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Thread: A fatal wait: Veterans languish and die on a VA hospital's secret list [W:36]

  1. #181
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    Re: A fatal wait: Veterans languish and die on a VA hospital's secret list [W:36]

    Quote Originally Posted by Oozlefinch View Post
    Oh, there are ways to kill programs, I saw it myself first-hand.

    Back in the early 1990's, President Bush got a new VA program approved that would give job training for veterans who got out with little to no useable job skills. It was only to be used for the first 2 years after discharge, and only for a Vocational type program. This was not to give veterans education, but employment. And you had to be in a handful of MOS where it was determined that the civilian use of your skills was not available (generally it was all combat arms skills like Infantry, Artillery, Ordinance, and the like). That was great for me, since after spending a decade in the Infantry, I found that the job market for "Mercenary" or "Contract Killer" was amazingly small.

    Well, after just 3 years, President Clinton came into office, and wanted the program killed so the money could be spent on his constituents. Well, that can't be done because of procedures, so instead this Veterans Only program was opened up to any "Aerospace Worker" who had been laid off within the previous 5 years.

    I applied for this program as soon as I got out, and was sitting in the local VA Office (Palmdale, California) next to aeronautical engineers and avionics specialists. HVAC specialists, electrical experts, and they were all trying for the same program.

    Well, needless to say I did not get anything. By the time I was able to apply, almost all of the money was gone. One guy I met I still remember, he had a doctorate in engineering, but was taking advantage of this program to get a free Novell Engineer training program. Lots of people took advantage of it, but very few of them in the last year were veterans.

    When they went through their end of year audit, the program had so badly blown the budget it was cancelled. So now the VA has no program to retrain newly discharged Veterans so they can actually have useful job skills when they come from an MOS that has no real civilian position. If I remember right, the budget was later redirected to the PELL Grant system. Just like a couple of years ago when our Post 9-11 program was raided and raped, and the money shoved into PELL.

    Once again, Veterans get the shaft, and money is shoved at Civilians.
    I hear you. The thing is...that program is still in the budget. Administrators are still getting paid. Annual Budget Submission - Office of Budget

    I have more experience in the Behavioral Health realm of the VA than the medical needs realm. I can tell you it is crazy. They dont have a psychiatric program. They dont have a psychiatric needs program. They have dozens of specific special needs programs and each one of those comes with its own set of bureaucracy and administration. And for the sheer volume of programs they have, their effectiveness and connectedness to actual veterans is limited.

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    Re: A fatal wait: Veterans languish and die on a VA hospital's secret list [W:36]

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    Do you understand what is actually being funded and at what levels?

    "The Presidentís 2015 Budget includes $163.9 billion for VA in 2015. This includes $68.3 billion in discretionary resources and $95.6 billion in mandatory funding."

    Of that 'mandatory funding'...$72,172,802,000.00 is paid in pensions and financial compensations. Thats not healthcare...thats cash money.

    The VA suffers from the same problems state and local governments are suffering from. They have made cash promises to people and heaped the burden on future taxpayers. I mentioned earlier the problems with 'concurrent disability'. Thats a HUGE problem. It USED to be that if you retired from the military you got 100% of half of your base pay. If you had a medical disability rated at, say, 40%, then you would get 60% of your retirement pay from DFAS and 40% from the VA tax free. Then someone came up with the idea that really...that 40% should be above and beyond your retiree pay so now you get 140% of your retired military pay due to a medical disability. The extends up to 200% if you are rated at 100% disabled (but...100% disabled does NOT mean you cant work).

    Then there is that whole 'discretionary budget thing. The discretionary budget is greater than the obligated mandatory funding available for healthcare.

    Start to see why this is such a monsta?
    I fail to see why the pension benefits are excessive, or any evidence that the discretionary spending isn't being to improve hospitals. Cite it, please.

    What is known, but what Rush Limbaugh (your Messiah) did not tell you, is that your outfit recently blocked legislation increasing funding for VA hospitals. . .

    Republicans used a procedural move to kill the legislation, which was the largest veterans bill in decades and had the support of all of the major veterans groups. The bill would have funded twenty-seven new clinics and medical centers, and made VA healthcare more accessible for veterans without service-related injuries.

    Senate Republicans Turn Their Backs on Veterans | The Nation

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    Re: A fatal wait: Veterans languish and die on a VA hospital's secret list [W:36]

    Quote Originally Posted by Oozlefinch View Post
    Oh, I am thinking. I am also not a political animal like you are.
    You're an unthinking one that parrots your Messiah. . .

    Obama Revives VA Death Book - The Rush Limbaugh Show

    Surprised that I found your source?

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    Re: A fatal wait: Veterans languish and die on a VA hospital's secret list [W:36]

    Quote Originally Posted by solletica View Post
    I fail to see why the pension benefits are excessive, or any evidence that the discretionary spending isn't being to improve hospitals. Cite it, please.

    What is known, but what Rush Limbaugh (your Messiah) did not tell you, is that your outfit recently blocked legislation increasing funding for VA hospitals. . .
    FYI, I have 60 more citations of GOP actions to block VA benefits, if you're interested. Somethin' tells me you aren't.

  5. #185
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    Re: A fatal wait: Veterans languish and die on a VA hospital's secret list [W:36]

    Quote Originally Posted by solletica View Post
    FYI, I have 60 more citations of GOP actions to block VA benefits, if you're interested. Somethin' tells me you aren't.
    This is because we tune you out as a political hack. You do not give a damn about Veterans or anything other then trying to throw crap around.

    No solutions, no care, you simply see this as an excuse to politically pontificate and we generally are rejecting it.

    Oh, and BTW, I do not listen to Rush Limbaugh. And I really could not care less what he says, no more then Rachel Maddow.
    War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. - John Stuart Mill

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    Re: A fatal wait: Veterans languish and die on a VA hospital's secret list [W:36]

    Quote Originally Posted by solletica View Post
    I fail to see why the pension benefits are excessive, or any evidence that the discretionary spending isn't being to improve hospitals. Cite it, please.

    What is known, but what Rush Limbaugh (your Messiah) did not tell you, is that your outfit recently blocked legislation increasing funding for VA hospitals. . .


    You pulled the Rush Limbaugh card...




    FM

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    Re: A fatal wait: Veterans languish and die on a VA hospital's secret list [W:36]

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post


    You pulled the Rush Limbaugh card...




    FM
    GOP voters have several of those cards in their deck. They must've dropped one by mistake.

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    Re: A fatal wait: Veterans languish and die on a VA hospital's secret list [W:36]

    Quote Originally Posted by Oozlefinch View Post
    This is because we tune you out as a political hack.
    Nope, the political hacks are the Limbaugh addicts, i. e. conservative voters.

    Quote Originally Posted by Oozlefinch View Post
    You do not give a damn about Veterans
    Mostly correct. As a Libertarian, I do not care about post-Vietnam vets--they made their beds to fight for an adversary (i. e. the govt.) and wasted my tax dollars (and those of future generations) doing so, instead of engaging in something honorable, like serving their country, so they got what was coming to them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Oozlefinch View Post
    or anything other then trying to throw crap around.
    Yes everything based on actual citations from authoritative sources (i. e. doesn't come Limbaugh) is considered "crap" to conservatives. That we knew years ago

    What we're praying for is the day when conservatives, too, learn the citation concept.

    Quote Originally Posted by Oozlefinch View Post
    Actually,

    No solutions, no care, you simply see this as an excuse to politically pontificate and we generally are rejecting it.

    Oh, and BTW, I do not listen to Rush Limbaugh.
    That would be insubordination for a conservative.
    Last edited by solletica; 05-06-14 at 02:56 PM.

  9. #189
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    Re: A fatal wait: Veterans languish and die on a VA hospital's secret list [W:36]

    Quote Originally Posted by solletica View Post
    Mostly correct. As a Libertarian, I do not care about post-Vietnam vets--they made their beds to fight for an adversary (i. e. the govt.) and wasted my tax dollars (and those of future generations) doing so, instead of engaging in something honorable, like serving their country, so they got what was coming to them.
    So exactly what should they have done to prevent fighting in Vietnam?

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    Re: A fatal wait: Veterans languish and die on a VA hospital's secret list [W:36]

    Quote Originally Posted by solletica View Post
    FYI, I have 60 more citations of GOP actions to block VA benefits, if you're interested. Somethin' tells me you aren't.
    I am. Please post them.

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