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Thread: Stay-at-home moms: The sad truth behind those rosy media stories

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    Re: Stay-at-home moms: The sad truth behind those rosy media stories

    Quote Originally Posted by Gathomas88 View Post
    Trust me. She wouldn't want me too.



    The problem here is economic. It is actually cheaper for the woman to stay home than it is to pay for day care.

    Seems like a self-correcting problem to me. Just stay home for a couple of years until the kids are old enough to go to school, and then work part time if you want.

    Sorry folks, but "having it all" is a myth.
    I'm saying this form the Canadian market, it is impossible to afford a good quality of life without both parents working. It becomes even worse when you have only one parent, what are they to do? The income a parent can bring into a household far outweighs the benefits of staying at home. We want the parent to participate in the economy.

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    Re: Stay-at-home moms: The sad truth behind those rosy media stories

    Quote Originally Posted by Carjosse View Post
    I'm saying this form the Canadian market, it is impossible to afford a good quality of life without both parents working. It becomes even worse when you have only one parent, what are they to do? The income a bring can bring into a household far outweighs the cost of staying at home.
    And how much of that is due to all the unnecessary bells and whistles (like day care) that modern society likes to insist are somehow necessary to raising children?

    It most certainly isn't "impossible" to raise a family on one mid-range income, or one full time income and a part time income. It simply requires economizing a little bit.

    If it's actually more expensive to have mom work due to the additional expense of childcare, she should simply stay home for a couple of years (for free!) so that those expenses can be cut down on a bit until the kids are old enough to start school and day care is no longer necessary. The answer isn't to get government involved in raiding other people's pocketbooks to subsidize your lifestyle choices.

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    Re: Stay-at-home moms: The sad truth behind those rosy media stories

    Quote Originally Posted by Carjosse View Post
    Well what Quebec does is broker deal with daycares to become 7$/day daycares. The government gets to negotiate a preferable price to pay and the daycare is assured full capacity. Couples and especially single parents benefit from this.
    Oh, kind of how like if the Government of Quebec gave every citizen a copy of MicroSoft Word, whether they wanted it or not. The Government could negotiate a cheaper price with MicroSoft because MicroSoft realized that it would sell more copies this way than via the free market, in that this way everyone in the province is getting a copy whether they want it or not.

    From the POV of a daycare operator, they have a fixed limit of children that they can care for. If it costs them $60 per day per child to provide care and they max out at 20 children, then their daily revenue is $1,200. If they can fill to capacity in a free market, then they get $1,200 per day. Under this government scheme they get $50 per day and if operating at capacity they gross $1,000 per day. This daycare operator is now worse off under a government scheme than under the free market.

    What this government scheme does is it expands the number of daycare operators, each now operating at less than full capacity, and thus eager to entice more parents into the scheme to boost their children under care.

    Subsidies DISTORT the marketplace. They distort decisions made by consumers. They harm the people who are taxed.

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    Re: Stay-at-home moms: The sad truth behind those rosy media stories

    Quote Originally Posted by RiverDad View Post
    Oh, kind of how like if the Government of Quebec gave every citizen a copy of MicroSoft Word, whether they wanted it or not. The Government could negotiate a cheaper price with MicroSoft because MicroSoft realized that it would sell more copies this way than via the free market, in that this way everyone in the province is getting a copy whether they want it or not.

    From the POV of a daycare operator, they have a fixed limit of children that they can care for. If it costs them $60 per day per child to provide care and they max out at 20 children, then their daily revenue is $1,200. If they can fill to capacity in a free market, then they get $1,200 per day. Under this government scheme they get $50 per day and if operating at capacity they gross $1,000 per day. This daycare operator is now worse off under a government scheme than under the free market.

    What this government scheme does is it expands the number of daycare operators, each now operating at less than full capacity, and thus eager to entice more parents into the scheme to boost their children under care.

    Subsidies DISTORT the marketplace. They distort decisions made by consumers. They harm the people who are taxed.
    Well considering the waiting list for the service is gigantic I would call it a success.

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    Re: Stay-at-home moms: The sad truth behind those rosy media stories

    Quote Originally Posted by Carjosse View Post
    Well considering the waiting list for the service is gigantic I would call it a success.
    I'm still waiting for my Ferrari. I guarantee that that subsidy program will also have a huge waiting list.

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    Re: Stay-at-home moms: The sad truth behind those rosy media stories

    Quote Originally Posted by Gathomas88 View Post
    And how much of that is due to all the unnecessary bells and whistles (like day care) that modern society likes to insist are somehow necessary to raising children?

    It most certainly isn't "impossible" to raise a family on one mid-range income, or one full time income and a part time income. It simply requires economizing a little bit.

    If it's actually more expensive to have mom work due to the additional expense of childcare, she should simply stay home for a couple of years (for free!) so that those expenses can be cut down on a bit until the kids are old enough to start school and day care is no longer necessary. The answer isn't to get government involved in raiding other people's pocketbooks to subsidize your lifestyle choices.
    We need daycare because of our society, one in which women want to work and single parent households are common. The cost of daycare is simply outweighed by the $40,000+ the parent may bring into the household. It is literally impossible to do that in a city like Toronto where the average home price is around 700,000$.

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    Re: Stay-at-home moms: The sad truth behind those rosy media stories

    Quote Originally Posted by Carjosse View Post
    We need daycare because of our society, one in which women want to work and single parent households are common.
    And that's a problem too. There should be more stable marriages, and fewer single parents.

    Again, the answer to people making stupid life decisions isn't to encourage them by raiding other people's bank accounts. It is to discourage the negative behavior in the first place.

    The cost of daycare is simply outweighed by the $40,000+ the parent may bring into the household.
    In the case of the OP, it rather clearly is not, which is why they are not working. Their pay is not sufficient to offset the price of childcare.

    It's basically a wash.

    It is literally impossible to do that in a city like Toronto where the average home price is around 700,000$.
    Is there any particular reason someone should have to live in their own home?

    My family lived in apartments until I was 16 years old.

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    Re: Stay-at-home moms: The sad truth behind those rosy media stories

    Quote Originally Posted by Gathomas88 View Post


    "Day care" seems like kind of an unnecessary waste to me anyway. Is it really going to kill anyone to stay home for a few years until the kids are old enough to start school?
    Can Kill your CV.
    ‘This is not peace, it is an armistice for 20 years.’ (Ferdinand Foch. After the Treaty of Versailles, 1919).

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    Re: Stay-at-home moms: The sad truth behind those rosy media stories

    Quote Originally Posted by higgins86 View Post
    can kill your cv.
    "cv?"

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    Re: Stay-at-home moms: The sad truth behind those rosy media stories

    Quote Originally Posted by Gathomas88 View Post
    And that's a problem too. There should be more stable marriages, and fewer single parents.

    Again, the answer to people making stupid life decisions isn't to encourage them by raiding other people's bank accounts. It is to discourage the negative behavior in the first place.



    In the case of the OP in the OP, it rather clearly is not, which is why they are not working. Their pay is not sufficient to offset the price of childcare.



    Is there any particular reason someone should have to live in their own home?

    My family lived in apartments until I was 16 years old.
    Apartments are not much cheaper either. Well single parent households are a product of society and culture which proper daycare may have helped to prevent. Daycare can be really cheap and unless you are working for less than minimum wage, it is a payoff.

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