in court from, say, dirty air is either small (harder to breath, cannot see the nearby mountains) or hard to prove (lung disease can be caused by many factors, how do I prove it was pollution, and specifically the defendant's pollution, that caused my cancer - could be pollution from this other business... etc.). And a big polluter can, with ease, tie me up in court for years, require me to spend $100s of thousands or $millions, to prove damage and then survive appeals. Obviously, a lawsuit only makes sense if it's a class action suit. But right wingers want to make those suits harder to bring, and limit damages when plaintiffs win. Also, libertarians support the ability of polluters to spend unlimited sums to elect officials, including the judges, who would hear those suits. Obviously that tilts the odds against plaintiffs even more. I could go on...
    As long as people like you and your brethren continue to send pieces of **** to congress, we will continue to get what we have.

    I dont care if you vote Libertarian and I have no illusions on their chances. They are a better alternative to voting lock step for garbage. You dont challenge your party. Partisan republicans dont challenge their party. As a result they are free to act in the interest of party and not country.

    There are things about the Libertarian party I dont agree with. You never have to agree on every issue. I think many peoples ideas on a 'real' Libertarian government are foolish. Great in fairy tale land but not practical in the real world. Thats one of the reasons why the Libertarians remain a non player, even though the libertarian message of increased personal freedom and smaller more responsible federal government resonates with so many people.

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    Re: Geithner: White House Wanted Me to Lie on Sunday Shows

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    As long as people like you and your brethren continue to send pieces of **** to congress, we will continue to get what we have.

    I dont care if you vote Libertarian and I have no illusions on their chances. They are a better alternative to voting lock step for garbage. You dont challenge your party. Partisan republicans dont challenge their party. As a result they are free to act in the interest of party and not country.

    There are things about the Libertarian party I dont agree with. You never have to agree on every issue. I think many peoples ideas on a 'real' Libertarian government are foolish. Great in fairy tale land but not practical in the real world. Thats one of the reasons why the Libertarians remain a non player, even though the libertarian message of increased personal freedom and smaller more responsible federal government resonates with so many people.
    then why does the libertarian party never try to win local elections first?
    "If you can't stand the way this place is, Take yourself to higher places!"
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    Re: Geithner: White House Wanted Me to Lie on Sunday Shows

    Quote Originally Posted by Unitedwestand13 View Post
    and yet independents don't form their own party and try to change the system.
    Parties are the problem, not the solution.

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