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Thread: Cliven Bundy stands by racially charged comments, ‘That’s exactly.....[W:696:1188]

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    Re: Bundy questioned whether blacks were better off as slaves

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    So, the 'victim' of the incident says it happened, but since the liberal running the hall where they were speaking on a liberal campus, says it didn't so not only do we need corroboration, but the perps as well to admit that they threw them....If it were a black liberal that the cookies were thrown at, during a speech at a conservative campus like oh, say, Liberty University, then all we would need is an allegation....Nice how your world works....

    Kind of like Cleaver saying someone spit at him during the march to jam O-care down our throats, when no one out of the thousands of people with cell camera's that were there caught it....

    Keep up the double standards....We don't enough here that do that....
    I don't understand. I quoted Steele himself, twice, saying that no one threw cookies at him. He looked down and saw them. Your own source says as much. Where are you getting other information that trumps Steele's own description of what happened?

    And please don't tell me how I would respond to the scenario you proposed. I'll happily admit that both sides exhibit bad behavior. I acknowledge it when it happens, though none of it reflects my own views or actions. But I expect those claims to be backed by verifiable facts, which you have so far not presented.

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    Re: Bundy questioned whether blacks were better off as slaves

    Quote Originally Posted by HolyBull View Post
    I don't understand. I quoted Steele himself, twice, saying that no one threw cookies at him. He looked down and saw them. Your own source says as much. Where are you getting other information that trumps Steele's own description of what happened?

    And please don't tell me how I would respond to the scenario you proposed. I'll happily admit that both sides exhibit bad behavior. I acknowledge it when it happens, though none of it reflects my own views or actions. But I expect those claims to be backed by verifiable facts, which you have so far not presented.
    Oh, so someone dropped their oreo's on stage left eh? That it?

    If you are someone that actually acknowledges bad behavior on your own side, then I will be man enough to applaud that when I see it...I'll keep an eye open for that one...
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

    Alexis de Tocqueville

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    Re: Bundy questioned whether blacks were better off as slaves

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Oh, so someone dropped their oreo's on stage left eh? That it?

    If you are someone that actually acknowledges bad behavior on your own side, then I will be man enough to applaud that when I see it...I'll keep an eye open for that one...
    I attack bigoted behavior wherever I see it. Why should I defend people who do nothing but harm my cause and violate basic ethical principles?

    Like I don't particularly care for all of this hoopla over Mr. Bundy's remarks. There are more important issues involved with his story than what he thinks about "the negro," and his opinion, from the extended transcript, is a fairly common conservative one made more offensive by antiquated language and a poor understanding of history. Rubbing all this in conservatives' faces is a pointless waste of time, since it has no bearing on why so many conservatives initially supported Bundy.

    As for Steele, for what it's worth, there are too many revisions and conflicting versions to the story for me to make any final judgment. I'll choose to take Steele's word that he was never hit with an Oreo, but he did see two of them on the ground, and that the motives of the Oreo-droppers are unknown. I still don't know how this pertains to Keyes's treatment by the media and the general liberal sphere.

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    Re: Cliven Bundy stands by racially charged comments, ‘That’s exactly what I said’

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    Sure it is, but how can they be blamed for taking the easy way out if it's offered?
    Because that's what PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY is. If they take the easy way out it is THEM to blame.

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    Re: Cliven Bundy stands by racially charged comments, ‘That’s exactly what I said’

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    Because that's what PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY is. If they take the easy way out it is THEM to blame.
    Look, welfare has been around since the 60s. Since then, the poverty rate has remained about the same while the number of single parent families has soared. Welfare is a trap that the unwitting, though thoroughly responsible, fall into. Once in, they find that they cannot get out because it simply makes no economic sense to take the kind of job they can get over taking welfare. So, no matter who's fault it is, once on welfare, it is incredibly difficult to get off it. If it didn't exist, they wouldn't be trapped into it.
    ”People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.” --- Ben Franklin

    Quote Originally Posted by The German View Post
    Sterotypes are mostly based on truths.

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    Re: Cliven Bundy stands by racially charged comments, ‘That’s exactly what I said’

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    Look, welfare has been around since the 60s. Since then, the poverty rate has remained about the same while the number of single parent families has soared. Welfare is a trap that the unwitting, though thoroughly responsible, fall into. Once in, they find that they cannot get out because it simply makes no economic sense to take the kind of job they can get over taking welfare. So, no matter who's fault it is, once on welfare, it is incredibly difficult to get off it. If it didn't exist, they wouldn't be trapped into it.
    You are again dodging the person and trying to lay blame to a system. Much like the left has done with blaming guns instead of the person, you are blaming welfare instead of the person.

    If a person wanted to get off welfare the right CONSTANTLY says they are able to. So it's not welfare, its the person.

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    Re: Cliven Bundy stands by racially charged comments, ‘That’s exactly what I said’

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    According to the right a person can get off welfare if they really wanted to. Again, personal responsibility. So you are again dodging the person and trying to lay blame. Much like the left has done with blaming guns instead of the person, you are blaming welfare instead of the person.
    I'm not blaming welfare instead of the person. The person has a choice. What I'm saying is that the choice is a trap that they didn't expect.
    ”People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.” --- Ben Franklin

    Quote Originally Posted by The German View Post
    Sterotypes are mostly based on truths.

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    Re: Cliven Bundy stands by racially charged comments, ‘That’s exactly what I said’

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    I'm not blaming welfare instead of the person. The person has a choice. What I'm saying is that the choice is a trap that they didn't expect.
    Oh come on, "a trap they didn't expect"? What "traps" them?

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    Re: Cliven Bundy stands by racially charged comments, ‘That’s exactly what I said’

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    Oh come on, "a trap they didn't expect"? What "traps" them?
    The fact that they can get as much from welfare, or very nearly as much (sometimes more), as they could at any job they're likely to qualify for. Then their children who, are raised on welfare, come to know it as a way of life...normal...what they are supposed to do.

    I personally know people that are third and fourth generation welfare recipients.
    Last edited by mac; 04-29-14 at 09:47 PM.
    ”People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.” --- Ben Franklin

    Quote Originally Posted by The German View Post
    Sterotypes are mostly based on truths.

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    Re: Cliven Bundy stands by racially charged comments, ‘That’s exactly what I said’

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    The fact that they can get as much from welfare, or very nearly as much (sometimes more), as they could at any job they're likely to qualify for. Then their children who, are raised on welfare, come to know it as a way of life...normal...what they are supposed to do.

    I personally know people that are third and fourth generation welfare recipients.
    Again, that's not a trap, that's an abuse of the system BY THE PERSON. Not the systems fault, it is the person's own fault and noone else's.

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