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Thread: Obamacare tops 6 million signups [W:263:617]

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    Re: Obamacare tops 6 million signups [W:263:617]

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    What opinion piece? This discussion is not limited to one opinion piece that he wrote

    Once again, your attempt to define the limits of a discussion has failed
    I wasn't having the discussion with you. I was having it with Glen. I posted to him and quoted one part of his post.

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    Re: Obamacare tops 6 million signups [W:263:617]

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    I wasn't having the discussion with you. I was having it with Glen.
    This discussion is open to any member of DP

    Another of your attempts to control the discussion has failed
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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    Re: Obamacare tops 6 million signups [W:263:617]

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    This discussion is open to any member of DP

    Another of your attempts to control the discussion has failed
    Of course it is. But I wasn't having the discussion with you; it was with Glen. You're free to butt in every time. But that doesn't change the fact that I don't answer to you on what I post to other people. You aren't a moderator, are you, sangha?

    Now, what would you like to talk about now that you've gotten my attention, which I assume is what you were looking for? I've only read bits and pieces of the piece that Butler published in 1989. Do you have a link that neatly summarizes the plan that The Heritage Foundation published (not the Butler piece)? The one Butler published in 1989 which was actually a lecture he gave as I recall was published with the statement that nothing written in it were to be construed as reflecting the views of The Heritage Foundation, or words to that effect.

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    Re: Obamacare tops 6 million signups [W:263:617]

    Here you go sangha. Bottom of page 2.

    http://healthcarereform.procon.org/s..._americans.pdf

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    Re: Obamacare tops 6 million signups [W:263:617]

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    It was a man named Stuart Butler from The Heritage Foundation, Glen, and he only suggested the individual mandate. Obamacare isn't just about the individual mandate, is it?
    Perhaps you should research a little more. Here's from another member of the Heritage Foundation, in a 2006 article supporting the idea of health insurance exchanges:

    Short of congressional action to reform the tax code, the burden to improve health coverage rests with state officials. The best way to enable individuals and families to buy, own, and keep health insurance from job to job-without losing the tax advantages of the employment-based coverage-is to transform the balkanized and dysfunctional state health insurance market into a single health insurance market. This new market would function well for all sorts of individuals and small businesses, not just workers employed by large companies.

    And how about those "pre-existing conditions? Here's a link to a page that links to "The Bush Plan" (from George H. W. Bush):

    Less than two decades later, in what remains an unexplored chapter of health care history, a surprising supporter of the individual mandate was George H.W. Bush. According to contemporaneous reporting, Bush used "the tax system to 'encourage and empower' individuals to buy health insurance and would enact insurance market reforms that make it possible for everyone -- even if they have pre-existing health problems -- to get insurance." In short: individuals would be mandated to buy catastrophic health insurance. The cost of that coverage would be tied to income, meaning that the poorer you were, the less expensive your policy would be.

    Here's a link to the .pdf file itself - the pertinent quote is found at the bottom of page 25 of the document.

    So...that's the individual mandate, the health insurance exchanges, the coverage of pre-existing conditions all supported by the cognoscenti of the GOP long before any of us ever heard of Obama. Got anything else?
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    Re: Obamacare tops 6 million signups [W:263:617]

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    Exactly! The problem is that people genuinely expect that money to be waiting for them and that is doubtful. Reform was tried during the early years of the Bush Administration but failed.
    It should be waiting for them, that's the issue. It's really too late to fix the problem without incurring massive debt replacing all the funds that the government has stolen from Social Security, that's why we have to keep a vigilant eye on our elected representatives and punish them severely for violating the public trust.
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    Re: Obamacare tops 6 million signups [W:263:617]

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    Of course it is. But I wasn't having the discussion with you; it was with Glen. You're free to butt in every time. But that doesn't change the fact that I don't answer to you on what I post to other people. You aren't a moderator, are you, sangha?
    Avoiding backing up your claims (you avoided responding as to what HF opinion piece you were referring to) is definitely something you are allowed to do. I am merely pointing out how your pitiful whines about who you were responding to won't distract attention from the way you have failed to support your claims

    Now, what would you like to talk about now that you've gotten my attention, which I assume is what you were looking for? I've only read bits and pieces of the piece that Butler published in 1989. Do you have a link that neatly summarizes the plan that The Heritage Foundation published (not the Butler piece)? The one Butler published in 1989 which was actually a lecture he gave as I recall was published with the statement that nothing written in it were to be construed as reflecting the views of The Heritage Foundation, or words to that effect.
    Ahh, finally you are actually responding and it turns out that you haven't read the actual report yet you make claims about what it says and what it does not say.

    It's clear that your claim was just something you made up.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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    Re: Obamacare tops 6 million signups [W:263:617]

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    Here you go sangha. Bottom of page 2.

    http://healthcarereform.procon.org/s..._americans.pdf
    There is nothing anywhere on page 2 that supports your claim
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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    Re: Obamacare tops 6 million signups [W:263:617]

    Quote Originally Posted by Glen Contrarian View Post
    Perhaps you should research a little more. Here's from another member of the Heritage Foundation, in a 2006 article supporting the idea of health insurance exchanges:

    Short of congressional action to reform the tax code, the burden to improve health coverage rests with state officials. The best way to enable individuals and families to buy, own, and keep health insurance from job to job-without losing the tax advantages of the employment-based coverage-is to transform the balkanized and dysfunctional state health insurance market into a single health insurance market. This new market would function well for all sorts of individuals and small businesses, not just workers employed by large companies.

    And how about those "pre-existing conditions? Here's a link to a page that links to "The Bush Plan" (from George H. W. Bush):

    Less than two decades later, in what remains an unexplored chapter of health care history, a surprising supporter of the individual mandate was George H.W. Bush. According to contemporaneous reporting, Bush used "the tax system to 'encourage and empower' individuals to buy health insurance and would enact insurance market reforms that make it possible for everyone -- even if they have pre-existing health problems -- to get insurance." In short: individuals would be mandated to buy catastrophic health insurance. The cost of that coverage would be tied to income, meaning that the poorer you were, the less expensive your policy would be.

    Here's a link to the .pdf file itself - the pertinent quote is found at the bottom of page 25 of the document.

    So...that's the individual mandate, the health insurance exchanges, the coverage of pre-existing conditions all supported by the cognoscenti of the GOP long before any of us ever heard of Obama. Got anything else?
    Thank you for links, Glen, but they don't support your post:

    1. You'll find that most of the standards were suggested by the Heritage foundation when they first proposed what we today call Obamacare.

    The first link (from 2006), while interesting, doesn't validate the above. Was what he suggested incorporated into the ACA?

    The link showing that GHWB advocated the idea of an individual mandate doesn't have anything to do with The Heritage Foundation.

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    Re: Obamacare tops 6 million signups [W:263:617]

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    There is nothing anywhere on page 2 that supports your claim
    Look above the demographic information on the bottom of page 2. The first word is "Note".

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