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Thread: UN Assembly declares Crimea referendum invalid

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    Re: UN Assembly declares Crimea referendum invalid

    Quote Originally Posted by Travis007 View Post
    send in the blue helmets... Im sure Putin will tremble..

    Bret Stephens: Putin's Moment - WSJ.com

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    Re: UN Assembly declares Crimea referendum invalid

    Quote Originally Posted by DA60 View Post
    Okay, but why specifically does the UN not recognize it?

    Because unless they can prove that the referendum was rigged - I see no problem with a territory leaving a country after a successful referendum.
    The Crimea was occupied when the referendum was held. You see nothing strange in that?

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    Re: UN Assembly declares Crimea referendum invalid

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    spot on bro.. right on..

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    Re: UN Assembly declares Crimea referendum invalid

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    The Crimea was occupied when the referendum was held. You see nothing strange in that?
    Occupied?

    There were Russian troops based there as per a prior agreement with Ukraine.

    Besides, every poll I saw before the referendum showed that most Crimeans wanted to join Russia.


    So, by your logic, then every single election in Afghanistan (and before in Iraq) is/was illegal because there are foreign troops occupying the country?

    So, when Allied troops occupied Germany after WW2, that means every election was illegal to you because foreign troops were occupying the country?


    And I wanted the specific reasons - as stated by the UN, not by some guy on a chat forum.

    Do you have a link that gives the UN's official reasons for their decision?
    Last edited by DA60; 04-10-14 at 01:11 PM.

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    Re: UN Assembly declares Crimea referendum invalid

    Quote Originally Posted by DA60 View Post
    Occupied?

    There were Russian troops based there as per a prior agreement with Ukraine.

    Besides, every poll I saw before the referendum showed that most Crimeans wanted to join Russia.


    So, by your logic, then every single election in Afghanistan (and before in Iraq) is/was illegal because there are foreign troops occupying the country?

    So, when Allied troops occupied Germany after WW2, that means every election was illegal to you because foreign troops were occupying the country?


    And I wanted the specific reasons - as stated by the UN, not by some guy on a chat forum.

    Do you have a link that gives the UN's official reasons for their decision?
    They were invaded, had a referendum organized, and were annexed in the space of several weeks. The comparisons fall flat.

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    Re: UN Assembly declares Crimea referendum invalid

    Did this assembly do an in-depth investigation? It seems premature to reach this conclusion. It's certainly not unreasonable to think that these people might actually want to be part of Russia. Ukraine hasn't always been kind to it's ethnically Russian population.
    Liberté. Égalité. Fraternité.

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    Re: UN Assembly declares Crimea referendum invalid

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    Did this assembly do an in-depth investigation? It seems premature to reach this conclusion. It's certainly not unreasonable to think that these people might actually want to be part of Russia. Ukraine hasn't always been kind to it's ethnically Russian population.
    Does it need to do one? Its seems like an analogous situation would be if the United States invaded Quebec, organized a referendum, held it two weeks later while keeping 40,000 troops in the province, and then declared it either independent or annexed it. Assuming that it actually was the popular result it would still be an incredibly invalid referendum and political act.

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    Re: UN Assembly declares Crimea referendum invalid

    Quote Originally Posted by Sherman123 View Post
    They were invaded, had a referendum organized, and were annexed in the space of several weeks. The comparisons fall flat.
    Should I waste my time debating the ignorant (on world affairs), self-serving rambling's of a neocon on this?

    Pass.

    You are mostly wrong on this, I am mostly right on this.

    You disagree...I don't much care...we are done.


    Good day.

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    Re: UN Assembly declares Crimea referendum invalid

    Quote Originally Posted by DA60 View Post
    Should I waste my time debating the ignorant (on world affairs), self-serving rambling's of a neocon on this?

    Pass.

    You are mostly wrong on this, I am mostly right on this.

    You disagree...I don't much care...we are done.


    Good day.
    That was a weak rebuttal. Though foreign troops were stationed in Afghanistan, post-WW2 Germany, etc., they did not vote to annex the country to those foreign nations. There is a clear distinction when you are sending troops into a sovereign nation, and within weeks there is a vote of questionable legitimacy giving that country to you. The resemblance is slight at best.

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    Re: UN Assembly declares Crimea referendum invalid

    Quote Originally Posted by StringBean View Post
    That was a weak rebuttal. Though foreign troops were stationed in Afghanistan, post-WW2 Germany, etc., they did not vote to annex the country to those foreign nations. There is a clear distinction when you are sending troops into a sovereign nation, and within weeks there is a vote of questionable legitimacy giving that country to you. The resemblance is slight at best.
    it wasn't a rebuttal...I don't have enough respect for that guy on this subject to waste my time with a proper 'rebuttal'. It was a 'whatever'.


    Also, so where is your link to factual, unbiased proof that those troops had zero influence on those votes in those other countries?

    If you are saying that Iraqi's or Afghani's were not in any meaningful way influenced by their countries crawling with foreign troops (with their leader's own agenda's) then you are very naive, IMO.

    Also, those Russian troops were not all over the Crimea. They were in and around their Black Sea naval base. Sure, there were other troops in key locations that people assume were masked Russian troops...but there is no proof of that. Evidence, yes...proof, no.

    Besides, the polls long before the whole mess began were - to my knowledge - for rejoining Russia.

    Which would you rather be a part of...a country that is broke that is falling into apparent chaos that just erased Russian language as an officially recognized language (Ukraine) or a politically stable (though quite corrupt), financially much more secure nation that many of your descendants came from (Russia)?

    The answer is obvious.


    Anyway, this is all moot...I don't really care what people 'feel' about this. I have an opinion and so do they...why waste time debating it? I doubt I will change their minds and the same goes for me...so why bother? I am really just interested in facts.

    All I want to know - and I still have not got an answer - is what was the official UN reason for their decision?

    Not theories or guesses..the OFFICIAL reason.
    Last edited by DA60; 04-12-14 at 02:02 PM.

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