• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

U.S. warns China not to attempt Crimea-style action in Asia

MildSteel

Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
Mar 5, 2014
Messages
4,974
Reaction score
1,047
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
Here's another reason why it was a bad idea to have been over aggressive in the UKraine with regards to Yanukovych rejecting the EU deal. That's something we should have left for the Europeans to do. It appears that we have opened a can of worms. Do we really want to go to war with China too over some small islands that the Japanese claim? It's time for a serious rethink of our foreign policy.

U.S. warns China not to attempt Crimea-style action in Asia

U.S. warns China not to attempt Crimea-style action in Asia

China should not doubt the U.S. commitment to defend its Asian allies and the prospect of economic retaliation should also discourage Beijing from using force to pursue territorial claims in Asia in the way Russia has in Crimea, a senior U.S. official said on Thursday.

Daniel Russel, President Barack Obama's diplomatic point man for East Asia, said it was difficult to determine what China's intentions might be, but Russia's annexation of Crimea had heightened concerns among U.S. allies in the region about the possibility of China using force to pursue its claims.

"The net effect is to put more pressure on China to demonstrate that it remains committed to the peaceful resolution of the problems," Russel, the U.S. assistant secretary of state for East Asia, told the Senate Foreign Relations Committee.

Russel said the retaliatory sanctions imposed on Russia by the United States, the European Union and others should have a "chilling effect on anyone in China who might contemplate the Crimea annexation as a model."

This was especially so given the extent of China's economic interdependence with the United States and its Asia neighbors, Russel said.

Russel said that while the United States did not take a position on rival territorial claims in East Asia, China should be in no doubt about Washington's resolve to defend its allies if necessary.

"The president of the United States and the Obama administration is firmly committed to honoring our defense commitments to our allies," he said.

While Washington stood by its commitments - which include defense treaties with Japan, the Philippines and South Korea - Russel said there was no reason why the rival territorial claims could not be resolved by peaceful means.

He said he hoped the fact that the Philippines had filed a case against China on Sunday at an arbitration tribunal in The Hague would encourage China to clarify and remove the ambiguity surrounding its own claims.

Russel termed the deployment of large numbers of Chinese vessels in its dispute with the Philippines in the South China Sea "problematic" and said that Beijing had taken "what to us appears to be intimidating steps."

"It is incumbent of all of the claimants to foreswear intimidation, coercion and other non-diplomatic or extra-legal means," he said.

In Asia, China also has competing territorial claims with Japan and South Korea, as well as with Vietnam, Malaysia, Brunei and Taiwan in potentially energy-rich waters.

Obama is due to visit Japan, South Korea, Malaysia and the Philippines from April 22, when he is expected to stress his commitment to a rebalancing of U.S. strategic and economic focus towards the Asia-Pacific region in the face of an increasingly assertive China.
 
The US should work with Europe to restart the Missile Defense Shield in Poland. Russia crossed a line and blatantly broke international law. As the US and the EU have only essentially wagged their finger at Russia and imposed moderate sanctions, of course the world must now be concerned with those nations that may replicate the action. The US should send a strong signal with the EU that those who disrespect international law will be alienated from the global community, and I personally (though I never thought I would say this) agree with Dick Cheney, that the missile defense system needs to be put back on the table.
 
Most definitely. At most some meaningless sanctions, as any real economic measures would, at this point, hurt the US economy as well.
Also if I'm not mistaken Russia and China have a defense pact, so down the line a clash with both is a very real possibility.
 
Also if I'm not mistaken Russia and China have a defense pact, so down the line a clash with both is a very real possibility.

The Shanghai Cooperation Organization composed of China, Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Russia, Tajikistan, and Uzbekistan is an organization began in 1996 in order to ally these nations against the West. Essentially Russia and China have both expressed a desire to balance the US's power and influence in the world and have joined together in order to do so.

What we should asks ourselves is whether this is inevitable. The US is the first society to reach hegemony since Rome and throughout history balance of power has always again been established. I wonder how much longer the US can maintain its perch at the top and think it may only preserve it through war. But can we really afford that?
 
I really don't think it's wise for the US to take positions that will encourage China and Russia to cooperate more in the area of defense. It would give China something rather interesting to do with all those US dollars that it has.

Not wise.
 
Really?

Threatening China with economic sanctions?

I'd like to see that!

Yeah, that would be interesting. Just think what would happen if China banned all US exports, froze all US assets in China, and Russia and China both started selling all the US treasuries that they could. That would be beyond ugly for both sides.
 
I really don't think it's wise for the US to take positions that will encourage China and Russia to cooperate more in the area of defense. It would give China something rather interesting to do with all those US dollars that it has.

Not wise.
Your right, China also has a very powerful military. They and Russia received a lot of U.S. military secrets they obtained from the spy Jonathon Pollard, who stole enough secrets to fill a walk in closet.
 
Hypothetically, if China did seize that small island, what exactly could the US do about it? Sanctions aren't an option. Military isn't an option. I don't know that the US has a foreign policy to address such an action and given China's ownership of so much of the US debt isn't America the eunuch in the room on this issue?
 
Hypothetically, if China did seize that small island, what exactly could the US do about it? Sanctions aren't an option. Military isn't an option. I don't know that the US has a foreign policy to address such an action and given China's ownership of so much of the US debt isn't America the eunuch in the room on this issue?

One option, while not an immediate solution, would be the strengthening of our manufacturing base. China needs to export as much as we are dependent on imports.
 
One option, while not an immediate solution, would be the strengthening of our manufacturing base. China needs to export as much as we are dependent on imports.

That's a good idea and it's something we should be doing regardless. Unfortunately, as you have hinted, that is something that would take a while.
 
What if it wasn't a small island, but North Korea that China suddenly decided to invade and liberate from it's oppressive gov't?? While we all can recognize that China does have a very oppressive gov't, they are vastly better than NK and a Chinese take-over of NK would definitely make things better for the people of NK and bring a large measure of stability to that region.
 
Your right, China also has a very powerful military. They and Russia received a lot of U.S. military secrets they obtained from the spy Jonathon Pollard, who stole enough secrets to fill a walk in closet.

Although they have a powerful military, they are quite a bit behind the US in terms of technical capabilities. But the thing is that they haven't really tried to match the US in that regard. Instead they have concentrated more on devising asymmetric types of defense. It's my understanding that the idea to fly planes into skyscrapers actually came from a Chinese military planner.

However, if China felt threatened, it could start to focus more on increasing it's capabilities. If they were to work more closely with Russia in that regard, the two of them together could become quite formidable.
 
Although they have a powerful military, they are quite a bit behind the US in terms of technical capabilities. But the thing is that they haven't really tried to match the US in that regard. Instead they have concentrated more on devising asymmetric types of defense. It's my understanding that the idea to fly planes into skyscrapers actually came from a Chinese military planner.

However, if China felt threatened, it could start to focus more on increasing it's capabilities. If they were to work more closely with Russia in that regard, the two of them together could become quite formidable.


While I agree China and Russia are both dangerous, let us not forget that their economies are both rather feeble behind the curtain. If all else failed, denying Russia the ability to sell its oil and gas would strangle it. China is not really interested in global domination, it is concerned more about shoring up it's surroundings to insulate itself from outsiders.

Globalization has brought with it cheap goods and economic interdependence and these things make us all vulnerable. It has proven to be the achilles heel of the US in foreign policy. US companies sought to maximize profits through cheap labor and production costs by going to China, and in the end succeeded in making the US economy weak enough that we now cannot effectively act as the world's lone superpower.
 
Where some see potential impotence with regard to China and Russia, I see (As a conservative free capitalist) an opportunity. It's actually what this country desperately needs. Unlike China and unlike Russia, the US, Canada, and Mexico together are self sustaining economies. Yes, the initial hit would be hard and if not managed properly by our Federal government could be disastrous, BUT, if handled correctly it would provide the biggest boon to all three nations that neither has ever experienced before, not even the boon after WWII. We don't need to actually have a military engagement, instead if worked properly, we could politically unite all of us, and also create a massive economic monster. Right now we share in the wealth and industry that we mostly invented and created, but we don't have too, and we shouldn't be, IMO. Think of zero unemployment for all three North American nations, and median income rising to levels not heard of. All because of a few tiny islands and a peninsula.

Of course, Obama is too short sighted to see this, and American's that get their viewpoints from the likes of the Krugmans's of the world, and the liberal wing of the democratic party would never understand what we could become if we really stopped doing business with Russia and China, but the theory is logical, and ideally correct. It's what we should be doing anyway as our economy is sinking and bleeding, and unless we provide a stable growth based economy for our own interests, we will eventually find ourselves here anyway. It's inevitable, so why not start the process now. We can still trade with other nations, and I think a few of those South American countries would welcome participation, not to mention the virtually untapped African continent.

Tim-
 
Yeah, that would be interesting. Just think what would happen if China banned all US exports, froze all US assets in China, and Russia and China both started selling all the US treasuries that they could. That would be beyond ugly for both sides.

Who would buy them?
 
Where some see potential impotence with regard to China and Russia, I see (As a conservative free capitalist) an opportunity. It's actually what this country desperately needs. Unlike China and unlike Russia, the US, Canada, and Mexico together are self sustaining economies. Yes, the initial hit would be hard and if not managed properly by our Federal government could be disastrous, BUT, if handled correctly it would provide the biggest boon to all three nations that neither has ever experienced before, not even the boon after WWII. We don't need to actually have a military engagement, instead if worked properly, we could politically unite all of us, and also create a massive economic monster. Right now we share in the wealth and industry that we mostly invented and created, but we don't have too, and we shouldn't be, IMO. Think of zero unemployment for all three North American nations, and median income rising to levels not heard of. All because of a few tiny islands and a peninsula.

Of course, Obama is too short sighted to see this, and American's that get their viewpoints from the likes of the Krugmans's of the world, and the liberal wing of the democratic party would never understand what we could become if we really stopped doing business with Russia and China, but the theory is logical, and ideally correct. It's what we should be doing anyway as our economy is sinking and bleeding, and unless we provide a stable growth based economy for our own interests, we will eventually find ourselves here anyway. It's inevitable, so why not start the process now. We can still trade with other nations, and I think a few of those South American countries would welcome participation, not to mention the virtually untapped African continent.

Tim-

Obama is the wrong president for this sort of thing, he's too busy with social justice and too inept at foreign policy.
 
While I agree China and Russia are both dangerous, let us not forget that their economies are both rather feeble behind the curtain. If all else failed, denying Russia the ability to sell its oil and gas would strangle it. China is not really interested in global domination, it is concerned more about shoring up it's surroundings to insulate itself from outsiders.

Globalization has brought with it cheap goods and economic interdependence and these things make us all vulnerable. It has proven to be the achilles heel of the US in foreign policy. US companies sought to maximize profits through cheap labor and production costs by going to China, and in the end succeeded in making the US economy weak enough that we now cannot effectively act as the world's lone superpower.

Don't blame US companies.
 
U.S. warns China not to attempt Crimea-style action in Asia

can we just build some roads and cut this other **** out?

i mean, seriously. the roads are in horrible shape here. yeah, it sucks for Japan that China is being an asshole, but we don't have enough money to get into a bar fight with them. ****, we'd probably have to borrow the money from them to do it in the first place.

energy.
jobs.
infrastructure.

one more time, for the NSA :

energy.
jobs.
infrastructure.


seriously.
 
Back
Top Bottom