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Thread: The US is an oligarchy, study concludes[W:192]

  1. #171
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    Re: The US is an oligarchy, study concludes

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    The average income in the United States is ~$32,000 per year. If income in the United States were spread entirely equally, everyone would be making $225,000 per year. Americans are 4 times more productive since 1970, and wages have increased by about 1.6% since then. Debt among the working classes has exploded and continues to grow every year. All of the risk is on workers. Profits are privatized and risk is collectivized.

    The people you're talking about, starting businesses, those are the working class. They're in the same pool as everyone else. That's not rich on the level that pulls the 32k to 225k. They shouldn't be facing the risk they do, but deregulation (primarily by Republicans) has allowed a few big corporations to enact colluding monopolies in many many industries. There is no room for small startup businesses.

    There is nothing that a person can possibly do to deserve that much more reward than everyone else.
    It wasn't that long ago that I retired from my own small start up business that provided services involving hundreds of other small start up businesses. And the reason that those small start up businesses can prosper is because they provide products and services needed by bigger businesses who provide products and services for still larger ones and so forth. Karl Marx believed that the wealth could be spread equitably and everybody would then live in peace. But such a concept has never worked in the history of the world because all humans have different aptitude, different ambitions, different callings, different abilities and some simply desire success enough to do what is necessary to achieve it while others are satisfied to just get by. The Founders gave us a nation in which every individual can aspire to reach his/her full potential and there were to be no artificial barriers to impede that - EXCEPT - that nobody could tread on anybody else's rights.

    The fact is no matter how noble or righteous or liberal a concept is, you cannot achieve socioeconomic justice by taking away what others have ethically and legally earned and giving it to somebody else. You cannot hurt the rich without hurting the poor more. And you cannot enrich one segment of society by taking wealth from another.
    "I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it." --Benjamin Franklin 1776

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    Re: The US is an oligarchy, study concludes

    Quote Originally Posted by TeleKat View Post
    America is most certainly nationalistic. Have you not been paying attention?
    Yes, America is nationalistic, but I also added that fascism had a racial element to it as well in which racial superiority was codified into law.
    "And in the end, we were all just humans, drunk on the idea that love, only love, could heal our brokenness."

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    Re: The US is an oligarchy, study concludes

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Invisible View Post
    Yes, America is nationalistic, but I also added that fascism had a racial element to it as well in which racial superiority was codified into law.
    Fascism doesn't have to be racial for it to be fascism.

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    Re: The US is an oligarchy, study concludes

    Quote Originally Posted by Soupnazi630 View Post
    Nothing to forgive. Smaller minds use such reactions to mask inadequacies.
    And Libertarians have some of the smallest minds around.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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    Re: The US is an oligarchy, study concludes

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    In fact all government should be as local as possible so that people can do something about inept or corrupt behavior. You're on the right track.
    No, that's where we get morons pushing creationism in schools, racism, etc. Those never come from the federal government, they only come from local governments.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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    Re: The US is an oligarchy, study concludes

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    No, that's where we get morons pushing creationism in schools, racism, etc. Those never come from the federal government, they only come from local governments.
    Perhaps, but you can always change schools or school districts if it's important.

    What if the feds insist that everyone in the US must learn creationism in school? Or start pushing racism? Whatcha gonna do?

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    Re: The US is an oligarchy, study concludes

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    Perhaps, but you can always change schools or school districts if it's important.
    No, what's important is that every single student everywhere be taught about reality. Creationism should not be taught in any school anywhere to anyone. It's BS.

    What if the feds insist that everyone in the US must learn creationism in school? Or start pushing racism? Whatcha gonna do?
    You let us know when that actually happens, won't you? In every single case in modern memory that such things have been pushed, it hasn't been the federal government doing it, it's come from the state level and below.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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    Re: The US is an oligarchy, study concludes

    Quote Originally Posted by jonny5 View Post
    People elect the politicians. The politicians make the decisions. Thus we have a representative democracy. That those politicians CHOOSE to make decisions in part based on power connections does not change the fundamental nature of the political system in the US. Change only requires individuals voting in someone else. An actual oligarchy would have no elections, no judicial system, no checks and balances.

    So this is just more blame avoidance.
    An uneducated electorate creates a plutocracy.

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    Re: The US is an oligarchy, study concludes

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    And Libertarians have some of the smallest minds around.
    Libertarianism is the most practical system in a country where people are generally apathetic when it comes to electing their leaders but are attentive to their finances.

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    Re: The US is an oligarchy, study concludes

    Quote Originally Posted by solletica View Post
    Libertarianism is the most practical system in a country where people are generally apathetic when it comes to electing their leaders but are attentive to their finances.
    Yeah, not so much. First off, the chances of getting a Libertarian candidate elected to high public office is essentially nil, secondly, most people are not at all attentive to their finances and third, libertarianism? Practical? Don't make me laugh. Like I said, some of the smallest, most delusional minds around.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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