U.S., other powers kick Russia out of G8

EnigmaO01 said:

I'm aware of the space station runs. I was referring to our satelites.

What are you talking about Obama's hands in the cookie jar? Putin stole the damn cookies! LOL

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$5 billion worth of meddling resulted in the leadership that the great Soothsayer and clairvoyant, or agent provaceteur, Victoria Nuland, negotiated with weeks in advance of the manifestation of the event. If you really believe that the USA is innocent in this matter, you be livin' in the nether withers.

DaveFagan said:

$5 billion worth of meddling resulted in the leadership that the great Soothsayer and clairvoyant, or agent provaceteur, Victoria Nuland, negotiated with weeks in advance of the manifestation of the event. If you really believe that the USA is innocent in this matter, you be livin' in the nether withers.

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Sorry I don't believe everything I read especially by biased sources.

EnigmaO01 said:

Ah the ol' everybody's a crook argument. With all it's faults I'll take the U.S. over Russia anyday and some of the other sheetholes out there. And trust me I've been outside of the states.

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I'd take the US over russia too.

At least they're my crooks.

apdst said:

Putin is laughing all the way to the bank. This isn't going to coerce him into backing down.

He's already seen that all he has to do, is rattle his saber and the First World countries will back down.

If these sanctions start to sting, he'll start a brew-ha-ha somewhere and to stop it, Obama and the rest of his posse will lift a few of the sanctions.

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I think you're right. And Russia was only 'suspended' from the G-8, not 'kicked out'.

Spaceman_Spiff said:

Except that in this situation this is nothing more than Russia exploiting political instability in Ukraine and grabbing whatever they can, in this case Crimea. As far as I know there was a specific procedure the Ukrainian parliament needed to follow if a province wished to secede from the country; to say the least it was not followed. Even then the proper way to through the process is not with an occupying military literally surrounding the voting parliament, but in an open and transparent manner.

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And there was a proper procedure to remove a President in Ukraine and that wasn't followed so proper procedure be damned.

Spaceman_Spiff said:

Also, diplomacy would have done very little. Russia has shown little concern for any sort of transparency and would have vetoed any resolution that would have sent UN observers to oversee the whole process since it would have meant the vote would not have gone Russia's way, something they would not have chanced. Instead, they cracked down on all media into Crimea and used the threat of force to compel the Crimean parliament to vote for an illegal secession and annexation.

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This is absolutely false. Russia allowed 3rd party observers to observe the annexation vote in Crimea. In fact 135 international observers from 23 countries and none saw violations.

Spaceman_Spiff said:

The protests were a response to President Yanucovych backing away from a deal that would have further integrated Ukraine with the rest of Europe and away from Russia. The United States may have had something to do with them, but I have no reason to believe the protests were anything more than a populist revolt against seeing their country sink further into a kleptocracy.

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He backed away from a deal that would have cut Ukraine off at the knees over the short term. EU's deal was one that required IMF funding, thus IMF bean counters who would nix any kind of spending like they did in Greece, Ireland and Portugal. Whatever your economic view of Keynesianism is.. any time a country allows a 3rd party run their budget, it gets rid of all sovereign ability. Ukraine would have also joined the EU market which means Ukrainian companies would have to compete with EU companies. Gas prices in Ukraine would have to rise to meet market prices according to EU competition laws which would have harmed the average Ukrainian because they get their gas (fuel) at cost that Ukrainian companies buy Russian oil (subsidy). Russia offered Ukraine money to end their budget problems and 33% profit gain on exporting energy to EU.

Ukraine needed two plans.. 1) in the short term, 1-3 years needed the Russian deal. 2) EU's deal which is something you sign 3-5 years down the road when your house is in order. If you skip step one you end up like Greece. Populist protesters are too stupid to realize this and on top of that they were only following order from Opposition parties who are in line to take control in May. They are hardliners and not pragmatic. They rather see Ukraine suffer then have any dealing with Russia. Then those protesters are gonna realize pretty quickly they got screwed.

Spaceman_Spiff said:

The best thing the United States can do is continue, if not further increase, with sanctions. So far the Russian stock exchange has seen a large decline, as has the ruble, and their economic outlook was downgraded to show expectations of no growth for 2014. Pushing further sanctions may push them into recession, and then steps to aid both the Ukrainian government and military could further dissuade Russia from taking anything beyond Crimea.

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You are living in fantasy land. Stock Exchanges mean jack. And a Ruble decline is whatever, Russia can export more. Sanctions aren't gonna do a thing. Russia has India and China in it's back pocket. Two countries who aren't living day to day unlike EU who is flat broke. Russia cuts off Oil and Gas to Ukraine and you can kiss Ukrainian economy gone and EU pouring money into Ukraine to keep it afloat. While Russia sends the oil and gas to China who'll suck it up.

EnigmaO01 said:

We use Russian rockets to send our satellites up? That's new one to me.

Don't look now but your contempt for Obama is showing like it does in every post.

This winter has been a cold one don't you think so? That's got to be Obama's fault right?

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Re: Russian rockets launching American satellites, when I first heard of it I also raised my eyebrows. But my source works at JPL and I figured he was in better position to know than I. Considering when Obama the community organizer became POTUS he put a unqualified person in charge of NASA who basically said NASA's new mission is no longer space but making Muslims feel good about themselves.

The American Atlas V rockets uses Russian engines going back to the Clinton administration.
US reviews use of Russian rockets for satellite launches - Telegraph

Russia

U.S. Spy Satellites Riding Russian Rockets into Space - The Daily Beast


Obama says Muslims are more important than having a space shuttle and will rely on Russia instead.
Payin

Obama’s “Muslim Self-Esteem” NASA in Complete Disarray

>" Obama gave Charles Bolden, his idiot appointee, a prime directive that NASA would now focus primarily on making Muslims feel good about themselves. That worked out about as well as you would expect..."<
Obama’s “Muslim Self-Esteem” NASA in Complete Disarray | FrontPage Magazine

"It's G.W. Bush's fault." So who are you going to call ? A community organizer. :lamo

APACHERAT said:

Re: Russian rockets launching American satellites, when I first heard of it I also raised my eyebrows. But my source works at JPL and I figured he was in better position to know than I. Considering when Obama the community organizer became POTUS he put a unqualified person in charge of NASA who basically said NASA's new mission is no longer space but making Muslims feel good about themselves.

The American Atlas V rockets uses Russian engines going back to the Clinton administration.
US reviews use of Russian rockets for satellite launches - Telegraph

Russia

U.S. Spy Satellites Riding Russian Rockets into Space - The Daily Beast


Obama says Muslims are more important than having a space shuttle and will rely on Russia instead.
Payin

Obama’s “Muslim Self-Esteem” NASA in Complete Disarray



>" Obama gave Charles Bolden, his idiot appointee, a prime directive that NASA would now focus primarily on making Muslims feel good about themselves. That worked out about as well as you would expect..."<
Obama’s “Muslim Self-Esteem” NASA in Complete Disarray | FrontPage Magazine

"It's G.W. Bush's fault." So who are you going to call ? A community organizer. :lamo

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I was ready to eat humble pie and say I stand corrected until you started one of your ODS rants again. Then you lost credibility.

EnigmaO01 said:

I was ready to eat humble pie and say I stand corrected until you started one of your ODS rants again. Then you lost credibility.

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If you want, you can go to "Popeys" and eat chicken.

I'm going to eat an "In n Out" Double Double.

Some people are just too insane you just learn to ignore them