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Thread: US delays Review of Keystone XL Pipeline.....

  1. #101
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    Re: US delays Review of Keystone XL Pipeline.....

    Quote Originally Posted by polgara View Post
    It sure seems from the howling we're hearing from the environmentalists that they are against any more greenhouse gases be emitted, or we're doomed! They appear to prefer we all have windmills on top of our vehicles or something, but that doesn't wash. Since the States involved are all on board with the safety part of it, and since the pipeline will provide new jobs for their areas, I see no reason why to delay, except for the fact that unions have been very vocal in support of the pipeline! It will be very interesting to see who wins this fight, since the Dems don't want to lose either voting block. Poor BHO - which way to go on this political hot potato? :

    Greetings, Pero.
    There are a few one issue voters, but only a few. How many of the rank and file of the union will switch their loyalties in November from Democratic to Republican over the pipeline remains to be seen, but I do not think there will be a mass switch because of it. The union hollering is a minor thorn in the Democrat's side. The Democrats want to keep the energy most environmentalist bring to the election, their money etc. There is a lot more involved here and the delay gets the Democrats 100 million from that California guy plus maintains the energy and work the environmentalist do. Sure it may lose a few votes in Sullivan's union, but in the grand scheme of things, those few votes do not mean much.

    But they just might provide the difference in a very close election in two states. Arkansas and Louisiana. But both Democratic incumbents were no better than 50-50 prior to the decision to delay Keystone, the delay may make those odds 49-51 for their re-election but that decision probably helps in several other states in keeping what the Democrats hopes their base fired up enough to get them to the polls. Apparently the Democrats think they can afford to lose Arkansas and Louisiana. But the decision may help them in Michigan, North Carolina, Colorado, Iowa and perhaps Alaska.
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

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    Re: US delays Review of Keystone XL Pipeline.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Perotista View Post
    There are a few one issue voters, but only a few. How many of the rank and file of the union will switch their loyalties in November from Democratic to Republican over the pipeline remains to be seen, but I do not think there will be a mass switch because of it. The union hollering is a minor thorn in the Democrat's side. The Democrats want to keep the energy most environmentalist bring to the election, their money etc. There is a lot more involved here and the delay gets the Democrats 100 million from that California guy plus maintains the energy and work the environmentalist do. Sure it may lose a few votes in Sullivan's union, but in the grand scheme of things, those few votes do not mean much.

    But they just might provide the difference in a very close election in two states. Arkansas and Louisiana. But both Democratic incumbents were no better than 50-50 prior to the decision to delay Keystone, the delay may make those odds 49-51 for their re-election but that decision probably helps in several other states in keeping what the Democrats hopes their base fired up enough to get them to the polls. Apparently the Democrats think they can afford to lose Arkansas and Louisiana. But the decision may help them in Michigan, North Carolina, Colorado, Iowa and perhaps Alaska.
    Great post, Pero! It gives me a new slant in the way I look at things, and that's good. The events leading up to the 2014 election will be most interesting to watch, and will doubtless show us how the voters feel about the way things are trending, and whether or not they are satisfied with same. If it turns out to be like the 2010 election, that's one thing, and a message will be delivered by the voters. If not...? Time will tell.

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    Re: US delays Review of Keystone XL Pipeline.....

    Quote Originally Posted by polgara View Post
    Great post, Pero! It gives me a new slant in the way I look at things, and that's good. The events leading up to the 2014 election will be most interesting to watch, and will doubtless show us how the voters feel about the way things are trending, and whether or not they are satisfied with same. If it turns out to be like the 2010 election, that's one thing, and a message will be delivered by the voters. If not...? Time will tell.
    I doubt if another 2010 is in the works. Nationally the indicators just aren't there as they were in 2010 at this point in time. The five major indicators point more towards a status quo election with perhaps the Republicans gaining a few seats in each chamber. Now having said that, nation indicators are just that national indicators. It doesn't break them down into states and districts. Yet they are a good rule of thumb. As of yesterday, there is how they looked.

    What are the chances of another 2010 election happening in November? Here are the five criteria that must be in place. Also you compare today with 2012 and 2010.

    President Obama’s approval rating of below 45%: Todays rating: 44.7% and rising. Whether the president’s approval rating continues to rise or falls back once again will be a telltale sign whether the Republicans will have a banner year or not.
    2012 approval rating 51%
    2010 approval rating 44%

    ACA gap of 15 points in the against/oppose side over the favor/pro ACA side: Today the gap is 11.6. About half way between a banner year for either party. It is more in line for a status quo election than a huge Republican gain.
    2012 gap 5 points
    2010 gap 15 points

    Generic congressional poll, the Republicans must have a lead over the Democrats of 5 points or better: Today the Democrats lead by 1.6 points 41.8-40.2%. This indicator pretty much says we will have a status quo election with either party gaining or losing 5 seats.
    2012 generic Democrats 50% Republicans 48%
    2010 generic Democrats 45% Republicans 52%

    Party Favorability/unfavorability, the Democrats must be seen in a worst light than the Republicans. But today with all voters the Republicans have a 33% favorable rating vs a 61% unfavorable. The Democrats have a 42% favorable/53% unfavorable which seems to tilt the November election in the Democrats favor.
    2012 favorability/unfavorability Democrat 47/44 Republican 40/47
    2010 favorability/unfavorability Democrat 39/47 Republican 44/44

    Party affiliation/identification Republicans must have a 5 point lead as they did in 2010 when counting those who identify with each party plus those independents which lean towards each party: Today the Democrats have a 2 point advantage, down three points from last month and down 7 from 2 months ago. It seems party identification is trending Republican, but is nowhere near what is needed for another 2010 to happen.

    Identify as Democrats 29%
    Independents lean Democrat 14% Total 43%
    Identify as Republicans 25%
    Independents lean Republican 16% Total 41%

    2012 party identification
    Identify as Democrats 33%
    Independents lean Democrat 15% Total 48%
    Identify as Republicans 28%
    Independents lean Republican 12% Total 40%


    2010 party identification
    Identify as Democrats 29%
    Independents lean Democrat 13% Total 42%
    Identify as Republicans 29%
    Independents lean Republican 20% Total 49%


    Conclusion: The president’s approval rating is rising and is not a positive sign for the republicans for big gains. The ACA gap has been closing another not so positive sign for Republican hopes to gain control of the senate. The generic congressional poll is good news for Democrats which would indicate they might gain a few seats in the House. The party favorability ratings says this should be a Democratic year. Party affiliation is about even, giving neither side an advantage. The bottom line is as of this date the indicators are mixed or pointing more to a status quo election. So do not expect another 2010 or whole sale changes in the make up or control of either chamber of Congress. Look for the Republicans to gain 3-4 senate seats, but not enough to gain control. While the House stays pretty much with the same numbers it has today, 234 Republican, 201 Democrat.
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

  4. #104
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    Re: US delays Review of Keystone XL Pipeline.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Perotista View Post
    I doubt if another 2010 is in the works. Nationally the indicators just aren't there as they were in 2010 at this point in time. The five major indicators point more towards a status quo election with perhaps the Republicans gaining a few seats in each chamber. Now having said that, nation indicators are just that national indicators. It doesn't break them down into states and districts. Yet they are a good rule of thumb. As of yesterday, there is how they looked.

    What are the chances of another 2010 election happening in November? Here are the five criteria that must be in place. Also you compare today with 2012 and 2010.

    President Obama’s approval rating of below 45%: Todays rating: 44.7% and rising. Whether the president’s approval rating continues to rise or falls back once again will be a telltale sign whether the Republicans will have a banner year or not.
    2012 approval rating 51%
    2010 approval rating 44%

    ACA gap of 15 points in the against/oppose side over the favor/pro ACA side: Today the gap is 11.6. About half way between a banner year for either party. It is more in line for a status quo election than a huge Republican gain.
    2012 gap 5 points
    2010 gap 15 points

    Generic congressional poll, the Republicans must have a lead over the Democrats of 5 points or better: Today the Democrats lead by 1.6 points 41.8-40.2%. This indicator pretty much says we will have a status quo election with either party gaining or losing 5 seats.
    2012 generic Democrats 50% Republicans 48%
    2010 generic Democrats 45% Republicans 52%

    Party Favorability/unfavorability, the Democrats must be seen in a worst light than the Republicans. But today with all voters the Republicans have a 33% favorable rating vs a 61% unfavorable. The Democrats have a 42% favorable/53% unfavorable which seems to tilt the November election in the Democrats favor.
    2012 favorability/unfavorability Democrat 47/44 Republican 40/47
    2010 favorability/unfavorability Democrat 39/47 Republican 44/44

    Party affiliation/identification Republicans must have a 5 point lead as they did in 2010 when counting those who identify with each party plus those independents which lean towards each party: Today the Democrats have a 2 point advantage, down three points from last month and down 7 from 2 months ago. It seems party identification is trending Republican, but is nowhere near what is needed for another 2010 to happen.

    Identify as Democrats 29%
    Independents lean Democrat 14% Total 43%
    Identify as Republicans 25%
    Independents lean Republican 16% Total 41%

    2012 party identification
    Identify as Democrats 33%
    Independents lean Democrat 15% Total 48%
    Identify as Republicans 28%
    Independents lean Republican 12% Total 40%


    2010 party identification
    Identify as Democrats 29%
    Independents lean Democrat 13% Total 42%
    Identify as Republicans 29%
    Independents lean Republican 20% Total 49%


    Conclusion: The president’s approval rating is rising and is not a positive sign for the republicans for big gains. The ACA gap has been closing another not so positive sign for Republican hopes to gain control of the senate. The generic congressional poll is good news for Democrats which would indicate they might gain a few seats in the House. The party favorability ratings says this should be a Democratic year. Party affiliation is about even, giving neither side an advantage. The bottom line is as of this date the indicators are mixed or pointing more to a status quo election. So do not expect another 2010 or whole sale changes in the make up or control of either chamber of Congress. Look for the Republicans to gain 3-4 senate seats, but not enough to gain control. While the House stays pretty much with the same numbers it has today, 234 Republican, 201 Democrat.

    Here ya go Pero.....this one was from FOX. Which it has the questions they were asked as well.

    Fox News Poll: Independents more likely to back anti-ObamaCare candidates.....

    http://www.foxnews.com/politics/inte...re-candidates/

  5. #105
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    Re: US delays Review of Keystone XL Pipeline.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    The Keystone is a lose - lose for the president and the Democrats. If it is approved, then the environmental community will be unhappy. If it isn't approved, labor will be unhappy. Both are supporters of Democrats.

    Like Harry Truman said, "No matter what you do in this job, some SOB doesn't like it." So, someone won't like it, but at least they won't like it after the November election.
    The enviros will vote Democrat no matter what they do. Like you said, this is all about Senate control.
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    Re: US delays Review of Keystone XL Pipeline.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    The Keystone is a lose - lose for the president and the Democrats. If it is approved, then the environmental community will be unhappy. If it isn't approved, labor will be unhappy. Both are supporters of Democrats.

    Like Harry Truman said, "No matter what you do in this job, some SOB doesn't like it." So, someone won't like it, but at least they won't like it after the November election.
    The pipeline would (or will) provide only 4,000 US jobs. The environmental community dwarfs that number. It's easy to see why he's holding it up.

    He may also be waiting for Nebraska to soften and allow the pipeline through their state. That won't happen.

  7. #107
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    Re: US delays Review of Keystone XL Pipeline.....

    Quote Originally Posted by d0gbreath View Post
    The pipeline would (or will) provide only 4,000 US jobs. The environmental community dwarfs that number. It's easy to see why he's holding it up.

    He may also be waiting for Nebraska to soften and allow the pipeline through their state. That won't happen.
    That might be.

    As for the number of environmentalists, as American points out, they're pretty unlikely to vote for Republicans anyway.
    "Donald Trump is a phony, a fraud... [he's] playing the American public for suckers." Mitt Romney

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    Re: US delays Review of Keystone XL Pipeline.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Perotista View Post
    I doubt if another 2010 is in the works. Nationally the indicators just aren't there as they were in 2010 at this point in time. The five major indicators point more towards a status quo election with perhaps the Republicans gaining a few seats in each chamber. Now having said that, nation indicators are just that national indicators. It doesn't break them down into states and districts. Yet they are a good rule of thumb. As of yesterday, there is how they looked.

    What are the chances of another 2010 election happening in November? Here are the five criteria that must be in place. Also you compare today with 2012 and 2010.

    President Obama’s approval rating of below 45%: Todays rating: 44.7% and rising. Whether the president’s approval rating continues to rise or falls back once again will be a telltale sign whether the Republicans will have a banner year or not.
    2012 approval rating 51%
    2010 approval rating 44%

    ACA gap of 15 points in the against/oppose side over the favor/pro ACA side: Today the gap is 11.6. About half way between a banner year for either party. It is more in line for a status quo election than a huge Republican gain.
    2012 gap 5 points
    2010 gap 15 points

    Generic congressional poll, the Republicans must have a lead over the Democrats of 5 points or better: Today the Democrats lead by 1.6 points 41.8-40.2%. This indicator pretty much says we will have a status quo election with either party gaining or losing 5 seats.
    2012 generic Democrats 50% Republicans 48%
    2010 generic Democrats 45% Republicans 52%

    Party Favorability/unfavorability, the Democrats must be seen in a worst light than the Republicans. But today with all voters the Republicans have a 33% favorable rating vs a 61% unfavorable. The Democrats have a 42% favorable/53% unfavorable which seems to tilt the November election in the Democrats favor.
    2012 favorability/unfavorability Democrat 47/44 Republican 40/47
    2010 favorability/unfavorability Democrat 39/47 Republican 44/44

    Party affiliation/identification Republicans must have a 5 point lead as they did in 2010 when counting those who identify with each party plus those independents which lean towards each party: Today the Democrats have a 2 point advantage, down three points from last month and down 7 from 2 months ago. It seems party identification is trending Republican, but is nowhere near what is needed for another 2010 to happen.

    Identify as Democrats 29%
    Independents lean Democrat 14% Total 43%
    Identify as Republicans 25%
    Independents lean Republican 16% Total 41%

    2012 party identification
    Identify as Democrats 33%
    Independents lean Democrat 15% Total 48%
    Identify as Republicans 28%
    Independents lean Republican 12% Total 40%


    2010 party identification
    Identify as Democrats 29%
    Independents lean Democrat 13% Total 42%
    Identify as Republicans 29%
    Independents lean Republican 20% Total 49%


    Conclusion: The president’s approval rating is rising and is not a positive sign for the republicans for big gains. The ACA gap has been closing another not so positive sign for Republican hopes to gain control of the senate. The generic congressional poll is good news for Democrats which would indicate they might gain a few seats in the House. The party favorability ratings says this should be a Democratic year. Party affiliation is about even, giving neither side an advantage. The bottom line is as of this date the indicators are mixed or pointing more to a status quo election. So do not expect another 2010 or whole sale changes in the make up or control of either chamber of Congress. Look for the Republicans to gain 3-4 senate seats, but not enough to gain control. While the House stays pretty much with the same numbers it has today, 234 Republican, 201 Democrat.
    I question these polls only in the sense that people may offer their choices when asked but do they feel strongly enough to actually go to the polls to support those choices? A lot of the turnout may depend on who is the most concerned about the issues.

  9. #109
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    Re: US delays Review of Keystone XL Pipeline.....

    Quote Originally Posted by poweRob View Post
    Just creeks and small wells huh?

    Attachment 67165277

    It's called the Ogallala Aquifer. It irrigates almost all of the center of our country. You know. Farming land.


    OH FFS!

    At least be honest enough to provide RECENT data.

    They re-routed around the sensitive areas of the Ogallala five years ago.

    You ARE aware that the EPA, Dept of Interior, State department and every affacted state has APPROVED this right?

    Dis-information is a nice word for lying.
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    Re: US delays Review of Keystone XL Pipeline.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Perotista View Post
    Evening Jack, it seems the delay may very well doom Pryor in Arkansas and Landrieu in Louisiana. Two red state Dems that were in a heap of trouble prior to the delay announcement. What these two counted on was the pipeline to persuade the voters of Arkansas and Louisiana that having a Democratic Senator is worth something to them.

    If these two can't deliver on the pipeline, that probably dooms their chances of re-election. Most prognosticators had these two states in the toss up column, color them red.


    I would suggest that your political science is weak.

    Voters don't usually turn against the LOCAL politician when what they want is blocked by Washington, in this case against the will of the EPA, department of Interior, Trransport, Commerce AND the State Department, actions of a man with "a pen and a phone"......

    There is no way in hell this is trouble for Republicans; more likely some serious **** for the man who has spent over a trillion dollars to no avail in a still sluggish if not stalled economy, yet another failure of policy for the Obama administration.

    Anyone who thinks hard working welders, rough necks, pipeline and construction workers in the affected red states are going to turn out and vote FOR no jobs, they are dreaming in socialist technicolor.
    ""You know, when we sell to other countries, even if they're allies -- you never know about an ally. An ally can turn."
    Donald Trump, 11/23/17

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