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Thread: United Church of Christ sues over NC ban on same-sex marriage

  1. #41
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    Re: Religious Group Files a Lawsuit Against North Carolina's Gay Marriage Ban

    Quote Originally Posted by Amandi View Post
    And the marriages they want to conduct arent legally recognized either, they are purely religous.
    But marriages in general are.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    They don't have to agree with the law, they just have to follow it remember? Now you are moving the goal posts. Pathetic.
    It's not moving the goal posts. It's pointing out that the two are fundamentally different in a way which renders the analogy invalid.

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    Educator Amandi's Avatar
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    Re: Religious Group Files a Lawsuit Against North Carolina's Gay Marriage Ban

    Quote Originally Posted by Paleocon View Post
    But marriages in general are.
    However, this law doesnt affect legal marriages only. It affects purely religous ones as well.

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    Re: Religious Group Files a Lawsuit Against North Carolina's Gay Marriage Ban

    Quote Originally Posted by Amandi View Post
    However, this law doesnt affect legal marriages only. It affects purely religous ones as well.
    Not if they're performed by entities which only perform purely religious ceremonies.

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    Re: Religious Group Files a Lawsuit Against North Carolina's Gay Marriage Ban

    Quote Originally Posted by Paleocon View Post
    The state should disallow fraudulent marriage ceremonies.
    ^
    And here, folks, we have Exhibit A. Someone who calls himself a proud paleocon, who claims he believes that we should have limited government, while supporting big government intrusion into the lives of those he disagrees with. That is not Conservatism, paleo or neo. That is hypocrisy.
    The ghost of Jack Kevorkian for President's Physician: 2016

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    Re: Religious Group Files a Lawsuit Against North Carolina's Gay Marriage Ban

    Quote Originally Posted by Amandi View Post
    They are not telling people how to vote...
    I didn't say they were.

    I said my mother's church was. My mother's church does tell people how to vote and they dropped their 501c3 and built a business onto the chapel to do it.

  6. #46
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    Re: Religious Group Files a Lawsuit Against North Carolina's Gay Marriage Ban

    Quote Originally Posted by Amandi View Post
    Go back to you posting the law, it is illegal for anybody who happens to be authorized to conduct a legal marriage ceremony to conduct a non-legal marriage. The tax exempt status doesnt matter. If that happens to be a minister in his own church, that is violating the 1st Ammendment. "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof..."
    In the eyes of the law, it's the tax exemption status which makes them a church in the first place. Remember, we're talking about the law, not logic, not common sense.

    If you aren't tax exempt, you aren't a church, even if you look like a church, have people you call 'clergy', have regular worship services, and operate under the authority of a Biship, you are still not a church in so far as the law is concerned. If you aren't tax-exempt, you are a business.

    They way I would handle this in JerryLand is reserve all solemnization authority over all marriage licenses to the Justice of the Peace.
    Last edited by Jerry; 04-30-14 at 04:00 PM.

  7. #47
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    Re: Religious Group Files a Lawsuit Against North Carolina's Gay Marriage Ban

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    ^
    And here, folks, we have Exhibit A. Someone who calls himself a proud paleocon, who claims he believes that we should have limited government, while supporting big government intrusion into the lives of those he disagrees with. That is not Conservatism, paleo or neo. That is hypocrisy.
    I take it you believe paleoconservatism to be simply an extreme version of neoconservativism. Paleoconservatism involves a rejection of classical liberalism.

    Tell me, do you really think that any medieval government would tolerate a same-sex marriage?

  8. #48
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    Re: Religious Group Files a Lawsuit Against North Carolina's Gay Marriage Ban

    Quote Originally Posted by Paleocon View Post
    It's not moving the goal posts. It's pointing out that the two are fundamentally different in a way which renders the analogy invalid.
    Whether YOU think it is evil or not is irrelevent, it would be law. You made the case that since it is law, they have to abide. So if the State makes a law that religious institutions have to hand out condoms, they would have to abide by the law.

    YOU don't get to decide what is evil or what to follow, the state would. That is the case you have argued with forcing a religious institiuons to NOT be able to marry SS couplese because it is against the law.

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    Re: Religious Group Files a Lawsuit Against North Carolina's Gay Marriage Ban

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    Whether YOU think it is evil or not is irrelevent, it would be law. You made the case that since it is law, they have to abide. So if the State makes a law that religious institutions have to hand out condoms, they would have to abide by the law.

    YOU don't get to decide what is evil or what to follow, the state would. That is the case you have argued with forcing a religious institiuons to NOT be able to marry SS couplese because it is against the law.
    It's not about my opinion, it's about objective facts.

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    Re: Religious Group Files a Lawsuit Against North Carolina's Gay Marriage Ban

    Quote Originally Posted by Paleocon View Post
    If a person presides over a marriage which is plainly invalid by law, they should be punished. UCC ministers (who aren't priests, BTW) are not above the law.
    And so there we have it. Paleocon has officially declared himself in opposition to the 1st Amendment.
    You can never be safe from a government that can keep you completely safe from each other and the world. You must choose.

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