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Thread: Million-Dollar Home Sales Thrive While Low End Stumbles

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    Million-Dollar Home Sales Thrive While Low End Stumbles

    I guess the rich are "over taxed"?
    Whatever your view, one can say income/wealth distribution continually gets more lopsided leading, in the end, to a Worse economy.
    When there aren't enough Middle income/wealth consumers, (to buy TVs, cars, computers, middle/low price houses and all their accompanying needs) even the rich's portfolios and overall economy suffers.

    Stocks have done well mostly due to the recovery from the crash and very low rates, but Not much 'top-line' revenue growth.


    Million-Dollar Home Sales Thrive While Low End Stumbles

    By Prashant Gopal May 2, 2014
    Million-Dollar Home Sales Thrive While Low End Stumbles - Bloomberg



    Luxury-home sales are climbing as an improving economy and stocks that have almost tripled from 2009 lows bolster confidence among affluent buyers. At the same time, slow wagePhotographer: Emile Wamsteker/Bloomberg


    Million-dollar homes in the U.S. are selling at double their historical average while middle-class property demand stumbles, showing that the housing recovery is mirroring America’s wealth divide.

    Purchases costing $1 million or more rose 7.8% in March from a year earlier, according to data released last week by the National Association of Realtors. Transactions for $250,000 or less, which represent almost 2/3 of the market, plunged 12% in the period as house hunters found few available homes in that price range.

    Luxury-home sales are climbing as an improving economy and stocks that have almost tripled from 2009 lows bolster confidence among affluent buyers. At the same time, slow wage growth, tight credit standards and escalating prices are putting homeownership out of reach for many Americans. While investors drain the market of lower-end properties, builders are constructing more expensive houses that generate bigger profits.

    The real estate market is the ultimate reflection of confidence, wealth and income,” said Sam Khater, deputy chief economist at Irvine, California-based CoreLogic Inc.
    The same factors driving the income stagnation in the middle are driving the income momentum at the top.”
    [........]
    Last edited by mbig; 05-02-14 at 02:49 PM.
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    Re: Million-Dollar Home Sales Thrive While Low End Stumbles

    Only Rich People Can Afford to Buy Houses in SoCal Now
    April 17, 2014,
    Bianca Barragan
    Only Rich People Can Afford to Buy Houses in SoCal Now - State O' the Market - Curbed LA

    [........]
    An overall rise in home prices means that lower-priced houses are creeping up as well, but the low number of actual sales suggests that there aren't people who can afford them at such prices: Sales of $500,000 or less decreased by about 24%. This climate is making it harder for most homebuyers, but especially first-timers, a rep for the California Association of Realtors says.

    But people buying at the higher end of the market are doing juuuust fine. Sales of residences for $800,000 or more increased 12%, with bidding wars and the sale of million-dollar houses rising.
    In LA, nearly one-fifth of homes on the market are listed for $1 million or more, and in a select few fancy 'hoods, it's like the recession never even happened.
    I'm personally sick of not being able to dunk a basketball because of racism.
    anon

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    Re: Million-Dollar Home Sales Thrive While Low End Stumbles

    Lol !!

    What ? I told you the Housing market was crap, so you went out and Googled it, realized you were full of it, then came back and started this ridiculous thread

    And Stocks have done well due to the "recovery" from the crash ??

    You cant even be honest in your own assertions and no one is buying your Bull s***.

    Stocks are "doing well" because the Fed removed the risk AND lowered fixed yields so people are being forced to participate in a Stock Market thats completely detached from the economy.

    Stop the pumping and the Dow drops and everyone losses their ass.

    You want to Tax the rich to what ?? Bring back the Middle Class ?

    LOL !! Nonsense.

    And your'e a " financial advisor " ? For whom ? The DNC ?

    Its BECAUSE of Obama and the Democrats that the middle class are disappearing.

    From ObamaCare to tax increases on Capital Gains and Dividends, Liberal economic policies have ALWAYS attacked the Middle-class.

    You cant expect a "recovery" when through legislation you remive more and more of the Middle-class's discretionary income.

    Consumer spending accounts for 75 percent of our economy.

    So what happens when you give them less to spend ?

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    Re: Million-Dollar Home Sales Thrive While Low End Stumbles

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
    Lol !!
    What ? I told you the Housing market was crap, so you went out and Googled it, realized you were full of it, then came back and started this ridiculous thread
    :^)
    Check the OP. I started it May 2.
    Ooops!
    So I already knew what you said in the other string.
    What this elaborates/is New, is that while Overall sales are [recently] down 10-14%, High end sales are doing fine/up!


    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton
    And Stocks have done well due to the "recovery" from the crash ??
    You cant even be honest in your own assertions and no one is buying your Bull s***.
    Stocks are "doing well" because the Fed removed the risk AND lowered fixed yields so people are being forced to participate in a Stock Market thats completely detached from the economy.
    Multiples have increased due to low rates but the market is NOT "completely detached from the economy".
    The Fed understands the wealth effect works ON the economy too.
    What growth we've had is 150% attributable to the FED.
    It would have been Negative without it.
    Again, the tricky part is the unwind.


    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton

    Stop the pumping and the Dow drops and everyone losses their ass.
    I'm curious what's going to happen myself.
    But AGAIN, it was a no-brainer to save the financial infrastructure the FED did.


    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton

    You want to Tax the rich to what ?? Bring back the Middle Class ?
    LOL !! Nonsense.
    What do YOU propose to bring back the Middle Class?
    Cutting taxes on the rich/corporations?
    BOTH have more cash than ever/Record hoards, just No reason to invest because there is NO [middle] to sell to.
    We pay them too little, export their jobs, and bring in illegals to compete.... don't want to increase the Minimum wage either.
    Talk about a squeeze!

    Every Penny you take from the middle/bottom comes right out of the economy/Walmart etc. Every penny.
    While if you tax the riches 3rd/10th Million it doesn't hurt the economy barely at all.
    There is no one to tax but the rich IF you are interested in economic growth.


    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton
    And your'e a " financial advisor " ? For whom ? The DNC ?
    Its BECAUSE of Obama and the Democrats that the middle class are disappearing.
    From ObamaCare to tax increases on Capital Gains and Dividends, Liberal economic policies have ALWAYS attacked the Middle-class.
    Obamacare raised Cap Gains on the Rich.
    The govt is a more efficient provider of health care in any case. (Medicare plows back 95% on care, pvt 85%)
    The USA is the only OECD country without Universal Healthcare and we pay DOUBLE what they do.


    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton
    You cant expect a "recovery" when through legislation you remive more and more of the Middle-class's discretionary income.
    Consumer spending accounts for 75 percent of our economy.
    So what happens when you give them less to spend ?
    Correct!
    So you would agree on Lowering the Middle Class/Bottom tax burden to stimulate the economy.
    That would mean a Relatively higher tax on the rich/more progressive tax to pay for it.

    Better yet, let's add a 10% Surtax on income over $1 million and earmark for infrastructure we need anyway.
    That creates necessary jobs and helps the economy.
    Takes money/Billions out of 3 month T-bills earning .1% where the very rich have stashed it for safety, and pumps into/thru the economy.
    Velocity.
    Last edited by mbig; 05-16-14 at 07:16 PM.
    I'm personally sick of not being able to dunk a basketball because of racism.
    anon

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    Re: Million-Dollar Home Sales Thrive While Low End Stumbles

    Quote Originally Posted by mbig View Post
    :^)
    Check the OP. I started it May 2.
    Ooops!
    So I already knew what you said in the other string.
    What this elaborates/is New, is that while Overall sales are [recently] down 10-14%, High end sales are doing fine/up!


    Multiples have increased due to low rates but the market is NOT "completely detached from the economy".
    The Fed understands the wealth effect works ON the economy too.
    What growth we've had is 150% attributable to the FED.
    It would have been Negative without it.
    Again, the tricky part is the unwind.


    I'm curious what's going to happen myself.
    But AGAIN, it was a no-brainer to save the financial infrastructure the FED did.



    What do YOU propose to bring back the Middle Class?
    Cutting taxes on the rich/corporations?
    BOTH have more cash than ever/Record hoards, just No reason to invest because there is NO [middle] to sell to.
    We pay them too little, export their jobs, and bring in illegals to compete.... don't want to increase the Minimum wage either.
    Talk about a squeeze!

    Every Penny you take from the middle/bottom comes right out of the economy/Walmart etc. Every penny.
    While if you tax the riches 3rd/10th Million it doesn't hurt the economy barely at all.
    There is no one to tax but the rich IF you are interested in economic growth.


    Obamacare raised Cap Gains on the Rich.
    The govt is a more efficient provider of health care in any case. (Medicare plows back 95% on care, pvt 85%)
    The USA is the only OECD country without Universal Healthcare and we pay DOUBLE what they do.


    Correct!
    So you would agree on Lowering the Middle Class/Bottom tax burden to stimulate the economy.
    That would mean a Relatively higher tax on the rich/more progressive tax to pay for it.

    Better yet, let's add a 10% Surtax on income over $1 million and earmark for infrastructure we need anyway.
    That creates necessary jobs and helps the economy.
    Takes money/Billions out of 3 month T-bills earning .1% where the very rich have stashed it for safety, and pumps into/thru the economy.
    Velocity.
    How to bring back the Middle-class ??

    Easy. Texas is doing it.

    A robust and booming economy because we apply Conservative economic policies and principles.

    We're # 45 on the list of states with the Highest tax burdens on our Citizens.

    We incentivize private sector investment, provide a businesses friendly atmosphere and its paying off.

    We're building on to a 10 Billion dollar SURPLUS and our Cities are Booming.

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    Re: Million-Dollar Home Sales Thrive While Low End Stumbles

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
    How to bring back the Middle-class ??
    Easy. Texas is doing it.
    A robust and booming economy because we apply Conservative economic policies and principles.
    We're # 45 on the list of states with the Highest tax burdens on our Citizens.
    We incentivize private sector investment, provide a businesses friendly atmosphere and its paying off.
    We're building on to a 10 Billion dollar SURPLUS and our Cities are Booming.
    North Dakota is 'doing it' too.
    It's a local ANOMALY called Fracking (and refining it in Houston etc)
    It's our Silver Lining in an otherwise structural/demographic bind.
    It's NOT the result of conservative economic policy.
    Before the oil mini-boom, Texas had some Big issues as recently as a few years ago.
    Take your pick.
    texas deficit - Google Search

    Of course, much of what I posted was left Unanswered.
    Last edited by mbig; 05-16-14 at 07:36 PM.
    I'm personally sick of not being able to dunk a basketball because of racism.
    anon

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    Re: Million-Dollar Home Sales Thrive While Low End Stumbles

    Wealth distribution in America is at close to the same rate it was in 1922. It's varied little up and down over the last 90 years. There is an I calculated difference though. The too 1% in 1922 was 1.1 million and today it's 3.1 million.

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    Re: Million-Dollar Home Sales Thrive While Low End Stumbles

    Quote Originally Posted by mbig View Post
    I guess the rich are "over taxed"?
    Whatever your view, one can say income/wealth distribution continually gets more lopsided leading, in the end, to a Worse economy.
    When there aren't enough Middle income/wealth consumers, (to buy TVs, cars, computers, middle/low price houses and all their accompanying needs) even the rich's portfolios and overall economy suffers.

    Stocks have done well mostly due to the recovery from the crash and very low rates, but Not much 'top-line' revenue growth.


    Million-Dollar Home Sales Thrive While Low End Stumbles

    By Prashant Gopal May 2, 2014
    Million-Dollar Home Sales Thrive While Low End Stumbles - Bloomberg



    Luxury-home sales are climbing as an improving economy and stocks that have almost tripled from 2009 lows bolster confidence among affluent buyers. At the same time, slow wagePhotographer: Emile Wamsteker/Bloomberg
    What's this? Only the elites can own homes in libtopia SoCal? Shocking.
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

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    Re: Million-Dollar Home Sales Thrive While Low End Stumbles

    Quote Originally Posted by mbig View Post
    North Dakota is 'doing it' too.
    It's a local ANOMALY called Fracking (and refining it in Houston etc)
    It's our Silver Lining in an otherwise structural/demographic bind.
    It's NOT the result of conservative economic policy.
    Before the oil mini-boom, Texas had some Big issues as recently as a few years ago.
    Take your pick.
    texas deficit - Google Search

    Of course, much of what I posted was left Unanswered.
    Nonsense.

    The Oil and Gas industry in Texas is only 10 percent of my States GDP.

    California has Silicon Valley which also represents around 10 percent of that States GDP AMD they're the fourth largest producer of Oil in our Nation.

    California is looking at 500 Billion in unfunded Pension Liabilities and its U6 numbers are 17 percent.

    So why the huge distinction ?

    Again, Texas is using Conservative economic policies to grow its economy.

    California is NOT.

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    Re: Million-Dollar Home Sales Thrive While Low End Stumbles

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
    Nonsense.
    The Oil and Gas industry in Texas is only 10 percent of my States GDP.
    California has Silicon Valley which also represents around 10 percent of that States GDP AMD they're the fourth largest producer of Oil in our Nation.
    California is looking at 500 Billion in unfunded Pension Liabilities and its U6 numbers are 17 percent.
    So why the huge distinction ?
    Again, Texas is using Conservative economic policies to grow its economy.
    California is NOT.
    March/ April/ May 2014
    Oops: The Texas Miracle That Isn’t
    Conservatives say the Lone Star state’s recent record of growth validates their economic agenda. That record crumbles upon inspection.
    By Phillip Longman
    Oops: The Texas Miracle That Isn’t by Phillip Longman | The Washington Monthly

    Unless you’ve been to Texas lately, you might have missed just how gigantic its latest oil and gas boom has become. Thanks to fracking and other new drilling techniques, plus historically high world oil prices, Texas oil production increased by 126% just between 2010 and 2013. Only a few years ago, Texas’s oil production had dwindled to just 15% of U.S. output; by May of last year it had jumped to 34.5%, as new drilling methods opened up vast new plays in once-forgotten corners of south and west Texas with names like Eagle Ford, Spraberry Trend, and Wolfcamp. Thanks to the bonanza of drilling, Texas already produces more oil than Venezuela, and is headed to become the 9th largest producer of oil in the world, ahead of Kuwait, Mexico, and Iraq. Meanwhile, Texas accounts for 27% of U.S. natural gas production, which is more than the production of any nation except Russia.....

    Though Texas boosters point to the growth of the high-tech industry in Austin, the so-called “telecom corridor” in Dallas, and the growth of health care jobs in Houston, this can’t hide the fact that oil and gas are by far the fastest-growing sources of the state’s economic growth. Between 1998 and 2011, for example, the percent of Texas GDP produced directly by oil and gas extraction more than doubled, according to the U.S. Commerce Department’s Bureau of Economic Analysis. This doesn’t even count the growth of related industries, like oil refining and a petrochemical sector now thriving on the state’s abundant supplies of natural gas. Meanwhile, the share of the Texas economy produced by the information, communications, and technology sectors is 27% smaller than it was in 1998.

    To be sure, only about 8% of the new jobs in Texas are directly involved in oil and gas extraction, but the multiplier effects of the energy boom create a compounding supply of jobs for accountants, lawyers, doctors, home builders, gardeners, nannies, you name it. Saying that Texas doesn’t depend very much on oil and gas just because most Texans are not formally employed in drilling wells is like saying that the New York area doesn’t depend very much on Wall Street because only a handful of New Yorkers work on the floor of the stock exchange.

    The next big question is how much Texas’s growth in jobs just reflects its growth in population. ... But in the conservative narrative, this population growth is largely driven by individual Americans and businesses fleeing the high taxes and excessive regulation of less-free states.
    [.......]
    For example, according to Census Bureau data, 441,682 native-born Americans moved to Texas from other states between 2010 and 2011. Sounds like a lot. But moving (fleeing?) in the opposite direction were 358,048 other native-born Americans leaving Texas behind. That means that the net domestic migration of native-born Americans to Texas came to just 83,634, which in a nation of 315 million isn’t even background noise. It’s the demographic equivalent of, say, the town of Lawrence, Kansas, or Germantown, Maryland, “voting with its feet” and moving to Texas while the rest of America stays put.

    And despite all the gloating by Texas boosters about how the state attracts huge numbers of Americans fleeing California socialism, the numbers don’t bear out this narrative either. In 2012, 62,702 people moved from California to Texas, but 43,005 moved from Texas to California, for a net migration of just 19,697. That’s a population flow amounting to the movement of one village in a continental nation. Far from proving the merits of the so-called Texas model, it shows just how few Californians have seen fit to set out for the Lone Star State, despite California’s high cost of housing and other very real problems. The same is true for all but a handful of Americans living in other states. Net domestic migration to Texas peaked after Hurricane Katrina devastated Louisiana and Mississippi, and has been falling off ever since.
    [......]
    This comparatively low level of net domestic migration to Texas is consistent with another little-appreciated fact that runs counter to the conservative narrative about the Texas Miracle. It is that, for most Americans, as well as for most businesses, moving to Texas would not mean paying less in taxes, and for many it would mean paying more.

    Oh yes, I know what you’ve heard. And it’s true, as the state’s boosters like to brag, that Texas does not have an income tax. But Texas has sales and property taxes that make its overall burden of taxation on low-wage families much heavier than the national average, while the state also taxes the middle class at rates as high or higher than in California.
    For instance, non-elderly Californians with family income in the middle 20% of the income distribution pay combined state and local taxes amounting to 8.2% of their income, according to the Institute on Taxation and Economic Policy; by contrast, their counterparts in Texas pay 8.6%.

    And unlike in California, middle-class families in Texas don’t get the advantage of having rich people share equally in the cost of providing government services. The top 1% in Texas have an effective tax rate of just 3.2%. That’s roughly two-fifths the rate that’s borne by the middle class, and just a quarter the rate paid by all those low-wage “takers” at the bottom 20% of the family income distribution. This Robin-Hood-in-reverse system gives Texas the fifth-most-regressive tax structure in the nation.
    [......]
    But most Texas businesses, especially small ones, don’t get such treatment. Instead, they face total effective tax rates that are, by bottom-line measures, greater than those in even the People’s Republic of California.
    For example, according to a joint study by the accounting firm Ernst & Young and the Council on State Taxation, in fiscal year 2012 state and local business taxes in California came to 4.5% of private-sector gross state product.
    This compares with a 4.8% average for all fifty states—and a rate of 5.2% in Texas. With the exception of New York, every major state in the country, including New Jersey, Massachusetts, Pennsylvania, Ohio, Michigan, Indiana, Illinois, Wisconsin, and Minnesota, has a Lower total effective business tax rate than Texas. If you think that means Texas might not offer as much “liberty” as advertised, well, you’re right.
    [......]
    More at link
    Last edited by mbig; 05-19-14 at 05:51 PM.
    I'm personally sick of not being able to dunk a basketball because of racism.
    anon

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