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Thread: Feds move in on Nevada rancher's herd over illegal grazing

  1. #231
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    Re: Feds move in on Nevada rancher's herd over illegal grazing

    Quote Originally Posted by jonny5 View Post
    Or, since those activites are unconstitutional, cease such actions and save the citizens money regulating things they have no right to regulate. How are you a libertarian again?
    Libertarian: The philosophy that the purpose of government is to protect our rights. I have a right to use public lands. So do you. The problem comes when your use of the land impinges on my use of the land, or vice versa. If I want to bring back the practice of hydraulic mining, for example, my use of the land just might impinge on you if you'd like to use it for hunting or fishing. When that happens, the government has to regulate the lands we all own in common so that we can all use the lands. Proper use of the land costs money for the construction of trails, roads, bridges, fences, etc. It is only right that the users of public lands pay those costs. The taxpayer shouldn't have to pay to have a parking lot paved on our local BLM lands so I can go there, park my truck, and hike around or hunt quail. It's only right that I and my fellow hunters/hikers/mountain bikers pay that cost. Same with cattle grazing. I don't really need fences to hunt quail, find them a nuisance in fact, but the cattle rancher needs them, and should pay for them.
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  2. #232
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    Re: Feds move in on Nevada rancher's herd over illegal grazing

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    You mean the power of the people to use public lands any way they want without paying any fees?
    There is a public school not too far from my house and the principal is a ****in nazi. It has the best park and playground in the neighborhood and they lock it down and shoo any of the public out of there. One time I was watching my little brothers there during daytime hours but when school was out of session and this dude came out and started wildly accusing me of drinking and leaving bear cans on the playground. I wonder why the school is so hostile and quick to kick everyone out. Its like they have their own little agenda with public property and its very ****ing annoying. Call the feds.

    :p
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  3. #233
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    Re: Feds move in on Nevada rancher's herd over illegal grazing

    Quote Originally Posted by dirtpoorchris View Post
    There is a public school not too far from my house and the principal is a ****in nazi. It has the best park and playground in the neighborhood and they lock it down and shoo any of the public out of there. One time I was watching my little brothers there during daytime hours but when school was out of session and this dude came out and started wildly accusing me of drinking and leaving bear cans on the playground. I wonder why the school is so hostile and quick to kick everyone out. Its like they have their own little agenda with public property and its very ****ing annoying. Call the feds.

    :p
    On the one hand, the people who pay taxes pay for the school and should be able to use it. On the other hand, there probably are people who leave beer cans and other trash around, as well as write graffiti and leave a general mess. That seems to be a problem wherever the public has access to anything. It is unfortunate that we have such yahoos in our society, but they are a fact of life.

    And then there is the liability. Allow people to use an area, they get hurt by doing something stupid, and it's the owner of the land that gets sued. That's not how it should be, you understand, but how it is.
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  4. #234
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    Re: Feds move in on Nevada rancher's herd over illegal grazing

    Quote Originally Posted by jonny5 View Post
    Its an opinion, thus it cant be proven true or false. So no need to be insulting. Also, the 'feds' weren't there first. Native americans were. Then the Spanish, then Mexicans, then American citizens. At the time of statehood, the land was owned by free people, who chose to join the Union. They did not put in their constitution any land ownership for the federal govt, and since the bill of rights prohibits the federal govt from taking land for such purposes, its illegal.
    The land at issue was purchased from the Mexican govt by the Federal govt and has been owned by the feds since then. When the state joined the union, it agreed that these public lands were owned by the feds. The BoR does not forbid the govt from purchasing land from other nations.
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    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
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  5. #235
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    Re: Feds move in on Nevada rancher's herd over illegal grazing

    Quote Originally Posted by jonny5 View Post
    You mean pay down debt, which would never happen. An alternative would be getting rid of the BLM, thus saving 1.5 billion.
    You mean make BLM something other than government lands? No management? Or mismanaged? The lands that so many people like myself have enjoyed the use of so much?

    Lands where ordinary people can go to discover things, things like this? Land of openness where people can enjoy themselves?

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  6. #236
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    Re: Feds move in on Nevada rancher's herd over illegal grazing

    Quote Originally Posted by AJiveMan View Post
    You mean make BLM something other than
    government lands? No management? Or mismanaged? The lands that so many people like myself have enjoyed the use of so much?

    Lands where ordinary people can go to discover things, things like this? Land of openness where people can enjoy themselves?

    mine.JPG
    Too bad the BLM isn't so concerned with public lands on the North Side of the Rio Grande.

    You know, the lands that illegals have turned into a Dump.

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    Re: Feds move in on Nevada rancher's herd over illegal grazing

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
    Too bad the BLM isn't so concerned with public lands on the North Side of the Rio Grande.

    You know, the lands that illegals have turned into a Dump.
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  8. #238
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    Re: Feds move in on Nevada rancher's herd over illegal grazing

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    The fight involves a 600,000-acre area under BLM control called Gold Butte, near the Utah border. The vast and rugged land is the habitat of the protected desert tortoise, and the land has been off-limits for cattle since 1998. Five years before that, when grazing was legal, Bundy stopped paying federal fees for the right.
    I might have been with him but for the bolded above. He doesn't even qualify to be grandfathered in under the law, and it's entirely his own doing.
    Unfortunately, I have to agree. I say unfortunately because there are still so many things where the government is in the wrong on this overall issue, and this is just another sign of the government's heavy-handedness that needs to stop, but... in this particular case the guy has screwed himself and removed any moral high ground that he might have otherwise had.
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    Re: Feds move in on Nevada rancher's herd over illegal grazing

    That is an issue also if it involves public land use.

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    Re: Feds move in on Nevada rancher's herd over illegal grazing

    Quote Originally Posted by radcen View Post
    Unfortunately, I have to agree. I say unfortunately because there are still so many things where the government is in the wrong on this overall issue, and this is just another sign of the government's heavy-handedness that needs to stop, but... in this particular case the guy has screwed himself and removed any moral high ground that he might have otherwise had.
    It seems to have ended peacefully enough for now but perhaps they'll look more closely to these situations in the future, not just from a legal pov but also from a philosophical and moral one.

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