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Thread: FBI Seizes Thousands of Artifacts from rural Indiana Home

  1. #71
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    Re: FBI Seizes Thousands of Artifacts from rural Indiana Home

    Quote Originally Posted by AJiveMan View Post
    Exactly correct.

    I had a friend who lived near Mimbres, New Mexico. He pointed me to areas where if you dug the hard dry ground, you could find pieces of pottery, possibly dating back to the Mogollon Culture.

    Of course, anything found or dug on what was National Forest Land or BLM land must be declared, it must be reported to local authorities, as I understand, it is not exactly legal to mine for pottery or artifacts on those lands.
    Read up on land ownership. BLM pretty much owns every square inch.
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    Re: FBI Seizes Thousands of Artifacts from rural Indiana Home

    Quote Originally Posted by sawyerloggingon View Post
    If it's legal fine. Most of my experience with artifacts has been in Utah where I have always taken my spring vacation and it is highly illegal there because of all the Anasazi ruins that get pilfered, not to mention all the dino stuff you can find laying around.
    In texas, it is common to find sites that are just littered in flakes and flint chips, and occasionally a nice point. Central texas was a goldmine for knappable flint, and many of the na's were nomadic. Large significant burial (or other) sites are uncommon.
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  3. #73
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    Re: FBI Seizes Thousands of Artifacts from rural Indiana Home

    Quote Originally Posted by Del Zeppnile View Post
    Like I said, if it's on my land it's mine. Mineral rights are another matter, but if somone is buried on my land and there is nobody left who can demonstrate that it is their relative, I don't care, I'll do with it/them as I please.
    Maybe your state allows desecration of cemeteries, the disinterment of human remains, and perhaps even trafficking in the aforementioned.

    I can't really say without knowing what state you're in.

    In most of the state, though, doing any of those things is a felony.

    You may not care, and you may do as you please.

    But the way you're talking it sounds like you have a right, by law, to do those things.

    And most likely, almost certainly, you don't.

    What state is the property we're discussing located in?

    I probably won't adverstise it, but I will do what I need to do. And isn't that what oftenhappens already? Someone is building a parking lot and they come across something that looks like an old burial; somebody then decides to conceal the find so as not to end up losing their property rights.
    No, that isn't "what people do".

    They report the find, they apply for a bill that allows them to move the remains, and then they move them.

    Unless maybe we're talking about the Russian mob in which case, yeah, they probably just pave over the remains of throw them in the trash.

    If these tribes aren't prepared to finacially compensate finders of their "culture", they may not ever even know about the find. Just saying.
    That's another matter entirely, and I don't entirely disagree with your sentiment.
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  4. #74
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    Re: FBI Seizes Thousands of Artifacts from rural Indiana Home

    Quote Originally Posted by RiverDad View Post
    For anyone who studies bureaucracy this is easy to understand - bureaucracies are self-perpetuating. If you have an art-crime team, then that team needs to find something to do in order to justify its existence. If your town has a citizen safety committee, then that committee of bureaucrats is always going to find new ways of spending money to justify its existence.
    Only by placing strict limits on what actions may be taken by a bureaucracy can it be put to proper use - because I have no doubt that we need a bureaucracy for certain tasks.
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    Re: FBI Seizes Thousands of Artifacts from rural Indiana Home

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Government loves taking property, it's one of the few things it's really good at.
    Yea, "We're from the FED, and we are here to help you...."

    My ass they are.
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  6. #76
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    Re: FBI Seizes Thousands of Artifacts from rural Indiana Home

    Appalling waste of time and taxpayer dollars over what is probably BS.

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  7. #77
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    Re: FBI Seizes Thousands of Artifacts from rural Indiana Home

    Quote Originally Posted by Soupnazi630 View Post
    According to the fourth amendmen they may not do this without a warrant.

    Also according to the fourth the reasons they give are not justifications for issueing a warant.
    That isn't true. It doesn't say a warrant is required, it states the conditions to issue a warrant. The protection is against the definition of "reasonable." A warrant is a tool that orders the action. A warrant isn't always required.

    "The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized."

    Now I do see this as unreasonable as unless there is proof he obtained these improperly, then they are his property.

  8. #78
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    Re: FBI Seizes Thousands of Artifacts from rural Indiana Home

    Quote Originally Posted by sawyerloggingon View Post
    It is illegal to treasure hunt indian artifacts and the fact that this guy has so many is suspicious. Years ago we were camping in an alcove in Utah which was very cool. It had petroglyph's on the back wall and it was a kick to spend a few nights in an ancient dwelling. While digging a fire pit I cut a small piece of what looked like fishing line that I assumed some other camper left there as trash at some point. Turns out it was an alarm to guard against artifact hunters and it wasn't long until a BLM cop showed up. I had some splainin to do.
    Suspicion is not probable cause.

    Maybe he had an Indian friend he inherited them from. Unless you know the facts... speculation and suspicion is not probable cause.

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    Re: FBI Seizes Thousands of Artifacts from rural Indiana Home

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord of Planar View Post
    That isn't true. It doesn't say a warrant is required, it states the conditions to issue a warrant. The protection is against the definition of "reasonable." A warrant is a tool that orders the action. A warrant isn't always required.

    "The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized."

    Now I do see this as unreasonable as unless there is proof he obtained these improperly, then they are his property.

    You are essentially correct. Absent probable cause to believe some were illegally obtained, this is a "fishing expedition"... and those are not supposed to fly...

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    Re: FBI Seizes Thousands of Artifacts from rural Indiana Home

    Quote Originally Posted by Superfly View Post
    If that's the case, every treasure hunter in the entire world has just been rendered unemployed, and a potential felon.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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