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Thread: Obamacare tops 6 million signups [W:263:617]

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    Re: Obamacare tops 6 million signups [W:263]

    Moderator's Warning:
    Obamacare tops 6 million signups [W:263:617]Multiple Infractions and thread bans have been issued. I suggest going forward people stick to the topic rather than trying to make other posters the focus of the thread

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    Re: Obamacare tops 6 million signups [W:263:617]

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    I haven't seen proof that even one single person has lost their insurance due to ACA.

    I know some have lost a specific plan, but as far as I know, they all got coverage from a plan which provided even more coverage than their previous plan. But again, if you have any proof that shows i'm wrong about this, I'm all ears.
    The guy on CNN at lunch time asked the same question I did, the answer was there is no way to tell. I will take his word for it as there are folks like you who claimed no one had their insurance canceled and others who say everyone did. So how many of those six million who had their policies canceled due to Obamacare got their new policies via the government web site. Per CNN, there is no way to tell.
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

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    Re: Obamacare tops 6 million signups [W:263:617]

    This I find interesting:

    (1) RAND corporation – “A new study from the RAND corporation indicates that only one-third of exchange sign-ups were previously uninsured. The RAND study hasn’t yet been published, but its contents were made available to Noam Levey of the Los Angeles Times. RAND also estimates that 9 million individuals have purchased health plans directly from insurers, outside of the exchanges, but that “the vast majority of these people were previously insured.”

    (2) Goldman Sachs – “Goldman Sachs is projecting that only 1 million Obamacare sign-ups will come from previously uninsured Americans. Indeed, it estimates that the number of total signups will be just 4 million — not 6 million, as the administration claims — because ‘HHS figures . . .count all persons who selected an ACA exchange plan regardless of whether or not they have actually completed the enrollment process by paying their premium.’ Goldman Sachs also anticipates that fully 75 percent of all the Obamacare sign-ups will be from people who already had insurance.”

    (3) McKinsey – “Of the Obamacare sign-ups, only 27 percent had been previously uninsured in 2013. And of the 27 percent, nearly half had yet to pay a premium. (By contrast, among the 73 percent who had been previously insured, 86 percent had paid).”

    What does all of this mean, I really do not know. I think I will a few months to find out. But from what I have heard on the news, the ACA really hasn't put much of a dent into the uninsured. It did expand medicaid, but with more people going on medicaid and the number of doctors shrinking who accept medicaid, one has to wonder if it is worth anything.
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

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    Re: Obamacare tops 6 million signups [W:263:617]

    Quote Originally Posted by Perotista View Post
    The guy on CNN at lunch time asked the same question I did, the answer was there is no way to tell. I will take his word for it as there are folks like you who claimed no one had their insurance canceled and others who say everyone did. So how many of those six million who had their policies canceled due to Obamacare got their new policies via the government web site. Per CNN, there is no way to tell.
    You know, I consider you to a person of integrity who backs up their opinions with facts. Sure, I don't always agree with your conclusions, but that' to be expected when two people have different backgrounds, experiences and points of view. That's why I'm disappointed in this post of yours

    For one thing, I never said that no one lost their insurance. What I did say is that I haven't seen any proof that anyone has lost coverage.

    For another, contrary to your usual habit, you've been going on about how so many people have lost insurance even though you really don't if even one person has lost coverage.

    For example, you continue to claim that six million people lost coverage due to ACA. That figure has been widely debunked.

    "More people got cancellations than signed up": The numbers never supported this claim, and the latest estimates make it even more of a fantasy. It's based on the wave of reports late last year of insurance companies canceling old policies that didn't meet ACA standards, which led to hysterical claims that as many as 17 million Americans were being left uninsured.

    Rand's figures support earlier estimates that fewer than 1 million people who had health plans in 2013 are now uninsured because of cancellations. Insurance companies that issued the cancellation notices say they've retained "the vast majority" of their old customers, mostly by moving them into new, compliant, plans.


    Obamacare numbers coming in huge: Here's a guide to GOP excuse-making - latimes.com
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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    Re: Obamacare tops 6 million signups [W:263:617]

    Quote Originally Posted by Perotista View Post
    This I find interesting:

    (1) RAND corporation – “A new study from the RAND corporation indicates that only one-third of exchange sign-ups were previously uninsured. The RAND study hasn’t yet been published, but its contents were made available to Noam Levey of the Los Angeles Times. RAND also estimates that 9 million individuals have purchased health plans directly from insurers, outside of the exchanges, but that “the vast majority of these people were previously insured.”

    (2) Goldman Sachs – “Goldman Sachs is projecting that only 1 million Obamacare sign-ups will come from previously uninsured Americans. Indeed, it estimates that the number of total signups will be just 4 million — not 6 million, as the administration claims — because ‘HHS figures . . .count all persons who selected an ACA exchange plan regardless of whether or not they have actually completed the enrollment process by paying their premium.’ Goldman Sachs also anticipates that fully 75 percent of all the Obamacare sign-ups will be from people who already had insurance.”

    (3) McKinsey – “Of the Obamacare sign-ups, only 27 percent had been previously uninsured in 2013. And of the 27 percent, nearly half had yet to pay a premium. (By contrast, among the 73 percent who had been previously insured, 86 percent had paid).”

    What does all of this mean, I really do not know. I think I will a few months to find out. But from what I have heard on the news, the ACA really hasn't put much of a dent into the uninsured. It did expand medicaid, but with more people going on medicaid and the number of doctors shrinking who accept medicaid, one has to wonder if it is worth anything.
    1) People who buy plans outside the exchange are not counted as part of the 6-7 million

    2 & 3)

    "Most of them were already insured": The argument here is that if we've just moved people from one insurance plan to another, we've just been wasting Americans' time and subjecting them to an onerous bureaucratic procedure as well.
    The claim is based primarily on a survey in January from McKinsey and Co., which concluded that only 11% of exchange enrollees had been previously uninsured. A McKinsey survey a month later raised that figure to 27% -- still low, compared to expectations.
    The major problem with the McKinsey survey is that doesn't say what its hawkers claim. The survey combines on-exchange enrollments and off-exchange enrollments; the latter are likely to heavily skew figures toward the previously insured because those are people merely signing up again with their existing carriers. The goal of the exchange marketplaces, however, is to reach uninsured Americans, and the McKinsey surveys fail to do that.
    The few states that do break out their own numbers, moreover, contradict McKinsey. Kentucky says that some 75% of its exchange enrollees were previously uninsured. New York says that about 60% of its exchange enrollees were previously uninsured. That number has been rising over time, raising the prospect that the March surge will include an even higher ratio of uninsured customers; Gaba, who has calculated a time series of New York enrollments based on the state's monthly news releases, calculates that of enrollees in mid-February, at least 92% had been uninsured.


    Obamacare numbers coming in huge: Here's a guide to GOP excuse-making - latimes.com
    Please stop repeating nonsense that was debunked months ago
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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    Re: Obamacare tops 6 million signups [W:263:617]

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    1) People who buy plans outside the exchange are not counted as part of the 6-7 million

    2 & 3)



    Please stop repeating nonsense that was debunked months ago
    Okay, I will just stick to elections.
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

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    Re: Obamacare tops 6 million signups [W:263:617]

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    You know, I consider you to a person of integrity who backs up their opinions with facts. Sure, I don't always agree with your conclusions, but that' to be expected when two people have different backgrounds, experiences and points of view. That's why I'm disappointed in this post of yours

    For one thing, I never said that no one lost their insurance. What I did say is that I haven't seen any proof that anyone has lost coverage.

    For another, contrary to your usual habit, you've been going on about how so many people have lost insurance even though you really don't if even one person has lost coverage.

    For example, you continue to claim that six million people lost coverage due to ACA. That figure has been widely debunked.
    So you think CNN lies. Okay, I am fine with that.
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

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    Re: Obamacare tops 6 million signups [W:263:617]

    Quote Originally Posted by Perotista View Post
    So you think CNN lies. Okay, I am fine with that.
    I really hope you're not expecting me to defend a cable news channel
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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    Re: Obamacare tops 6 million signups [W:263]

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    "Dude" You are wrong about funding for Medicare. 100% comes from the Medicare trust fund which can only be used for that purpose. If you can't even understand such a simple fact how could you possibly have a clue about something as complex as healthcare?

    How Medicare is funded | Medicare.gov
    Medicare is funded by the trust funds, yes, but the money from the trust fund comes from taxpayers AND funds authorized by congress. It's right there in your link (the SMI portion). Your argument is akin to me saying that public broadcasting doesn't cost taxpayers money because the CPB funds public broadcasting. Well, yeah, but the CPB gets money from congress. I'm not against the CPB, I'm for it, and I'm also for Medicare, but realistically, Medicare can't pay for itself. As the baby boomers reach retirement age, Medicare is going to face larger and larger shortfalls in budget.
    A working class hero is something to be

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    Re: Obamacare tops 6 million signups [W:263]

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    Would you rather that none of those people got insurance and we celebrate *that*?

    That's BS. If "many of us" were in favor of that, there wouldn't be so many states refusing to expand Medicaid
    Health Care is the important thing. Not health care insurance.

    Expanding Medicaid should have been done with increased payroll taxes to pay. And not leaving states with additional unfunded burdens.

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