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Thread: High Court Upholds Michigan Affirmative Action Ban

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    Re: High Court Upholds Michigan Affirmative Action Ban

    My preference would be that public colleges and universities would be a meritocracy. How each individual school wants to weight the actions that factor into admission would be up to them. If they want to go purely academic performance, that's fine. If they want to give weight to extra-curriculars, I'm fine with that. If they want to give weight to an individual with a compelling life story or a compelling essay, that's fine. If they want to look at community or charitable services done and factor that in, cool. I don't think every University has to be absolutely cookie cutter and I'm fine with different ones valuing certain aspects of what a person has done in their life differently.

    However, I do think it should be MERIT, not who you are. I'm not in favor of weighing someone's application higher simply because they're a legacy. I'm not in favor of weighing someone higher because they're a minority race. I'm not in favor of a school weighing someone higher because they're male or female because the schools population is heavily slanted in the oppsite direction. I'm not in favor of a school weighing someone higher because they're in-state as opposed to out-of-state. I'm not in favor of a school weighing someone higher because they're from a state the school doens't have a student from (My University actively attempted to get a student from every state in the US).

    I think Private Schools should be able to do their selections in any legal way they want. In their cases, if they feel artificially creating a racially diverse campus is beneficial then be my guest. If they feel that legacies are important and a grand tradition, then that's fine. But I think in terms of public universities it should be based on what you DO...not who you are.

    Then again, I'm one of those strange people that would prefer a society where everyone DOESN'T go to college because to have such a society then the entire notion of college generally has to be watered down to a useless degree.

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    Re: High Court Upholds Michigan Affirmative Action Ban

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    Sorry, but as I stated, a University has to say afloat, and that has to be considered.
    As it really isn't that many, there should be nothing to oppose.
    As it violates the basic principle I have outlined - it would indeed be something to oppose. Merit is merit. It cannot be purchased with money. And to allow money to substitute for merit is a violaltion of the principle.
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    Re: High Court Upholds Michigan Affirmative Action Ban

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    It's not hard to identify, it's very blatantly plain when it's coming from the black community. Of course, liberals refuse to acknowledge that black people can be racist. They seem to think that America will eternally owe black people extra benefits because of something that happened more than 150 years ago.

    It's time to get the hell over it and get everyone to work their hardest. Nobody deserves an easy ride.
    It's funny you say that, because conservatives often give the impression that black racism is the only type of racism that exists.

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    Re: High Court Upholds Michigan Affirmative Action Ban

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    As it violates the basic principle I have outlined - it would indeed be something to oppose. Merit is merit. It cannot be purchased with money. And to allow money to substitute for merit is a violaltion of the principle.
    I get it.
    But it doesn't matter.
    Universities need to stay afloat, so it has to be a consideration.
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    Re: High Court Upholds Michigan Affirmative Action Ban

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    It's funny you say that, because conservatives often give the impression that black racism is the only type of racism that exists.
    Nobody ever said that, it's just that the left refuses to acknowledge it at all, I abhor racism of all kinds from all people. The only way forward is to create a color-blind society, not impose racist government programs against anyone.
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    Re: High Court Upholds Michigan Affirmative Action Ban

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    Nobody ever said that, it's just that the left refuses to acknowledge it at all, I abhor racism of all kinds from all people. The only way forward is to create a color-blind society, not impose racist government programs against anyone.
    That's great, but since I was referring to the difficulty of identifying and prosecuting white on black racism what you're saying is beside the point. Affirmative Action was created to address that point, though I think we can all agree that in execution it was always faulty from the start. So how would you identify white on black racism when it happens, or are you too going to say that being somewhat less common than the Loch Ness Monster it's pointless to even discuss?

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    Re: High Court Upholds Michigan Affirmative Action Ban

    Quote Originally Posted by Gipper View Post
    Haymarket is noticably anti-meritocratic. Athletic talent is merit. Black is not.
    Just the opposite. Merit is all I am considering.

    As to athletic talent.....So is musical talent. So is cooking. So is writing poetry. So is drawing pictures. So is proficiency at sex. So are lots and lots and lots of things.

    And while some of those do touch upon things in college, I do NOT want to make them what gets you in or out of an academic institution dedicated to learning and the acquisition of knowledge unless of course it is a cooking school or an art school or a music school where those things are primary at the school and they forgo regular academics. There are no colleges or universities that I know of which only teach team athletics and forgo regular academics.
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    Re: High Court Upholds Michigan Affirmative Action Ban

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    Admission should be based solely on performance. Period.
    What kind of performance?
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    Re: High Court Upholds Michigan Affirmative Action Ban

    Quote Originally Posted by Chaddelamancha View Post
    We would first need to find a way to ensure that all students, in every classroom, have the same learning opportunities before they go to college.
    That this is far from reality right now is why we have affirmative action in the first place, to attempt to bridge that gap. It seems that the right wing's positions require self-delusion that there is no more inequality anywhere in the country and that anyone claiming otherwise is just mean and jealous and trying to hurt white males over their obvious superiority.

    We have a long way to go before institutionalized discrimination is gone and everyone really is operating in an even playing field. This kind of move doesn't make anything more fair, it just strips people of one of the ways they have to overcome the difficulties they face.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    Nobody ever said that, it's just that the left refuses to acknowledge it at all, I abhor racism of all kinds from all people. The only way forward is to create a color-blind society, not impose racist government programs against anyone.
    Then do something about the fact that a child born to black parents is five times more likely to be born into poverty.
    Last edited by Paschendale; 04-22-14 at 03:48 PM.
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    Re: High Court Upholds Michigan Affirmative Action Ban

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    You don't know the difference between college and university. Harvard College isn't and never will be below Golden Gate University. Or Rutgers University, since I see you live in NJ.
    Universities are made up of colleges. A University can have a College of Arts and Sciences, a College of Engineering, a College of Computer Science, etc...Sometimes they're called schools as well. Basically, the difference between a college and a university is that a college offers degrees in one area, a university offers degrees in multiple areas. One isn't superior to the other academically.

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