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Thread: Supreme Court ruling favors prayer at council meeting [W:93:217]

  1. #181
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    Re: Supreme Court ruling favors prayer at council meeting

    Quote Originally Posted by Kreton View Post
    Again you aren't answering the question.
    You are comparing entertainment to TALKING TO GOD. That is a false equivalency. While you see prayer as a benign activity, it's a religious ritual. Your religion offends me. Your neighbor's religion offends me. Nobody should have the right to use a public business forum to impose their religion on me when I'm at a public/government environment seeking solutions or raising concerns about my community, or problem solving pubic issues...and I and everybody else becomes a captured audience to your praying. I don't care why you want to pray, just do it where others who don't subscribe to your beliefs aren't infringe on.

    Holding people captive in an government meeting and dumping religion on them is NOT separation of church and state. Yes, captive. These venues are NOT for religious rituals, but anyone wanted to confront their local governments over public issues....are forced to listen to a religious ritual. NO, I'm NOT ****ing leaving. I want the ritual to leave. It has no place in public meetings that are important for addressing community, state, or higher issues.


    At any any given public meeting - unless in a purely ethnic community, there will be a majority number in attendance who subscribe to a given religion along with varying minority numbers who subscribe to other religions. Some have no religious affiliations. Somehow I doubt that prayers invoked in public meetings will be simultaneously congruent to the beliefs among all attending.

    People of different religious beliefs have the tendency to want to systematically cull out those with differing beliefs - if given the chance. A predominate religious belief within a given district can impact the outcome of public issues. So the question is: Are those outcomes always going to be good for the community at large? Maybe ...but maybe not. Depends on how minority groups or individuals are affected.

    250 years ago the Framers were very much aware of the strife and bloodshed caused by religion in Europe that it was on the top of the list of the Bill of Rights, which prevented government from creating a religion or allow any given religion of authority over government. And for good reason. People have wars over religion because people don't want a particular faith to be infringed on. The numbers of types of Religious beliefs in our country alone are MANY. And even ones that are considered to be closely related can't even agree on what they believe.

    History tells us all that religion and government don't mix or go together very well. Religions, even today feel compelled to want to control the workings of government. The Pope would be sitting in the Oval Office today...if he could...and I mean in a heart beat. So would the Mullah in Iran.

    I bet few people in this forum can't even post alike reasons for why they pray. Or how they pray. Or even what they think prayer is...or isn't.

  2. #182
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    Re: Supreme Court ruling favors prayer at council meeting

    Quote Originally Posted by Filthy McNasty View Post
    There really is something special about someone using numbers they created themselves, to say that the country that leads in that stat is falling "behind".

    The word "cling" is one you drug into this is one of your previous post instead of addressing what was said to you. I see you still can't address anything said to you, but you say you are up for days more of this? No doubt you'd love several more days to try and explain how your tortured rationale really really is all about "seperation of church and state". Except you don't have the slightest grasp of the matter. Particularly since you keep trying to act as if a prayer before a meeting is the government (either at the local or national level) trying to establish a religion. Which is just asinine.
    My tortured rationale is simple. Your religion offends me. Your neighbors religion offends me. When people go to public/government meetings it's to address community concerns, issues, or problems. But once getting to a government building are town hall meeting to all who attend for government business is virtually forced to listen to a religious ritual, which may well infringe on their personal beliefs.

    But your tortured rationale is embedded in the inability to understand the meaning of Separation of Church and State and all of the underlying issues that go with it. You're stuck in some naive assumption that religious rituals performed in government/public forums are just a little benign icebreakers use to crank up the meeting.

  3. #183
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    Re: Supreme Court ruling favors prayer at council meeting

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    Starting off a meeting with a Christian prayer establishes Christianity as a part of that meeting.
    Not in the last few hundred years. Nor has the practice lead to the establishment of a national religion. Not that you and like minded souls realize that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Removable Mind View Post
    My tortured rationale is simple. Your religion offends me. Your neighbors religion offends me. When people go to public/government meetings it's to address community concerns, issues, or problems. But once getting to a government building are town hall meeting to all who attend for government business is virtually forced to listen to a religious ritual, which may well infringe on their personal beliefs.

    But your tortured rationale is embedded in the inability to understand the meaning of Separation of Church and State and all of the underlying issues that go with it. You're stuck in some naive assumption that religious rituals performed in government/public forums are just a little benign icebreakers use to crank up the meeting.
    The separation of church and state is a fine thing, which I support whole heartedly. Your brain rape of it, not so much. You just keep repeating yourself and repeating your avoidance of pretty much everything not said by you.

    As for the fact that you are offended? Once again it is time for Mr. Fry to remind us about your right to be offended and its importance in the grand scheme of things.
    Fry Offended.jpg

  4. #184
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    Re: Supreme Court ruling favors prayer at council meeting

    Quote Originally Posted by Filthy McNasty View Post
    Not in the last few hundred years. Nor has the practice lead to the establishment of a national religion. Not that you and like minded souls realize that.

    The separation of church and state is a fine thing, which I support whole heartedly. Your brain rape of it, not so much. You just keep repeating yourself and repeating your avoidance of pretty much everything not said by you.

    As for the fact that you are offended? Once again it is time for Mr. Fry to remind us about your right to be offended and its importance in the grand scheme of things.

    Despite your confusion about the topic, let me share with you that you don't support Separation of Church and State. You simply can't grasp the magnitude of it's relevance to our way of life...that it's the only thing that keeps us from falling into religious oppression. You don't get it...and I get that you don't get it. Obviously there are a number of folks in the DP forum who doesn't get it.

    Me...Whine? Moi? You've been co-opted into believing that church and government can work in concert. Praise be to the lord.

    Most people in this forum can't even define what prayer means or is. You are among those. If you had clue...you'd not be in support of religious rituals performed in government/public meetings, which are designed for the purpose of problem solving public issues.

    If people want to pray before a meeting is called into business...knock their ****ing lights out. Pray until they drop. Once they call a meeting to order and business begins the meeting is NOT a venue to impose religious rituals.

    Waddling in your ignorance regarding Separation of Church and State isn't making you shine.

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    Re: Supreme Court ruling favors prayer at council meeting

    Quote Originally Posted by Removable Mind View Post
    Despite your confusion about the topic, let me share with you that you don't support Separation of Church and State. You simply can't grasp the magnitude of it's relevance to our way of life...that it's the only thing that keeps us from falling into religious oppression. You don't get it...and I get that you don't get it. Obviously there are a number of folks in the DP forum who doesn't get it.

    Me...Whine? Moi? You've been co-opted into believing that church and government can work in concert. Praise be to the lord.

    Most people in this forum can't even define what prayer means or is. You are among those. If you had clue...you'd not be in support of religious rituals performed in government/public meetings, which are designed for the purpose of problem solving public issues.

    If people want to pray before a meeting is called into business...knock their ****ing lights out. Pray until they drop. Once they call a meeting to order and business begins the meeting is NOT a venue to impose religious rituals.

    Waddling in your ignorance regarding Separation of Church and State isn't making you shine.
    You just keep offering the same reheated and overheated pablum. You are proudly a member of the "I'm offended" brigade. Bad news for you is the answer is too bad, your being offended means nothing and is worth nothing. You will get to keep on being offended as prayer continues to be held before meetings from coast to coast. As it turns out, stamping your feet and complaining about what offends you does not equate the establishment of a national religion in this country. For the last few hundred years or the new few hundred.

  6. #186
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    Re: Supreme Court ruling favors prayer at council meeting

    Quote Originally Posted by Filthy McNasty View Post
    You just keep offering the same reheated and overheated pablum. You are proudly a member of the "I'm offended" brigade. Bad news for you is the answer is too bad, your being offended means nothing and is worth nothing. You will get to keep on being offended as prayer continues to be held before meetings from coast to coast. As it turns out, stamping your feet and complaining about what offends you does not equate the establishment of a national religion in this country. For the last few hundred years or the new few hundred.
    Yes, I do keep repeating. There's an old saying: "Repetition strengthens and confirms." I'm offended that people are violating not only my rights, but the rights of many. Religions don't have to right to impose their dogma on me. No matter the flavor.

    Religious rituals don't belong in government nor public meetings. That IS separation of church and state, which you simply don't support.

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    Re: Supreme Court ruling favors prayer at council meeting

    Quote Originally Posted by Removable Mind View Post
    Yes, I do keep repeating. There's an old saying: "Repetition strengthens and confirms." I'm offended that people are violating not only my rights, but the rights of many. Religions don't have to right to impose their dogma on me. No matter the flavor.

    Religious rituals don't belong in government nor public meetings. That IS separation of church and state, which you simply don't support.
    You just keep offering the same reheated and overheated pablum. You are proudly a member of the "I'm offended" brigade. Bad news for you is the answer is too bad! Your being offended means nothing and is worth nothing. You will get to keep on being offended as prayer continues to be held before meetings from coast to coast. As it turns out, stamping your feet and complaining about what offends you does not equate the establishment of a national religion in this country. For the last few hundred years or the new few hundred.

  8. #188
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    Re: Supreme Court ruling favors prayer at council meeting

    Quote Originally Posted by Filthy McNasty View Post
    You just keep offering the same reheated and overheated pablum. You are proudly a member of the "I'm offended" brigade. Bad news for you is the answer is too bad! Your being offended means nothing and is worth nothing. You will get to keep on being offended as prayer continues to be held before meetings from coast to coast. As it turns out, stamping your feet and complaining about what offends you does not equate the establishment of a national religion in this country. For the last few hundred years or the new few hundred.
    Repetition Strengthens and Confirms. You, sir, are anti-separations of church and state. You are in support of religious rituals in government/public meetings.

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    Re: Supreme Court ruling favors prayer at council meeting

    Quote Originally Posted by Removable Mind View Post
    Repetition Strengthens and Confirms. You, sir, are anti-separations of church and state. You are in support of religious rituals in government/public meetings.
    Sigh. Separation of church and state is not even in the Constitution.

  10. #190
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    Re: Supreme Court ruling favors prayer at council meeting

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    Sigh. Separation of church and state is not even in the Constitution.
    What does our First Amendment mean to you?

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