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Thread: Labor board: Northwestern University football players can unionize

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    Re: Labor board: Northwestern University football players can unionize

    Quote Originally Posted by ludin View Post
    which means you don't understand what we are talking about.

    1. Currently all college athletes are considered students. therefore any scholarship they receive is for their education which is non-taxable under IRS guidelines.
    2. If they are considered employee's then (athletes) any compensation they receive is considered income by the IRS. this includes scholarships, room and board, food, travel, training, weight room etc ...

    3. if they want to avoid those taxes then the school will have to start charging them for the use of the facilities.
    athletics departments are considered non-profits as well. as any money generated goes back to the school.

    the average student athlete earns 100-120k+ in compensation depending on the school.

    what you will see happen is college stop offering scholarships to kids. that means a very large drop in the number of kids more so kids that
    never would get into college to begin with an opportunity to better themselves.

    so please tell me what jr is going to do when for the first year in college football he gets a W2 for 60k and has no money to pay the tax?
    He doesn't, because it will never happen. If it ends up being tax deductible (and I doubt that it will - if I recall, I was on a tuition waiver while I worked at the University hospital as a student and never paid taxes on it and I was certainly an employee) then the college will just have to gross-up their salaries to cover it, because the value of the scholarship will drop by whatever percentage it is taxed on. It will cost the Universities more money, of course.

    And facilities would certainly NOT be taxable. A gym is required for athletes to do their job. Thats what they do. To charge them for gym time would be as silly as saying their travel is taxable, or the coaches salary because they teach them, or the stadium is because they play in it.
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  2. #132
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    Re: Labor board: Northwestern University football players can unionize

    Quote Originally Posted by Threegoofs View Post
    Classic.

    This sums up a big chunk of postings from DP Conservatives.

    The nugget being:

    "I don't understand it, so it must be bad/wrong".
    No, you apparently don't understand it.

    With the O'Bannon case pending, as well as the coming concussion lawsuits, this ruling will basically make college sports too rich for the blood of the vast majorities of universities.

    This ultimately leads to open compensation, which will turn college athletics into a legal bidding war for players far beyond the corruption that occurs in the shadows now. Through sponsorships and other means, a booster will have an unlimited means of providing compensation to highly recruited athletes that is far beyond what the average player in the NFL makes.

    That will create a huge disparity between schools, between sports, and even between players on the same team. Most schools will opt to dissolve their athletics department altogether, especially when the Title IX advocates start squealing for equal pay and treatment for women's athletes.

    The only way to stave this off is to double tuition and fees for everybody else. How's that sound?

    I think this will result in an AAU-like minor league system (which is beyond corrupt), and college sports will become a game for private industry. In other words, purely professional only.

    This will trickle into the high schools, and amateur sports will be truly dead.

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    Re: Labor board: Northwestern University football players can unionize

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    I think it's ridiculous. They aren't paid employees. It doesn't make any sense to me at all. Does this mean no more scholarships? What exactly do they hope to accomplish with unionizing I wonder? It's not like they get benefits or wages. It's all quite confusing IMO.
    you are correct they are not employee's numerous court rulings have upheld this and the labor board has ignored it. that is typical pro union for you. when this gets into the court system it will get struck down like i has before.

    as for scholarships that is correct. colleges could simply not offer scholarships. if you want to play football for a college then you will be a real student athlete. you will have to pay your own tuition and all the other expenses that come with it. you will not be giving anything in return for playing.

    i don't know what they hope for i guess they feel like getting a huge tax bill at the end of every year for all the compensation they received.

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    Re: Labor board: Northwestern University football players can unionize

    Quote Originally Posted by Erod View Post
    No, you apparently don't understand it.

    With the O'Bannon case pending, as well as the coming concussion lawsuits, this ruling will basically make college sports too rich for the blood of the vast majorities of universities.

    This ultimately leads to open compensation, which will turn college athletics into a legal bidding war for players far beyond the corruption that occurs in the shadows now. Through sponsorships and other means, a booster will have an unlimited means of providing compensation to highly recruited athletes that is far beyond what the average player in the NFL makes.

    That will create a huge disparity between schools, between sports, and even between players on the same team. Most schools will opt to dissolve their athletics department altogether, especially when the Title IX advocates start squealing for equal pay and treatment for women's athletes.

    The only way to stave this off is to double tuition and fees for everybody else. How's that sound?

    I think this will result in an AAU-like minor league system (which is beyond corrupt), and college sports will become a game for private industry. In other words, purely professional only.

    This will trickle into the high schools, and amateur sports will be truly dead.
    Quote Originally Posted by ludin View Post
    you are correct they are not employee's numerous court rulings have upheld this and the labor board has ignored it. that is typical pro union for you. when this gets into the court system it will get struck down like i has before.

    as for scholarships that is correct. colleges could simply not offer scholarships. if you want to play football for a college then you will be a real student athlete. you will have to pay your own tuition and all the other expenses that come with it. you will not be giving anything in return for playing.

    i don't know what they hope for i guess they feel like getting a huge tax bill at the end of every year for all the compensation they received.
    I'm worried. If this sticks, I think it's going to totally ruin college sports. I always thought that it would be an HONOR to compete at the college level on a scholarship because that means you are an amazing athlete and more is expected from you than your typical student. I don't know, I guess these college kids are NOT grateful.

  5. #135
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    Re: Labor board: Northwestern University football players can unionize

    Quote Originally Posted by Erod View Post
    No, you apparently don't understand it.

    With the O'Bannon case pending, as well as the coming concussion lawsuits, this ruling will basically make college sports too rich for the blood of the vast majorities of universities.

    This ultimately leads to open compensation, which will turn college athletics into a legal bidding war for players far beyond the corruption that occurs in the shadows now. Through sponsorships and other means, a booster will have an unlimited means of providing compensation to highly recruited athletes that is far beyond what the average player in the NFL makes.

    That will create a huge disparity between schools, between sports, and even between players on the same team. Most schools will opt to dissolve their athletics department altogether, especially when the Title IX advocates start squealing for equal pay and treatment for women's athletes.

    The only way to stave this off is to double tuition and fees for everybody else. How's that sound?

    I think this will result in an AAU-like minor league system (which is beyond corrupt), and college sports will become a game for private industry. In other words, purely professional only.

    This will trickle into the high schools, and amateur sports will be truly dead.
    We can only hope.

    Amateur sports will not be dead. They will go on in club sports, which is exactly where they should be. If you hold an event and rake in millions, but dont pay the players, its only amateur in the sense that you got suckers to play for you for nothing and keep the gate revenue for yourself.
    Many Trump supporters have lots of problems, and those deplorables are bringing those problems to us. They’re racists. They’re misogynists. They’re islamophobic. They're xenophobes and homophobes. And some, I assume, are good people.

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    Re: Labor board: Northwestern University football players can unionize

    Quote Originally Posted by Threegoofs View Post
    He doesn't, because it will never happen. If it ends up being tax deductible (and I doubt that it will - if I recall, I was on a tuition waiver while I worked at the University hospital as a student and never paid taxes on it and I was certainly an employee) then the college will just have to gross-up their salaries to cover it, because the value of the scholarship will drop by whatever percentage it is taxed on. It will cost the Universities more money, of course.

    And facilities would certainly NOT be taxable. A gym is required for athletes to do their job. Thats what they do. To charge them for gym time would be as silly as saying their travel is taxable, or the coaches salary because they teach them, or the stadium is because they play in it.
    i posted you 2 links showing the IRS code and you have ignored them. why is that? do you not wish to educate yourself on the subject or is just because it disagrees with your point of view and you don't like it?

    right because you were a student on tuition waiver. that is not taxable. however IF YOU ARE AN EMPLOYEE then it is very much taxable as it is considered income.
    It also had to do with your field of study and therefore was exempt

    yes facilities is income as a 1st class gym membership can cost 50 dollars a month easy. that is income that is taxable.
    their travel could be considered income as well it depends on how the IRS views it.

    trainers provided are considered compensation and therefore is a taxable item.
    you obviously don't understand what taxable compensation is.

    please go back and read the articles i posted that explain this to you. if you refuse then i know that you are not interested in any type of intelligent discussion. you can have your opinion and it will just be wrong.

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    Re: Labor board: Northwestern University football players can unionize

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    I'm worried. If this sticks, I think it's going to totally ruin college sports. I always thought that it would be an HONOR to compete at the college level on a scholarship because that means you are an amazing athlete and more is expected from you than your typical student. I don't know, I guess these college kids are NOT grateful.
    no they aren't. they don't feel that getting a free college education and a chance to make it to the pro's to earn millions is enough.
    of course the court system has yet to rule and i figure they will overturn the labor board ruling like they have for the past 30 years.

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    Re: Labor board: Northwestern University football players can unionize

    Quote Originally Posted by Threegoofs View Post
    We can only hope.

    Amateur sports will not be dead. They will go on in club sports, which is exactly where they should be. If you hold an event and rake in millions, but dont pay the players, its only amateur in the sense that you got suckers to play for you for nothing and keep the gate revenue for yourself.
    glad to see that you support kids not going to college. very considerate of you.

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    Re: Labor board: Northwestern University football players can unionize

    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    I don't know: I think colleges have taken extreme advantage of football players without giving them much else save for a scholarship. They put them through the ringer, exhaust them, injure them, celebritize them, center the entire school and all else around them and their sacrifice and success.

    They uplift college football too much. It needs to be bumped down a notch or two.

    Now whether unionizing will be the appropriate path for this, I'm not sure.
    Agreed and well said. I think that this will simply be a tool in the athletes ability to get their just due. It is well overdue and college athletes should be paid as if it were a part time job.

    And lets face it - this is NOT about students getting an education as a goodly number of those same athletes would never be able to get into those same universities on pure academic merit.
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    Re: Labor board: Northwestern University football players can unionize

    Quote Originally Posted by ludin View Post
    no they aren't. they don't feel that getting a free college education and a chance to make it to the pro's to earn millions is enough.
    of course the court system has yet to rule and i figure they will overturn the labor board ruling like they have for the past 30 years.
    Well believe it or not, I am PRO union for some industries, such as the construction industry. Public sector unions? Not so much, and now I just don't even KNOW what to make of this. I've never heard of such a thing. I just don't see how this is going to effect college sports in a positive way.

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