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Thread: Economy adds 192,000 jobs; unemployment rate holds steady at 6.7%

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    Re: Economy adds 192,000 jobs; unemployment rate holds steady at 6.7%

    Quote Originally Posted by mmi View Post
    I lived through it. I was a junior in college when Mr. Carter was elected. I don't remember things the same way.

    Real (inflation-adjusted) GDP grew at 4.6%, 5.6%, 3.2%, and -0.2%. That last year, 1980, certainly was not a good one. We had been hit by the second oil shock in '79, and the Fed put interest rates through the roof.

    There was indeed a recovery in 1981, but real GDP went up only 2.6%. Then we had a very bad year in 1982, down by 1.9%. The next six years were 4.6%, 7.3%, 4.2%, 3,5%, 3.5%, and 4.2%.

    During that time, per capita national debt increased by 92%. That's quite a stimulus.

    Attachment 67166470

    The underlying trend can be seen by looking at a ten-year moving average:

    Attachment 67166471

    Things were more or less steady although somewhat restrained under Carter, and at first declined sharply and then recovered rapidly under Reagan. You can compare the overall numbers in this chart of annualized GDP growth:

    Attachment 67166472

    I would argue that the very strong year (1984) was a recovery from a business cycle recession, while the economy Obama inherited had suffered a near-collapse of the financial sector more akin to the Great Depression. The dynamics and psychology are different. Even if things are handled properly, a few years are typically required to unwind, deleverage, and settle people's fears. I'm hoping we're in a good position now and that 2014 and beyond will see substantial growth. There's no doubt that public optimism will be required.

    >>See, this is the Liberal battle cry..."Nothing we can do about it".... I don't buy that, it's defeatist, and IMHO, Not what most American's think.

    You mistook my meaning. I was responding to "Sorry, something stinks in the data." I was being a wise-ass. Happens about once every few minutes. Fwiw, I don't agree that the "data stinks."

    >>Simply not true...The labor force participation rate is the lowest in history, and hasn't seen these type of numbers since 1978...

    LFP has indeed been declining since the turn of the century for a variety of reasons, mostly demographic. (The best way to solve that is through immigration reform.) But the numbers aren't all that significant.

    Here's the question i would ask you: Between 1948 and 1968, LFP never went above 60%. Since then, it's gone up to around 66% and now back down to around 63% as baby boomers have begun to retire and fewer women are working. Between '48 and '68, GDP quadrupled. It went up in every year except 1949. I'd say we could use a strong, stable expansion like that. Will we get it? Difficult t' say.

    If we don't, I don't think it'll be because LFP is 63% instead of 66%. Other factors, like our educational and infrastructure base, and, yes, our fiscal discipline will be more decisive. That does not, imo, mean that we need to shrink the government. It means we need to improve the effectiveness and efficiency of both the private and public sectors. One way to get a lot of that done is to have them work more effectively together. I say we need to "own" the government, not rail against it. We are the government. That is the powerful legacy and heavy responsibility we've both earned and inherited.

    >>Obama has had 6 years so far to turn this around, with similar situations upon entering office it only took Reagan 3 years

    Ii think yer overstating Mr. Reagan's achievements and understating Mr. Obama's challenges.
    Not to be flippant but, all I see in your reply is the same excuse making the administration doles out.

    Let me ask, you really see Obama less than 1% growth even close to the Reagan years?
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

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    Re: Economy adds 192,000 jobs; unemployment rate holds steady at 6.7%

    Quote Originally Posted by Helix View Post
    mine sure don't. they spend most of their time indulging their trickle down fantasies, trying to choke public schools to death, union busting, or getting into stupid dick measuring contests with foreign dictators. it's sad.

    jobs. infrastructure. energy. maybe if i type it enough times, the NSA will pick it up and send the idea up the pipeline.
    your opinion is noted but fortunately that isn't reality in all states or local communities. What you are claiming is that individuals in those local communities are choking their schools to death by cutting funding. You see, you have no idea what funds public schools.

    Maybe they will send it up the pipeline but what will come back is a request for more money, not an explanation as to what the money given to them in taxes was used for. You are like far too many not knowing what your taxes are supposed to fund and what they actually fund so your stock answer is just throw more money at the problem rather than assure the dollars already collected are spent wisely.

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    Re: Economy adds 192,000 jobs; unemployment rate holds steady at 6.7%

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    your opinion is noted but fortunately that isn't reality in all states or local communities. What you are claiming is that individuals in those local communities are choking their schools to death by cutting funding. You see, you have no idea what funds public schools.

    Maybe they will send it up the pipeline but what will come back is a request for more money, not an explanation as to what the money given to them in taxes was used for. You are like far too many not knowing what your taxes are supposed to fund and what they actually fund so your stock answer is just throw more money at the problem rather than assure the dollars already collected are spent wisely.
    My dad was president of the local school board for the past ten years. He quit in protest a couple months ago. Employees were getting ****ed over due to the state's idiocy. He didn't want to be a part of it.

    Both my parents were school teachers, so I know a little bit about it. The Republican state government has made me angry. Unfortunately, the voters have given it unchecked power.

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    Re: Economy adds 192,000 jobs; unemployment rate holds steady at 6.7%

    Quote Originally Posted by Helix View Post
    My dad was president of the local school board for the past ten years. He quit in protest a couple months ago. Employees were getting ****ed over due to the state's idiocy. He didn't want to be a part of it.

    Both my parents were school teachers, so I know a little bit about it. The Republican state government has made me angry. Unfortunately, the voters have given it unchecked power.
    Sounds like your dad doesn't understand how the funding works even though he was on the school board and that is scary. Where does the funding come for the schools in your community? better think about that one for a while

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    Re: Economy adds 192,000 jobs; unemployment rate holds steady at 6.7%

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Sounds like your dad doesn't understand how the funding works even though he was on the school board and that is scary. Where does the funding come for the schools in your community? better think about that one for a while
    The last governor cut the education budget by 300 million.

    As for the property tax base, Republicans capped it, so extra funding can only be obtained via ballot initiatives. We used to have a lot of money in the city, but trickle down didn't work, factories were shipped off by the job creators, and now the area is broke. Every ballot initiative has been voted down.

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    Re: Economy adds 192,000 jobs; unemployment rate holds steady at 6.7%

    Quote Originally Posted by Helix View Post
    The last governor cut the education budget by 300 million.

    As for the property tax base, Republicans capped it, so extra funding can only be obtained via ballot initiatives. We used to have a lot of money in the city, but trickle down didn't work, factories were shipped off by the job creators, and now the area is broke. Every ballot initiative has been voted down.
    The last governor cut nothing, he proposed the cuts and the legislature approved those cuts.

    Imagine that extra funding obtained by ballot initiative? How about that, people being given the chance to determine how their money is spent? You really don't understand how the private sector works and apparently have no problem with the 3.8 trillion dollar Federal Govt. Yes, there is the answer, give the Federal govt. more money so they can spend it the way they want not the way the people in your state or community want.

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    Re: Economy adds 192,000 jobs; unemployment rate holds steady at 6.7%

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    The last governor cut nothing, he proposed the cuts and the legislature approved those cuts.

    Imagine that extra funding obtained by ballot initiative? How about that, people being given the chance to determine how their money is spent? You really don't understand how the private sector works and apparently have no problem with the 3.8 trillion dollar Federal Govt. Yes, there is the answer, give the Federal govt. more money so they can spend it the way they want not the way the people in your state or community want.
    I realize that your attitude is tough ****. The Republican party's attitude towards this kind of stuff when workers are involved is generally also tough ****. You guys have taken a mid to late 1990s Republican and turned him into a left independent who generally is forced to vote democrat just to stop the far right of your party from doing something else that I can't support. When your party is making corporatist Democrats look palatable, then you know your platform has reached new levels of suck.

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    Re: Economy adds 192,000 jobs; unemployment rate holds steady at 6.7%

    Quote Originally Posted by Helix View Post
    I realize that your attitude is tough ****. The Republican party's attitude towards this kind of stuff when workers are involved is generally also tough ****. You guys have taken a mid to late 1990s Republican and turned him into a left independent who generally is forced to vote democrat just to stop the far right of your party from doing something else that I can't support. When your party is making corporatist Democrats look palatable, then you know your platform has reached new levels of suck.
    You are right, don't forget we also want to starve kids, kill seniors, and pollute the air as well. You don't seem to understand personal responsibility at all. All the Federal Govt. should guarantee is equal opportunity to be the best you can be and not equal outcome.

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    Re: Economy adds 192,000 jobs; unemployment rate holds steady at 6.7%

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    You are right, don't forget we also want to starve kids, kill seniors, and pollute the air as well. You don't seem to understand personal responsibility at all. All the Federal Govt. should guarantee is equal opportunity to be the best you can be and not equal outcome.
    i don't think that the average republican wants any of those things. i do think that your economic theory doesn't work, and that most of what you succeed in passing makes it worse for the average worker most of the time.

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    Re: Economy adds 192,000 jobs; unemployment rate holds steady at 6.7%

    Quote Originally Posted by Helix View Post
    i don't think that the average republican wants any of those things. i do think that your economic theory doesn't work, and that most of what you succeed in passing makes it worse for the average worker most of the time.
    My economic theory when allowed to be executed always works, it is called creating incentive and rewarding risk taking. Liberals don't like risk taking and want equal outcome. That has destroyed more economies than it will ever help. Ever stop and think what creates an average workers? Hmmm, how about average or below average effort?

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