Labor board: Northwestern University football players can unionize

[the_recruit]

Re: NLRB rules NW University footballers can unionize

no they generate 10 of millions in revenue that is not all profit.

Nope. See above.

in fact most athletics run on the edge as they have to fund a ton of sports that do not make money.

So what?

like the volleyball and soccer teams. football and basketball sometimes pays for almost all of the funding the athletic department uses.

football revenue isn't just used for football but all the sports programs.

So what?

 

[RiverDad]

Re: NLRB rules NW University footballers can unionize

Look at the expenses

Alabama had $123,370,004 in expenses for a whopping profit of $399,837 or $4,703 per player

Alabama incurred only $33,553,257 in detailed expenses. What is the remaining $90 million in expenses covering? Likely profit. I'm guessing that there are some hinky accounting rules in play here where the school loads non-athletic expenses onto the budget to eat up that $90 million.

Check the math yourself.

 

[RiverDad]

What union ever agreed to a cap on compensation? Hell, these athletes will want a pension after graduation. LOL

If an athlete is good enough to be drafted into the pros, then he makes himself some coin and if he gets injured with a career ending injury, then he at least benefited before he got put out of the game for good. What happens to that very same player who gets a career ending injury during a college game?

 

[ludin]

Re: NLRB rules NW University footballers can unionize

That data's from 2008. Revenues (and profits) have grown substantially since then.

USA Today | Sports | COLLEGE

Profits for 2012:

Texas - $25million

tOSU - $18million

Michigan - $25million

Alabama - $17million

....

yep and that money goes back into the school to improve facilities among other things. it is also saved for future scholarships and other travel related expenses that
come up.

 

[the_recruit]

Re: NLRB rules NW University footballers can unionize

yep and that money goes back into the school to improve facilities among other things. it is also saved for future scholarships and other travel related expenses that
come up.

SO WHAT? What is your ****ing point? Why does this mean that college athletes who help earn tens of millions of dollars for their schools should be banned from being paid for it?

 

[ludin]

Re: NLRB rules NW University footballers can unionize

Nope. See above.



So what?



So what?

so if they have no money how do you expect them to pay players? i think only about 23-30 athletic departments make money other lose and have to find donations to make up the difference.

so what is all you can come up with then you don't have much of an argument to make.

 

[ludin]

Re: NLRB rules NW University footballers can unionize

SO WHAT? What is your ****ing point? Why does this mean that college athletes who help earn tens of millions of dollars for their schools should be banned from being paid for it?

they already get compensated to the tune of 100-120k+ is that not enough for you?
which if they are employee's under IRS rules that is now taxable.

i seriously doubt they thought this through. in fact i know they didn't.

 

[the_recruit]

Re: NLRB rules NW University footballers can unionize

they already get compensated to the tune of 100-120k+ is that not enough for you?

I don't give a **** what they're paid. Let the market decide. Right now the NCAA has a prohibition on athletes being paid for their work. It's a gross interference with the free market operation of student-athlete labor and needs to be lifted.

which if they are employee's under IRS rules that is now taxable.

If it's income it should be taxed accordingly.

i seriously doubt they thought this through. in fact i know they didn't.

:roll:

 

[RiverDad]

Re: NLRB rules NW University footballers can unionize

they already get compensated to the tune of 100-120k+ is that not enough for you?
which if they are employee's under IRS rules that is now taxable.

i seriously doubt they thought this through. in fact i know they didn't.

The solution to end this problem is simple - Northwestern can follow the lead of the auto manufacturers, they can move their football program and stadium to Mexico and get lower priced football player labor there.

 

[ludin]

Re: NLRB rules NW University footballers can unionize

I don't give a **** what they're paid. Let the market decide. Right now the NCAA has a prohibition on athletes being paid for their work. It's a gross interference with the free market operation of student-athlete labor and needs to be lifted.

wait you said they needed to be compensated. i told you they were and you said you didn't care.
what exactly is your argument again.

when added up a college football player gets about 100-120k+ depending on the school to play football.

If it's income it should be taxed accordingly.

Sure tell a kid that has no money that he owes 60k plus a year in taxes for playing a sport.:roll:

:roll:

That pretty much sums up your argument.

 

[ludin]

Re: NLRB rules NW University footballers can unionize

The solution to end this problem is simple - Northwestern can follow the lead of the auto manufacturers, they can move their football program and stadium to Mexico and get lower priced football player labor there.

or they won't fool with it and shut down their athletic programs or they will do what the ivy league did and not offer scholarships.

 

[azgreg]

Re: NLRB rules NW University footballers can unionize

Oh please. College athletics has been proven to be a billion dollar industry. It can generate tens of millions of dollars in profit for colleges themselves. Neither companies nor colleges are going to squander the money to be made there just because the athletes start demanding a cut. Have some faith in the Almighty Dollar.

Let's play a game. How many college athletic departments currently operate in the black without paying athletes?

You can answer that without pulling down your pants.

 

[ludin]

Re: NLRB rules NW University footballers can unionize

Let's play a game. How many college athletic departments currently operate in the black without paying athletes?

You can answer that without pulling down your pants.

last number i checked was 23-30 or so.

 

[the_recruit]

Re: NLRB rules NW University footballers can unionize

wait you said they needed to be compensated.

Where did I say they "need to be compensated"? Quote me exactly please.

i told you they were and you said you didn't care.
what exactly is your argument again.

Exactly what I said. That the NCAA prohibition on athletes being paid needs to be lifted. If we lift it and market forces decide that athletes don't get any money, terrific I couldn't care less.

when added up a college football player gets about 100-120k+ depending on the school to play football.

Bull****. The average full ride football scholarship is much less than that per year. Incredibly few schools cost anywhere near $120k per year for tuition, fees, room and board. That's more than most schools cost for four years. That's an extreme case.

Sure tell a kid that has no money that he owes 60k plus a year in taxes for playing a sport.:roll:

Why would he be taxed at 50-60%? And even if he were, getting your education half off is a fantastic deal that the vast majority of students would kill for.

That pretty much sums up your argument.

Only to someone who doesn't understand my argument at all.

 

[the_recruit]

Re: NLRB rules NW University footballers can unionize

Let's play a game. How many college athletic departments currently operate in the black without paying athletes?

You can answer that without pulling down your pants.

I'll pose the same question to you. So what? I guess those schools wouldn't be offering very large compensation packages for the top athletes? Or, who knows, maybe they would in an investment effort to raise their program into the profitable elite? Either way, so what?

 

[Threegoofs]

not if they are considered income. also if they get a stipend that is taxable as well.
i think will take the IRS over you saying my opinion is wrong.

plus i already posted a link that deals with this very subject which you ignored of course.

here is another article for you.

The new pay-for-play: CFB union could get slammed with tax bill

Hannon cited Sec. 117 of the “Current Internal Revenue Code,” which essentially states that though a “qualified scholarship” is not considered gross income, that can change if the scholarship money “represents payment for teaching, research or other services by the student required as a condition for receiving the qualified scholarship or qualified tuition reduction.”

so please tell me how a RB position relates to a computer science degree or something other than physical education?

Well, if that sticks, it will kill college athletics.

Awesome!

 

[azgreg]

Re: NLRB rules NW University footballers can unionize

last number i checked was 23-30 or so.

I'll pose the same question to you. So what? I guess those schools wouldn't be offering very large compensation packages for the top athletes? Or, who knows, maybe they would in an investment effort to raise their program into the profitable elite? Either way, so what?

My point is if you start paying athletes more than they are already being paid it has the possibility of bankrupting many colleges. I look at it this way. College athletes already receive compensation. They are asked to come to their school and perform on their sports teams. In return they get an education, room, and books. If they don't think that's enough, don't go to school.

 

[the_recruit]

Re: NLRB rules NW University footballers can unionize

My point is if you start paying athletes more than they are already being paid it has the possibility of bankrupting many colleges.

How would it bankrupt a college? If a college can't afford to pay the nation's best QB prospect what Notre Dame is willing to pay him, then the college simply isn't going to get the nation's best QB prospect. :shrug: Instead, they'll do what they always do and offer a scholarship to some lesser talent who's not seeing 5-star offers from Michigan and USC and Bama.

If a college starts spending more money then it brings in, that's just bad financial decision making - it doesn't have anything to with an NCAA rule.

I look at it this way. College athletes already receive compensation. They are asked to come to their school and perform on their sports teams. In return they get an education, room, and books. If they don't think that's enough, don't go to school.

Which makes the prohibition even more ridiculous. Ok, you can attract top athletes with this kind of compensation but don't you dare try to attract top athletes with this kind of compensation, we'll kick you out of the NCAA if you do that. It's an archaic rule that may have been useful at one time, but the face of college football has changed.

I think a lot of people view this issue from perspective that NFL-ish money doesn't belong in college sports, college sports should be 'pure'. While I completely appreciate that sentiment, the fact is it's too late. Money is already in college sports and it's been there for decades. Just look around. Millionaire NCAA execs, timeouts for TV, insane coach salaries, the list goes on and on. Prohibiting a tiny percentage of the top college athletes from getting a share of that money isn't protecting the sanctity of college athletics - it's just keeping the money in others' hands.

 

[Crovax]

Re: NLRB rules NW University footballers can unionize

That data's from 2008. Revenues (and profits) have grown substantially since then.

USA Today | Sports | COLLEGE

Profits for 2012:

Texas - $25million

tOSU - $18million

Michigan - $25million

Alabama - $17million

....

Those are just the top 10 or so programs look at schools like West Virginia who was $12 million in the hole last season, Mizzou lost $16 mil, OSU lost $9 mil, Kansas lost $8 mil, UNT lost $7 mil, ASU lost $6 mil, Iowa lost $6 mil, Wash St. lost $5 mil, Utah lost $3 mil. Most schools made a very small profit or none at all.

 

[AJiveMan]

Labor board: Northwestern University football players can unionize - CNN.com



This will change college athletics forever.

If football players get paid, what about the golf team, the women's soccer team, the water polo team, etc? Will those sports be dropped altogether? If athletes strike, do they forfeit their scholarships? Can a team at one school strike on its own? Do athletes at Texas get a piece of the Longhorn Network revenues? Where is this going to go?

Funny, I thought getting an entire college education paid for at a major university was quite a reward to begin with, not to mention the unlimited amount of exposure that could lead to a lucrative pro career for the elite players.

I think this kills college athletics altogether except for football and men's basketball. Problem is, Title IX requires a school to offset the scholarships with women's sports, so it might even kill football and basketball, too at smaller schools.

Yes it will. Had colleges not exploited their players, and had corporations like Nike, etc. not exploited players, none of this would ever have happened.

 

[ludin]

Re: NLRB rules NW University footballers can unionize

Where did I say they "need to be compensated"? Quote me exactly please.

what do you think pay is? pay is compensation. i think you need to take a business class

Exactly what I said. That the NCAA prohibition on athletes being paid needs to be lifted. If we lift it and market forces decide that athletes don't get any money, terrific I couldn't care less.

They already get pay. in the form of free education, free books, free room and board, paid trips, lodging, state of the art weight rooms and trainers.

Bull****. The average full ride football scholarship is much less than that per year. Incredibly few schools cost anywhere near $120k per year for tuition, fees, room and board. That's more than most schools cost for four years. That's an extreme case.

When you add up the cost of 4 years it comes out to 100-120k in benefits that they receive currently tax free.

Why would he be taxed at 50-60%? And even if he were, getting your education half off is a fantastic deal that the vast majority of students would kill for.

Why would they be taxed? because the IRS considers it income that is why they would be taxed.

Only to someone who doesn't understand my argument at all.

Your ranting and conflicting yourself so no one can understand your argument.

 

[ludin]

Re: NLRB rules NW University footballers can unionize

Those are just the top 10 or so programs look at schools like West Virginia who was $12 million in the hole last season, Mizzou lost $16 mil, OSU lost $9 mil, Kansas lost $8 mil, UNT lost $7 mil, ASU lost $6 mil, Iowa lost $6 mil, Wash St. lost $5 mil, Utah lost $3 mil. Most schools made a very small profit or none at all.

yeah but WVU is still trying to fill in the major gap when they left the former BE. their finanical situation is getting a lot better now and by next year they will be operating in the black.

 

[j-mac]

Re: NLRB rules NW University footballers can unionize

College football's draw, at least in part is due to the fact of its amateur status. The game now is played with heart, something that pro football is losing....Add pay to that and you ruin it....Thanks libs...can't have anything can we?

 

[Threegoofs]

Re: NLRB rules NW University footballers can unionize

College football's draw, at least in part is due to the fact of its amateur status. The game now is played with heart, something that pro football is losing....Add pay to that and you ruin it....Thanks libs...can't have anything can we?

Slavery's draw is we get to have these people doing important stuff and they get free room and board for life!

Add pay to that and you ruin it.....thanks libs...can't have anything can we?

 

[ChrisL]

Labor board: Northwestern University football players can unionize - CNN.com



This will change college athletics forever.

If football players get paid, what about the golf team, the women's soccer team, the water polo team, etc? Will those sports be dropped altogether? If athletes strike, do they forfeit their scholarships? Can a team at one school strike on its own? Do athletes at Texas get a piece of the Longhorn Network revenues? Where is this going to go?

Funny, I thought getting an entire college education paid for at a major university was quite a reward to begin with, not to mention the unlimited amount of exposure that could lead to a lucrative pro career for the elite players.

I think this kills college athletics altogether except for football and men's basketball. Problem is, Title IX requires a school to offset the scholarships with women's sports, so it might even kill football and basketball, too at smaller schools.

I think it's ridiculous. They aren't paid employees. It doesn't make any sense to me at all. Does this mean no more scholarships? What exactly do they hope to accomplish with unionizing I wonder? It's not like they get benefits or wages. It's all quite confusing IMO.