Armed guards surround Bundy, supporters fear imminent threat[W:208]

ChrisL · Apr 21, 2014

Re: Armed guards surround Bundy, supporters fear imminent threat

Grant said:
Yes, but Barack Obama was allegedly bringing Hope and Change. That the American electorate got fooled twice by this guy does not speak well for them. The 'they all do it' excuse is wearing thin.

Well, I for one, can't believe anyone was fooled by the same old rhetoric coming from a politician. :roll:

Kobie · Apr 21, 2014

Re: Armed guards surround Bundy, supporters fear imminent threat

ChrisL said:
Is that your idea of debating the issue? Why is it nonsense? These people don't believe the federal government has the right to tax them for use of public grazing lands. What is your argument that the feds as opposed to the states would have the right to tax these lands?

Maybe you should educate yourself as to why they are upset.

They're not "public grazing lands."

ChrisL · Apr 21, 2014

Re: Armed guards surround Bundy, supporters fear imminent threat

Kobie said:
They're not "public grazing lands."

Oh no? Well that's lame because from the article.

According to the BLM, Bundy has allowed his cattle to graze public land illegally for the past 20 years. Following two court orders, the feds started rounding up the cattle last week.

Kobie · Apr 21, 2014

Re: Armed guards surround Bundy, supporters fear imminent threat

ChrisL said:
Oh no? Well that's lame because from the article.

It's public land. It's not intended for grazing. Hence, it's not "public grazing land."

ChrisL · Apr 21, 2014

Re: Armed guards surround Bundy, supporters fear imminent threat

Kobie said:
It's public land. It's not intended for grazing. Hence, it's not "public grazing land."

It IS public land. Otherwise the feds couldn't tax it's use DERP. :doh

Grant · Apr 21, 2014

Re: Armed guards surround Bundy, supporters fear imminent threat

ChrisL said:
Well, I for one, can't believe anyone was fooled by the same old rhetoric coming from a politician. :roll:

|Well you may not have been it seems many were! Hope and change is what they all promise. More Of The Same doesn't sell as well.

Kobie · Apr 21, 2014

Re: Armed guards surround Bundy, supporters fear imminent threat

ChrisL said:
It IS public land. Otherwise the feds couldn't tax it's use DERP. :doh

I said it was public land. Pay attention. You're omitting a key word.

ChrisL · Apr 21, 2014

Re: Armed guards surround Bundy, supporters fear imminent threat

Kobie said:
I said it was public land. Pay attention. You're omitting a key word.

It is public grazing land. That is why they charge ranchers taxes for it's use. Unfortunately, they have overstepped their boundaries, as that should be a state issue, and the states should have control over the land. The feds control 87% of Nevada land.

The fight involves a 600,000-acre area under BLM control called Gold Butte, near the Utah border. The vast and rugged land is the habitat of the protected desert tortoise, and ranchers whose cattle graze there must pay fees. Bundy, a descendant of Mormons who settled in Bunkerville more than 140 years ago, claims an inherent right to graze the area and casts the conflict as a states' rights issue. He said he doesn't recognize federal authority on land that he insists belongs to Nevada.

Kobie · Apr 21, 2014

Re: Armed guards surround Bundy, supporters fear imminent threat

ChrisL said:
It is public grazing land. That is why they charge ranchers taxes for it's use. Unfortunately, they have overstepped their boundaries, as that should be a state issue, and the states should have control over the land. The feds control 87% of Nevada land.

Well, guess what. They don't. You can't say "well, this is the way it SHOULD be" as a justification for someone breaking the law.

Pot should be legal, but if I get busted with a pound of it (where I live), I'm in trouble. Claiming I don't believe in the government's right to prosecute me for it doesn't fly.

ChrisL · Apr 21, 2014

Re: Armed guards surround Bundy, supporters fear imminent threat

Kobie said:
Well, guess what. They don't. You can't say "well, this is the way it SHOULD be" as a justification for someone breaking the law.

That can be changed. The people and state governments are getting tired with the feds taking more than their share from everyone.

It’s time for Western states to take control of federal lands within their borders, lawmakers and county commissioners from Western states said at Utah’s Capitol on Friday.

More than 50 political leaders from nine states convened for the first time to talk about their joint goal: wresting control of oil-, timber -and mineral-rich lands away from the feds.

ttwtt78640 · Apr 21, 2014

Re: Armed guards surround Bundy, supporters fear imminent threat

Kobie said:
Well, guess what. They don't. You can't say "well, this is the way it SHOULD be" as a justification for someone breaking the law.

Pot should be legal, but if I get busted with a pound of it (where I live), I'm in trouble. Claiming I don't believe in the government's right to prosecute me for it doesn't fly.

Nonsense - that is the Obama justification for his "dreamy" immigration law enforcement and his desire to provide pardons/clemency for federal drug law convicts.

Kobie · Apr 21, 2014

Re: Armed guards surround Bundy, supporters fear imminent threat

ChrisL said:
That can be changed. The people and state governments are getting tired with the feds taking more than their share from everyone.

And that's great, if they want to change the law, more power to them. However, it still doesn't justify the rancher's actions, or the actions of his militia buddies.

Kobie · Apr 21, 2014

Re: Armed guards surround Bundy, supporters fear imminent threat

ttwtt78640 said:
Nonsense - that is the Obama justification for his "dreamy" immigration law enforcement and his desire to provide pardons/clemency for federal drug law convicts.

Then you change the law. You don't break it and claim that you should be allowed to after the fact.

Linc · Apr 21, 2014

Re: Armed guards surround Bundy, supporters fear imminent threat

Did you know that the state of Nevada charges $12 a head for grazing on their land?
Mr. Bundy should get to pay this fee if he wants to, rather than the $1.35 a head fee from the BLM .

ChrisL said:
That can be changed. The people and state governments are getting tired with the feds taking more than their share from everyone.

Linc · Apr 21, 2014

Re: Armed guards surround Bundy, supporters fear imminent threat

That would also be Sen. Rubio's dream immigration bill wouldn't it?
He still gets booed by the TEAs for the Senate bill he sponsored that the GOP House won't touch .

ttwtt78640 said:
Nonsense - that is the Obama justification for his "dreamy" immigration law enforcement and his desire to provide pardons/clemency for federal drug law convicts.

ChrisL · Apr 21, 2014

Re: Armed guards surround Bundy, supporters fear imminent threat

Kobie said:
And that's great, if they want to change the law, more power to them. However, it still doesn't justify the rancher's actions, or the actions of his militia buddies.

Sometimes that's the only way to stop a huge monster money-eating machine like our federal government, especially when we have entities, organizations and even citizens who want to keep feeding it and supporting it's goals.

ChrisL · Apr 21, 2014

Re: Armed guards surround Bundy, supporters fear imminent threat

ttwtt78640 said:
Nonsense - that is the Obama justification for his "dreamy" immigration law enforcement and his desire to provide pardons/clemency for federal drug law convicts.

Good point. They are willing to forgive MILLIONS of illegal immigrants for breaking the law.

Kobie · Apr 21, 2014

Re: Armed guards surround Bundy, supporters fear imminent threat

ChrisL said:
Sometimes that's the only way to stop a huge monster money-eating machine like our federal government, especially when we have entities, organizations and even citizens who want to keep feeding it and supporting it's goals.

By threatening federal employees with firearms?

The anti-government hysteria from so many here is just astounding. Yes, the government is quite often guilty of waste and overreach. This is not one of those times.

ChrisL · Apr 21, 2014

Re: Armed guards surround Bundy, supporters fear imminent threat

Kobie said:
By threatening federal employees with firearms?

The anti-government hysteria from so many here is just astounding. Yes, the government is quite often guilty of waste and overreach. This is not one of those times.

They have taken control of 87% of Nevada land. That is not overreaching to you? Good Lord!

ttwtt78640 · Apr 21, 2014

Re: Armed guards surround Bundy, supporters fear imminent threat

NIMBY said:
That would also be Sen. Rubio's dream immigration bill wouldn't it?
He still gets booed by the TEAs for the Senate bill he sponsored that the GOP House won't touch .

Changing the law, or at least proposing to, is not ignoring the law.

Kobie · Apr 21, 2014

Re: Armed guards surround Bundy, supporters fear imminent threat

ChrisL said:
They have taken control of 87% of Nevada land. That is not overreaching to you? Good Lord!

"Taken control of"? They've HAD control of said land since 1848.

Ask the RGJ: Who released Nevada's public lands?

Reno News & Review - The 87 percent deception - News - Local Stories - April 1, 2010

The second link talks about how the 87% figure isn't quite accurate, and explains how that number has gone down over the years.

Linc · Apr 21, 2014

Re: Armed guards surround Bundy, supporters fear imminent threat

I agree with you Uhland.
The House said they would act last year.
This is the problem with 2-year election cycles--nothing will get done this year either.
This is why I've long proposed a 3-year House term.

ttwtt78640 said:
Changing the law, or at least proposing to, is not ignoring the law.

If the House is going to go with an incremental approach when they act, let's get started.
People like you are much more likely to have a keen insight since you live in a border state.
We must have state and local input as well as enforce current laws.
As you know, Obama is none too popular with "Latino" groups for his unprecedented level of deportations .

ChrisL · Apr 21, 2014

Re: Armed guards surround Bundy, supporters fear imminent threat

Kobie said:
"Taken control of"? They've HAD control of said land since 1848.

Ask the RGJ: Who released Nevada's public lands?

Reno News & Review - The 87 percent deception - News - Local Stories - April 1, 2010

The second link talks about how the 87% figure isn't quite accurate, and explains how that number has gone down over the years.

And? It doesn't negate my claims. The federal government is out of control. It is a power hungry, money grubbing, corrupt entity, and it became that way little by little, people giving in when they make their new laws sound good to the sheeple who don't understand the unintended consequences and implications of an all powerful centralized form of government.

Kobie · Apr 21, 2014

Re: Armed guards surround Bundy, supporters fear imminent threat

ChrisL said:
And? It doesn't negate my claims. The federal government is out of control. It is a power hungry, money grubbing, corrupt entity, and it became that way little by little, people giving in when they make their new laws sound good to the sheeple who don't understand the unintended consequences and implications of an all powerful centralized form of government.

Cool story.

None of which changes the fact that the guy was freeloading off public land for 20 years, and when it came time to put a stop to it, a bunch of militia ****kickers rolled in and started waving guns in the faces of federal employees like a bunch of thugs.

AJiveMan · Apr 21, 2014

Re: Armed guards surround Bundy, supporters fear imminent threat

Kobie said:
Cool story.

None of which changes the fact that the guy was freeloading off public land for 20 years, and when it came time to put a stop to it, a bunch of militia ****kickers rolled in and started waving guns in the faces of federal employees like a bunch of thugs.

And hiding behind women's skirts and babies diapers.

Armed guards surround Bundy, supporters fear imminent threat[W:208]

ChrisL

Kobie

ChrisL

Kobie

ChrisL

Grant

Kobie

ChrisL

Kobie

ChrisL

ttwtt78640

Sometimes wrong

Kobie

Kobie

Linc

NIMBY

Linc

NIMBY

ChrisL

ChrisL

Kobie

ChrisL

ttwtt78640

Sometimes wrong

Kobie

Linc

NIMBY

ChrisL

Kobie

AJiveMan

Paying To Play