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Thread: Cliven Bundy stands by racially charged comments, ‘That’s exactly.....[W:696:1188]

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    Re: Cliven Bundy stands by racially charged comments, ‘That’s exactly what I said’[W:

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    You are speaking gibberish in an attempt to deflect from being wrong.

    You have twice been proven wrong and had it pointed out by more than one person. All because you did not understand what the percentages you chose to use represented.

    And not those were not my stats or provided by me.
    They were first provided here:and then here:My referring to what was provided by another and stating that it also supports the fact that blacks receive more welfare than whites does not make them my stats.

    Regardless, you still did not understand what the percentages represented and were continuously shown to be wrong.
    And all you can do now is try to deflect, because you can not be honest enough to admit you were wrong.


    sigh

    How pathetic.
    He was speaking of concern, not disparagement, hatred or intolerance.
    Yet here you are doing exactly that.
    Figures.
    Why would someone knowingly post false statistics?

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    Re: Cliven Bundy stands by racially charged comments, ‘That’s exactly what I said’

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    But he used a blanket statement to present ALL BLACK PEOPLE in terms of his world view.
    That exists solely in your own non-objective thoughts.
    In context it is clear he is referring to those involved with welfare.
    Not the race as a whole.
    So all you are doing his displaying your own biased thoughts.


    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    Some people defend him simply because of his poor choice of words.
    No one defends him because of a poor choice of words.
    He is defended against the false claims of racism/racist, as he did not not say anything racist.


    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    He receives no such pass from me.
    He needs no such pass as nothing he said is/was racist.
    Those false claims come from the actual racist.


    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    No one who makes such a bold claim that people of my race would be better off as slaves
    And he never said that.
    But you have made it clear where your inability to look at this objectively has come from. Misplaced anger. So sad.
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    Re: Cliven Bundy stands by racially charged comments, ‘That’s exactly what I said’[W:

    Quote Originally Posted by AJiveMan View Post
    Why would someone knowingly post false statistics?
    I see you are lost and have no idea of what you speak, again.
    You were the one repeatedly using the stats and didn't even understand what they represented.
    That doesn't make them false. That make you ignorant of what they meant.
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    Re: Cliven Bundy stands by racially charged comments, ‘That’s exactly what I said’[W:

    Earlier when referenced, I said (if their numbers were accurate).
    I have no idea if they are, or what they are using in total to come to such conclusion.
    But it is what they list as over-all stats.
    Welfare Demographics
    Percent of recipients who are white 38.8 %
    Percent of recipients who are black 39.8 %
    [/INDENT]

    Under this blacks receive more welfare.


    The other point was specifically about the snap benefits by respective population.

    Of which roughly 26% of the black population receive, as compared to roughly 7% of the white population that receives them.
    If you do not understand that, it means that black receive snap benefits in a disproportionately higher number in regards to respective population than white do.

    So, the whole premise of these statistics is FALSE and the statistics too are FALSE.

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    Re: Cliven Bundy stands by racially charged comments, ‘That’s exactly what I said’

    Excon,

    Here's Cliven Bundy's statement again in his own words:

    ... and so what I've testified to you -- I was in the Watts riot, I seen the beginning fire and I seen that last fire. What I seen is civil disturbance. People are not happy, people are thinking they don't have their freedoms, they didn't have these things, and they didn't have them.

    We've progressed quite a bit from that day until now, and we sure don't want to go back. We sure don't want the colored people to go back to that point. We sure don't want these Mexican people to go back to that point. And we can make a difference right now by taking care of some of these bureaucracies, and do it in a peaceful way.

    Let me tell, talk to you about the Mexicans, and these are just things I know about the negroes. I want to tell you one more thing I know about the negro. When I go, went, go to Las Vegas, North Las Vegas, and I would see these little government houses, and in front of that government house the door was usually open and the older people and the kids -- and there's always at least a half a dozen people sitting on the porch. They didn’t have nothing to do. They didn’t have nothing for their kids to do. They didn’t have nothing for their young girls to do.

    And because they were basically on government subsidy -- so now what do they do? They abort their young children, they put their young men in jail, because they never, they never learned how to pick cotton. And I’ve often wondered are they were better off as slaves, picking cotton and having a family life and doing things? Or are they better off under government subsidy?

    You know they didn’t get more freedom, they got less freedom -- they got less family life, and their happiness -- you could see it in their faces -- they wasn't happy sitting on that concrete sidewalk. Down there they was probably growing their turnips -- so that’s all government, that’s not freedom.

    Now, let me talk about the Spanish people. You know, I understand that they come over here against our Constitution and cross our borders. But they’re here and they’re people -- and I’ve worked side by side a lot of them.

    Don’t tell me they don’t work, and don’t tell me they don’t pay taxes. And don’t tell me they don’t have better family structures than most of us white people. When you see those Mexican families, they’re together, they picnic together, they’re spending their time together, and I’ll tell you in my way of thinking they’re awful nice people. And we need to have those people join us and be with us not, not come to our party.
    In each case, he may have believed he was speaking from a position of compassion, but he used blanket statements to make his point concerning Blacks (Negros), Mexicans and Spanish speaking people.

    When speaking about Blacks, he would have been better off limiting his critique to only those Blacks who lived in government housing in Los Vegas. At least then people would know he was referring only to a small segment of Blacks who lived in a certain area/neighborhood he's seen in decline with his own eyes. Instead, he included ALL BLACKS in his rant and put down Black people and only Black people in his commentary.

    Whether you want to believe it or not, his words WERE a blanket condemnation of Blacks in America and they were racists! Of course, you'll come back here and post once again that it was just a poor choice of words Bundy used and that may be true, but the words that did come out of his mouth were racists in nature. There's just no way to defend him on that.
    Last edited by Objective Voice; 05-04-14 at 12:49 PM.
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    Re: Cliven Bundy stands by racially charged comments, ‘That’s exactly what I said’

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    Excon,

    Here's Cliven Bundy's statement again in his own words:



    In each case, he may have believed he was speaking from a position of compassion, but he used blanket statements to make his point concerning Blacks (Negros), Mexicans and Spanish speaking people.

    When speaking about Blacks, he would have been better off limiting his critique to only those Blacks who lived in government housing in Los Vegas. At least then people would know he was referring only to a small segment of Blacks who lived in a certain area/neighborhood he's seen in decline with his own eyes. Instead, he included ALL BLACKS in his rant and put down Black people and only Black people in his commentary.

    Whether you want to believe it or not, his words WERE a blanket condemnation of Blacks in America and they were racists! Of course, you'll come back here and post once again that it was just a poor choice of words Bundy used and that may be true, but the words that did come out of his mouth were racists in nature. There's just no way to defend him on that.
    Some people believe Bundy went too far with his comments, some believe he didn't go far enough and defend this man.

    If the man were a smart or intelligent person, he would have engaged his brain before his seemingly endless ramblings. He's a person that doesn't know when to just shut up or not say anything at all. He should have just commented on his personal experiences with dealing with the fed and left it at that.

    Sure, he has every right to freedom of speech, but when he denigrates an entire group of people or persons, he will pay a hefty price for it. As it is, people painted him as a racist. He'll be sorry one day for his comments, if he already isn't. But I'd heard he doubled down on his comments, so he's really treading into dangerous territory for himself and his associates.

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    Re: Cliven Bundy stands by racially charged comments, ‘That’s exactly what I said’

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    but he used blanket statements to make his point concerning Blacks (Negros), Mexicans and Spanish speaking people.
    Wrong.
    He spoke specifically of segments. That is your fault for not noticing that.
    That is your bias influencing your own thoughts.
    And your thoughts happen to be wrong.


    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    When speaking about Blacks, he would have been better off limiting his critique to only those Blacks who lived in government housing in Los Vegas. At least then people would know he was referring only to a small segment of Blacks who lived in a certain area/neighborhood he's seen in decline with his own eyes.
    He did. And we know that by context.


    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    Instead, he included ALL BLACKS in his rant and put down Black people and only Black people in his commentary.
    Wrong. That is nothing other than your own prejudices coming into play and not allowing you to see context.


    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    his words WERE a blanket condemnation of Blacks in America and they were racists!
    Wrong.


    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    but the words that did come out of his mouth were racists in nature.
    Wrong.


    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    There's just no way to defend him on that.
    As nothing he said was racist there is no treason to defend such, but he should be defended against ridiculous claims of racism/racist like you are making.
    They are nothing more than bs coming from your own prejudicial and racial thoughts.
    “The law is reason, free from passion.”
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    Re: Cliven Bundy stands by racially charged comments, ‘That’s exactly what I said’[W:

    Quote Originally Posted by AJiveMan View Post
    So, the whole premise of these statistics is FALSE and the statistics too are FALSE.
    Again you are lost and have no idea of what you speak.
    You were the one repeatedly using the stats and didn't even understand what they represented.
    That doesn't make them false. That make[s] you ignorant of what they meant.

    As the above was already said, what is it you do not understand about the underlined?

    As for what you quote of me (which shows your previous argument to be dishonest, as this shows you knew)
    that speaks specifically to not knowing what welfare programs it included. Not that the information is false.
    It is pretty sad that I have to explain these thing to you.

    And then we go right back to the beginning of this exchange to see that I was using specific program numbers of Snap and TANF.
    Both showing that blacks, by respective population, receive disproportionately more welfare than whites do.

    I then pointed out that those percentages as provided by others (the 38.8 and 39.8 percentages) 1. Support that finding, and 2. Show that blacks receive more period.
    It was then that you chose to run with those percentages not understanding what they showed and erroneously arguing they showed something they don't.
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    Re: Cliven Bundy stands by racially charged comments, ‘That’s exactly what I said’

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    Had you paid attention you would have known it has already been stated.

    He is referring to work ethic.
    So then wouldn't he say "the never learned work ethic?" He said that they aborted their children and put their young men in jail because they never learned how to pick cotton. That is super racist. I have no idea why you're defending this guy. Either he said "they never learned how to pick cotton" because he sees black people as cotton pickers, or because he's used to thinking about them as cotton pickers. Which takes me back to: he's either ignorant and grew up in a racist environment, or he is racist.

    You also said that he was talking about "the negro entrapped by welfare." No, he was talking about black people. Your opinion that he made that distinction comes from actually ignoring what he said rather than referencing it.
    A working class hero is something to be

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    Re: Cliven Bundy stands by racially charged comments, ‘That’s exactly what I said’

    Quote Originally Posted by Mustachio View Post
    So then wouldn't he say "the never learned work ethic?" He said that they aborted their children and put their young men in jail because they never learned how to pick cotton. That is super racist.
    iLOL No it isn't.
    Being poorly spoken or unable to express his thoughts clearly does not make a person racist.
    It is absurd to assert such.


    Quote Originally Posted by Mustachio View Post
    I have no idea why you're defending this guy. Either he said "they never learned how to pick cotton" because he sees black people as cotton pickers, or because he's used to thinking about them as cotton pickers. Which takes me back to: he's either ignorant and grew up in a racist environment, or he is racist.
    All assumptions based on your own prejudicial thoughts.
    None based in context of what he said.


    Quote Originally Posted by Mustachio View Post
    You also said that he was talking about "the negro entrapped by welfare." No, he was talking about black people. Your opinion that he made that distinction comes from actually ignoring what he said rather than referencing it.
    Wrong. This is nothing more than you going outside of context to falsely cast racial aspersions.



    Your whole opinion is pretty sad considering he was speaking of concern, not of disparagement, hatred or intolerance.
    “The law is reason, free from passion.”
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