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Thread: Judge strikes down Michigan's ban on gay marriage[W:95]

  1. #511
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    re: Judge strikes down Michigan's ban on gay marriage[W:95]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaugingcatenate View Post
    That is simply an absurd and pretty naive interpretation of the Constitution. The Constitution is a framework for governing.

    While I appreciate your efforts, why don't you give me a list of the protected classes and where exactly those protected classes are listed as protected (specifically) in the Constitution.
    The Constitution does not list a lot of things that we still have rights to.

    You have no clue on constitutional law and how our laws work at all. That is obvious by your comments. I have actual law experts who can back up my assertions about the laws. Until you can show me where being a person who owes child support (Zablocki v Redhail) is a protected class (specifically mentioned in the Constitution), then you fail.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  2. #512
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    re: Judge strikes down Michigan's ban on gay marriage[W:95]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaugingcatenate View Post
    Similarly, same sex marriage does not legitimately affect you either. Their not having it also does not affect you.

    What would be the legitimate state interest in not allowing a 40 year old to marry a 7 year old? Besides your prejudices regarding age, what would be the legitimate state interest? If I wanted to marry a tree, what would be the legitimate state interest in not allowing that? What if I wanted to marry an adult chicken, or a rooster for that matter, what would be the legitimate state interest there? I can marry a woman, you want to allow me to marry a man, why cannot I marry a horse? Why not all three? What is the legitimate state interest? Matter of fact, I want to marry 73 other people all at the same time, two of them my siblings, one my parent, what would be the legitimate state interest in stopping me?
    It affects others. And it could potentially affect me in the future. You have no right to tell me that I cannot marry a woman just because you don't want me to marry a woman.

    The rest of those things you mention I've already addressed. They must fight their own battles. I invite them to. They will still come down to the state's interest. That would be an argument for the state to make and they've been making it quite well. Can a 7 year old legally sign a contract? Can a horse legally sign a contract? The others are more complicated but still have state interests that the state is able to articulate when challenged (whether the courts view those interests as good enough is for a future challenge). Still has nothing to do with the fact that there is no legitimate state interest in not allowing a woman to marry a woman or a man to marry another man.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  3. #513
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    re: Judge strikes down Michigan's ban on gay marriage[W:95]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaugingcatenate View Post
    Oh, I understand what you are saying, but you see, as a society we, many of us, don't want that kind of nothing matters above anything else sort of world. Some things aren't equal, are not meant to be equal, some things just should not be. Maybe we, as a nation, will at some point agree to allow this outrage, but not while we have the strength to support a strong nation.

    Not while I can help it.
    The law doesn't care about your beliefs or how society feels about certain things unless you are able to get enough people to deny them constitutionally unequal protection. Until that time, the 14th Amendment and the Equal Protection of everyone enshrined within stands.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

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    re: Judge strikes down Michigan's ban on gay marriage[W:95]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaugingcatenate View Post
    Yeah, that is just flat-assed silly. That is why a court system with precedent eventually must break down, it no longer stands for anything but the sublimely bizarre, a template for the circus you folks are turning this country into.

    One could laugh if it weren't so sad. And you think you are doing good, what an irony.
    Complain all you want, that is how our SCOTUS works.

    Levels of Scrutiny Under the Equal Protection Clause

    Levels of Scrutiny Under the Three-Tiered Approach to Equal Protection Analysis
    1. STRICT SCRUTINY (The government must show that the challenged classification serves a compelling state interest and that the classification is necessary to serve that interest.):
    A. Suspect Classifications:
    1. Race
    2. National Origin
    3. Religion (either under EP or Establishment Clause analysis)
    4. Alienage (unless the classification falls within a recognized "political community" exception, in which case only rational basis scrutiny will be applied).
    B. Classifications Burdening Fundamental Rights
    1. Denial or Dilution of the Vote
    2. Interstate Migration
    3. Access to the Courts
    4. Other Rights Recognized as Fundamental
    2. MIDDLE-TIER SCRUTINY (The government must show that the challenged classification serves an important state interest and that the classification is at least substantially related to serving that interest.):
    Quasi-Suspect Classifications:
    1. Gender
    2. Illegitimacy
    3. MINIMUM (OR RATIONAL BASIS) SCRUTINY (The govenment need only show that the challenged classification is rationally related to serving a legitimate state interest.)
    Minimum scrutiny applies to all classifications other than those listed above, although some Supreme Court cases suggest a slightly closer scrutiny ("a second-order rational basis test") involving some weighing of the state's interest may be applied in cases, for example, involving classifications that disadvantage mentally retarded people, homosexuals, or innocent children of illegal aliens. (See "Should the Rational Basis Test Have Bite?")
    History of Equal Protection and the Levels of Review

    Breakdown in the levels of scrutiny. - Free Online Library

    You don't like the way our legal system and constitutional review works, tough. Attempt to change it. I doubt that will go far because most people either don't care or like it the way it is because it protects all of us.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

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    re: Judge strikes down Michigan's ban on gay marriage[W:95]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaugingcatenate View Post
    How about we give it the time for many of them to actually get older before we pronounce, eh? Good lord.
    We have. Or do you really believe that this issue just started in the last decade? This issue has existed for quite some time.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

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    re: Judge strikes down Michigan's ban on gay marriage[W:95]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaugingcatenate View Post
    Or...

    The decision just may, as it should, go the other way, remove all doubt and allow all good people to maintain those stable, traditional institutions handed down to us which have allowed us to reap the abundant bounty which surrounds us all, even those lowly termites who work to destroy it.
    Yeah nothing screams "stable, traditional" like my uncle's 5th marriage or Britney's 24hr "just for fun" marriage

    You heteros have already done everything possible to ruin marriage on your own. Blaming the gays only makes ya'll seem like abusive neglectful husbands....which undoubtedly many complaining the loudest are.

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    re: Judge strikes down Michigan's ban on gay marriage[W:95]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaugingcatenate View Post
    So wrong, wow, lol...

    And truly, if you don't like my posts [yet you seem addicted ] just ignore them, most assuredly will not hurt my feelings...but to be so asinine as to attempt to tell me what I should do, well, shows a level of maturity that is probably a bit less than sufficient, would you not agree? If its getting to you that much that you cannot win, that you are just not that convincing, or persuasive, give it a rest.

    I certainly understand you have the harder task, an uphill battle, being on the wrong side of the issue and having to defend it.
    LMAO!! You really think we are on the wrong side of this issue? Remove the blinders.

    Polling Tracks Growing and Increasingly Diverse Support for the Freedom to Marry | Freedom to Marry

    Gay Marriage | Pew Research Center

    "The public has gradually become more supportive of granting legal recognition to same-sex marriages over the past 15 years, with support increasing more steeply in recent years. Currently, 50% favor same-sex marriage, while 43% oppose."

    And that is from last year. It has only increased since then. Our side won the last 4 votes (by the people) on this issue.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  8. #518
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    re: Judge strikes down Michigan's ban on gay marriage[W:95]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaugingcatenate View Post
    Actual states allowance for this travesty is a rather recent occurence... or hadn't you noticed. It was BJ Clinton, democrat and liberal, that signed both DADT and DOMA, correct? What was the boob's position [ I know, I know, that could be either Barack or Joe ] on SSM in 2008...2009...2010...ummm 2011?
    Doesn't matter when people started waking up to this issue and started supporting it in major numbers. What matters is that the trend clearly shows that as soon as people realized the issue itself and realized that others are being treated unfairly under the law for nothing more than personal beliefs about homosexuality, they started realizing the laws are wrong. Many still in fact believe personally that being homosexual or having same sex relationships is a sin, but they also feel that their beliefs have no place in our laws.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  9. #519
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    re: Judge strikes down Michigan's ban on gay marriage[W:95]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaugingcatenate View Post
    See, the idea of legitimate state interest is NOT the 14th Amendment... the idea of legitimate state interest was a kind of clever artifice, just a rather blunt tool, an instrument created/utilized to resolve specific issues. Like a certain sized wrench, it doesn't fit all repairs. Like a gun, it can be used for good and it can be used for bad. Being that we cannot stop it from existing, we do need to stop the folks who would use it for ill conceived purposes as best we can.
    What you view as an "ill conceived purpose" is the problem. You are trying to justify your personal dislike by denying that reasonable considerations should matter when it comes to our laws and equal protection.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

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    re: Judge strikes down Michigan's ban on gay marriage[W:95]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaugingcatenate View Post
    See, the idea of legitimate state interest is NOT the 14th Amendment... the idea of legitimate state interest was a kind of clever artifice, just a rather blunt tool, an instrument created/utilized to resolve specific issues. Like a certain sized wrench, it doesn't fit all repairs. Like a gun, it can be used for good and it can be used for bad. Being that we cannot stop it from existing, we do need to stop the folks who would use it for ill conceived purposes as best we can.
    It is the requirement for the lowest tier of scrutiny. It is asking simply whether or not there is a rational basis for infringing on a Constitutional right.

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