Page 129 of 142 FirstFirst ... 2979119127128129130131139 ... LastLast
Results 1,281 to 1,290 of 1412

Thread: Feds move in on Nevada rancher's herd over illegal grazing

  1. #1281
    Sage
    Moot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Utah
    Last Seen
    Today @ 02:56 AM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    27,472

    Re: Feds move in on Nevada rancher's herd over illegal grazing

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Not by use of para-military units.
    I would think that catching armed poachers and cartel marijuana growers on federal land kinda requires SWAT like tactics.
    Last edited by Moot; 04-26-14 at 07:47 PM.

  2. #1282
    Sage
    Moot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Utah
    Last Seen
    Today @ 02:56 AM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    27,472

    Re: Feds move in on Nevada rancher's herd over illegal grazing

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    How come not ewually riled about the IRS employees that collectively owe a BILLION dollars in back taxes?
    Well, its kinda hard to get riled over something I don't know anything about.

  3. #1283
    Sage

    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    okla-freakin-homa
    Last Seen
    Today @ 06:35 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Progressive
    Posts
    12,626

    Re: Feds move in on Nevada rancher's herd over illegal grazing

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    pfft! The "tortoise argument" has already been debunked as little more than a rouse to allow authoritarian action by this administration. If the cattle are detrimental to the tortoise, then you shouldn't be able to pay a fee to continue....All this is, (analogy here) is protection money, paid to the government mob.
    You obviously don't run cattle- I do. You seem to be clueless on what the facts truly are- given your attempt to call the BLM permit system a 'protection money' gambit I'd say hyperpartisanship has deluded you.

    First the area Bundy is using WAS CLOSED to cattle grazing- so no amount of money was getting cattle back in there- so much for the government mob crap!

    Next the reason the system uses permits is to CONTROL the number of cattle allowed on any given area. This is to prevent overgrazing, not shake down ranchers. Fact is fellow ranchers 'shake down' each other far harder than the Feds. The permits are a pittance of fair market value- reselling them at a tidy profit is common. (again so much for an 'authoritarian action')

    I can see a very limited use of the tortoise habitat by cattle- it won't help the tortoise much as without cattle grazing and trampling forage other herbivores can produce the dung tortoises can use. BUT the number of permits would vary from year to year depending on forage production- which is very rain dependent.

    NOBODY lets a rancher graze their land for free... why should the USofA Taxpayer?

  4. #1284
    Sage
    j-mac's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    South Carolina
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 09:18 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    30,322

    Re: Feds move in on Nevada rancher's herd over illegal grazing

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    The bolded distinction is very important. Bundy refuses to pay the fees, based on lunacy, yet demands continued use of the land. Do you have some evidence that Bundy had paid someone else for current use of that land?
    I understand what you're saying. But as far as I know, Bundy had paid his fees up to 1993 when the BLM arbitrarily change (doubled) the fees, and gave the excuse of some supposedly 'endangered species of tortoise'.... It was at that point that Bundy stopped paying....

    Now, don't get me wrong, he went about it in the wrong way, and IMHO, stupidly refused to use qualified legal assistance to wage his complaint...But at this point, I just don't think that he is adept enough at addressing the crux of the matter for him in proper terminology for the media that is looking to destroy him.
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

    Alexis de Tocqueville

  5. #1285
    Sage
    j-mac's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    South Carolina
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 09:18 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    30,322

    Re: Feds move in on Nevada rancher's herd over illegal grazing

    Quote Originally Posted by AJiveMan View Post
    So the militia rented supersonic aircraft and flew to Bunkerville from Idaho, Colorado and other states, that's amazing. I didn't know militias had access to such modern vehicles.
    What are you talking about? The timeline in the WaPo gives a pretty accurate account, and I don't see where it says anything about the militia's getting there before the BLM, or even simultaneously....

    According to the article, The BLM started to round up Bundy's cattle on March 27th....Militia didn't start showing up until April 10th....As far as I know, it is pretty easy to get from one side of the country to the other in 4 days, much less 2 weeks...

    This is what I am talking about with progressive government supporters distorting the facts of this incident.

    Here is the article....Again.

    Everything you need to know about the long fight between Cliven Bundy and the federal government
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

    Alexis de Tocqueville

  6. #1286
    Sage
    j-mac's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    South Carolina
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 09:18 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    30,322

    Re: Feds move in on Nevada rancher's herd over illegal grazing

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    If you were to have the job of evicting a deadbeat, and were told that 200 armed supporters were coming to help him, and that you'd better have your funeral arrangements made, would you:

    a. simply show up and ask him to pretty please leave, or
    b. show up with enough force to turn the possible slaughter into a stand off?

    Personally, I'd pick b.
    Ok, so, do you only support the right to protest where the government says you can?
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

    Alexis de Tocqueville

  7. #1287
    Sage

    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Florida
    Last Seen
    Today @ 05:53 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    23,375

    Re: Feds move in on Nevada rancher's herd over illegal grazing

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    What are you talking about? The timeline in the WaPo gives a pretty accurate account, and I don't see where it says anything about the militia's getting there before the BLM, or even simultaneously....

    According to the article, The BLM started to round up Bundy's cattle on March 27th....Militia didn't start showing up until April 10th....As far as I know, it is pretty easy to get from one side of the country to the other in 4 days, much less 2 weeks...

    This is what I am talking about with progressive government supporters distorting the facts of this incident.

    Here is the article....Again.

    Everything you need to know about the long fight between Cliven Bundy and the federal government
    LOL That article was full of misinformation. For one Bundy bought his ranch in the 1940's, his ancestors never raised cattle in the 1800's.

  8. #1288
    Sage
    j-mac's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    South Carolina
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 09:18 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    30,322

    Re: Feds move in on Nevada rancher's herd over illegal grazing

    Quote Originally Posted by notquiteright View Post
    You obviously don't run cattle- I do. You seem to be clueless on what the facts truly are- given your attempt to call the BLM permit system a 'protection money' gambit I'd say hyperpartisanship has deluded you.

    First the area Bundy is using WAS CLOSED to cattle grazing- so no amount of money was getting cattle back in there- so much for the government mob crap!

    Next the reason the system uses permits is to CONTROL the number of cattle allowed on any given area. This is to prevent overgrazing, not shake down ranchers. Fact is fellow ranchers 'shake down' each other far harder than the Feds. The permits are a pittance of fair market value- reselling them at a tidy profit is common. (again so much for an 'authoritarian action')

    I can see a very limited use of the tortoise habitat by cattle- it won't help the tortoise much as without cattle grazing and trampling forage other herbivores can produce the dung tortoises can use. BUT the number of permits would vary from year to year depending on forage production- which is very rain dependent.

    NOBODY lets a rancher graze their land for free... why should the USofA Taxpayer?
    No, I don't run cattle....I think it is clear in here what my profession is, I have stated it many times, so your snarky small minded attack is unwelcome.

    No, I am NOT clueless. I may not know all of the 'in's, and out's' of the system, but I can read, and I can look past the rhetoric and see what is going on here....It's about money.

    Let's not kid ourselves here, if Bundy had gone along and paid the fines, and fees, you wouldn't even know who the hell he was, and he, and his cattle would be grazing there today....So, yes, there is an amount of money that the Government mafia wanted as protection shakedown to keep him there....

    Your bringing up of the sale of permits between ranchers is irrelevant to this topic.

    The "tortoise" excuse is just that, an excuse....nothing more...You want the real people behind this crackdown on Bundy, look to the Sierra club, The Centers for Biological Diversity, and other like minded anti human activists...

    No one said that Bundy shouldn't pay his fees....Why do I have to keep repeating that to you people?
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

    Alexis de Tocqueville

  9. #1289
    Sage
    j-mac's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    South Carolina
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 09:18 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    30,322

    Re: Feds move in on Nevada rancher's herd over illegal grazing

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    LOL That article was full of misinformation. For one Bundy bought his ranch in the 1940's, his ancestors never raised cattle in the 1800's.
    I am always told that the WaPo is a credible source...If you have something disputing a part of the article, that certainly doesn't dismiss the rest of the timeline....See this is what happens here....You progressives love to take a factual lay out of a timeline like this one, and because the writer of the article possibly (I don't know for sure because you didn't offer anything in the form of proof to back up your remark) got a part of background off, then that is cause for you to dismiss the entire thing in favor of your own warped rhetoric....

    LOL indeed.
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

    Alexis de Tocqueville

  10. #1290
    Sage

    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    okla-freakin-homa
    Last Seen
    Today @ 06:35 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Progressive
    Posts
    12,626

    Re: Feds move in on Nevada rancher's herd over illegal grazing

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    No, I don't run cattle....I think it is clear in here what my profession is, I have stated it many times, so your snarky small minded attack is unwelcome. No, I am NOT clueless. I may not know all of the 'in's, and out's' of the system, but I can read, and I can look past the rhetoric and see what is going on here....It's about money. Let's not kid ourselves here, if Bundy had gone along and paid the fines, and fees, you wouldn't even know who the hell he was, and he, and his cattle would be grazing there today....So, yes, there is an amount of money that the Government mafia wanted as protection shakedown to keep him there....Your bringing up of the sale of permits between ranchers is irrelevant to this topic. The "tortoise" excuse is just that, an excuse....nothing more...You want the real people behind this crackdown on Bundy, look to the Sierra club, The Centers for Biological Diversity, and other like minded anti human activists... No one said that Bundy shouldn't pay his fees....Why do I have to keep repeating that to you people?
    Not being snarky- a man can have done more than one thing in his life- damn sure should have. You could have come from a ranching family, could have done a little ranch work going through school... you seem rather narrow minded in so many ways, AND you are totally clueless on the BLM, land management and grazing rates/costs.

    You seem woefully ignorant of the facts and want to run a CON game. The land Bundy was ILLEGALLY running cattle on has been CLOSED to grazing since the early 90's. IF the 'Gubmint' was running a shake down then they wouldn't have closed the range and wouldn't limit the number of permits they issue. If Bundy was a law abiding man he wouldn't be grazing his cattle on the CLOSED BLM land and yes we wouldn't know him from Adam's alley cat.

    You just can't seem to get this through the partisan haze surrounding you... the range land Bundy ILLEGALLY grazes is CLOSED!

    Ranchers reselling the permits is very germane to this... the permits are cheap- far cheaper than the lease/rent on private land so this ain't a 'Gubmint' mob deal. More like a sweetheart deal to a few ranchers at taxpayer expense. If it wasn't a sweet deal the permits wouldn't be on the resale market at FOUR TIMES their face value!!!!

    If it's all about the Benjamins then the permits would be AT LEAST fair market value of similar private range land...

    Yes the Conservationists are demanding the BLM enforce the court orders to remove Bundy cattle from CLOSED range land, but that is what the courts already decided. Since 1998 the courts have ruled Bundy needs to remove his cattle and he represented himself on appeal so he knows damn well what happened. Why do I have to keep repeating THAT to you people????

    I'm not taking issue with Bundy needs to pay his fines, YOU keep trying a lame CON game with that crap. Where I take issue with your CON crap is ANY thought on Bundy paying to run cattle on BLM land, and obeying the permit limit would have him still on the land CLOSED to grazing. Closed over 20 years ago BTW.

    It simply would not. Those grazing rights were bought up in 1993 and retired.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •