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Thread: Judge strikes down Michigan's ban on gay marriage[W:95]

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    Re: Judge strikes down Michigan's ban on gay marriage[W:95]

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    What a foolish post.
    If you say so j. Got anything real to discuss?

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    Re: Judge strikes down Michigan's ban on gay marriage[W:95]

    Some are desperately holding on the belief that their way of thinking on SSM is still the majority opinion in America. Almost every Supreme Court ruling has a dissenting opinion[s]. Some, as of yet, have not come to the realization that their opinion will forever be the dissenting opinion on SSM.


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    Re: Judge strikes down Michigan's ban on gay marriage[W:95]

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    US Recognizes Michigan Same-Sex Couple Marriages - ABC News





    I don't know what Limbo is, but I'm guessing if you're one of the 300 couples that got married it looks a lot like this.
    It also appears in some ways like the fed laying the smackdown on state politicians. The michigan AG and gov are just weak useless bitches whose wishes are of no consequence. If they were, "death to tyrants," or however that goes.

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    Re: Judge strikes down Michigan's ban on gay marriage[W:95]

    Quote Originally Posted by prometeus View Post
    If that is the best you can do you are scraping the bottom of the barrel...
    Just responding in kind to the silliness that was expressed... that's fair game.

    So, you think Hamilton wrong in his sales job/assessment that if the people find that the government oversteps its bounds that the people may then take proper remedy... do you agree we are the masters and the government our servant...or do you think we are just slaves to government?
    "...But resist we much, we must and we will much, about that be committed..." --- the right Reverend Alfred Charles "Al" Shaprton, Jr.

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    Re: Judge strikes down Michigan's ban on gay marriage[W:95]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaugingcatenate View Post
    Just responding in kind to the silliness that was expressed... that's fair game.

    So, you think Hamilton wrong in his sales job/assessment that if the people find that the government oversteps its bounds that the people may then take proper remedy... do you agree we are the masters and the government our servant...or do you think we are just slaves to government?
    the federal government isnt overstepping, this is why all your posts fail and get destroyed by multiple posters

    whats going on is the state is overstepping its bounds and the fed is fixing it

    your post fails again
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    Re: Judge strikes down Michigan's ban on gay marriage[W:95]

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    IF the majority did not approve of the way our courts do business when it comes to constitutional law, including judicial review and/or scrutiny in relation to the 14th Amendment, then they are free to change that through Amendment. Until that point, then the people either don't care enough or agree with how it is done.

    We don't treat everyone the same, and that is the point. In how you are trying to use the 14th, without states being able to justify treating 16 year olds different than 18 year olds, then they would have to be treated the same. Why aren't they? Why are states allowed to treat 17/15/16 year olds differently than 18 year olds? Please enlighten us all because it is obvious that they are allowed to do so.

    Your claim is that it is the will of the majority that allows this, but that is not true. It is because the will of the majority in this mattered is justified by furthering a legitimate state interest in establishing an "age of majority". The will of the majority would be invalid if it tried for treating different ages differently, such as saying that a 36 year old could not get married but anyone 18-35 and 37 and older could.
    Your wording is somewhat ambiguous, so I cannot really tell if you are recognizing that different states DO get to treat 16/17/18 year olds differently by state. For instance, in the area of legal sexual consent, the states are all over the place on the issue with many allowing it at 16, many at 17 with about 2/3s having it at age 18 and above...so what is the difference... and if you move from a state that allows for consent at 16 to as state that only allows 18+, would your mental abilities to judge circumstances just automatically diminish by simply crossing the state line?

    Alcohol consumption is generally 21, but South Carolina allows the possession and consumption of alcohol by adults 18 to 20 years of age... so this is not uniform across the nation, nor should it be.

    Local and state communities indeed should be able to determine what is allowable and what is not in their state and their communities... that has been one of the geniuses of our system of Federalism, power sharing/division between state and national government.

    The Federal government has simply and obviously overstepped its proper boundaries, based on the promises upon which our framework for governing, our Constitution, was sold to the states. Further, upon which these states voluntarily gave up their independence, and only a portion of their sovereignty, based on this Constitutionally established system of power sharing/power division with the Federal government limited to only the enumerated and with minimal necessary additional powers to carry these out these specific powers, curbed with extremely reasonable limitations as to how far they could go [ as there was a lot of prescient doubt that the Federal government would stay within its agreed bounds ]... and so, as predicted, the Feds have gone too far.

    The 14th, while necessary, well meaning and attempting to help a nation heal/adjust from a major war within itself, was surely never meant for what it is now being warped to intend. The 14th needs a whole lot of scrutiny, fine-tuning/correction as to meaning... certainly limits in place so it does not get to the outrageously absurd.

    The current situation is a prime example.
    "...But resist we much, we must and we will much, about that be committed..." --- the right Reverend Alfred Charles "Al" Shaprton, Jr.

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    Re: Judge strikes down Michigan's ban on gay marriage[W:95]

    Quote Originally Posted by WorldWatcher View Post
    Now you are moving the goal posts, your original statement was "Nobody here, despite the alleged invalidity of our side's arguments, has been able to prove your side's point". As I pointed out, the reply wasn't in regard to "Nobody here" as it is unlikely that anyone here will change your individual opinion. However the case has been proven to dozens of judges (when you count state, state appeals/supreme courts [including en blanc reviews), federal district courts, and federal appeals court]).



    I'm sorry, but you appear to flatter yourself on what "the rest of use think". The fact is that the last time such proposals were placed before the voting public in General Election initiatives, Marriage Equality won each time. In addition polls have shown a consistent trend to more acceptance of SSCM over the last decade.

    Face it, you don't speak for "the rest of us" or even the majority. Your claim to being a majority is based on actions taken a decade ago.



    We the people are consenting, it's now the minority opinion that capricious and invidious laws targeting homosexuals are just.



    >>>>
    Again, stack it up against those states disagreeing... and proving your point does not mean that just because a couple of dozen judges throughout the entire nation go along with this silliness and the legal jujitsu performed means the point was proven. There are all sorts of reasons so few judges may have gone along with this distorted view.

    Relish your victories wherever you may find them, surely. But in the totality of the situation, assuredly got a long way to go... and, as with the ERA, time often is not a friend. I think with current liberals in our government taking a sledge hammer to our healthcare system, our president proving he has little idea of how to govern, only the ability to make on prompter platitudes which nobody any longer believes... with no coattails as the boob isn't running again, democrats have little to run on... and the results might be pretty devastating this next election. With the house and senate, perhaps the presidency the next election cycle...perhaps we could get this silliness locked down for good. Certainly need such. And...

    We have much better things to be concentrating on than this kind of wasted effort and misguided silliness for a small population that should be satisfied with the tolerance already extended.

    As regards being or not being the majority, you have no real evidence to support that. You have only fleeting polls based on who really knows what? I ll believe it when the majority actually decide, one way or the other. Up until that time, we the majority have decided the way it is currently.

    The fact is most of us just want to keep marriage the way we know it works... the invidiousness is what we want to keep out, those undesirable elements in our culture demanding that, which is by definition deviant, to become the new norm.

    How peculiar and unworkable is that?
    "...But resist we much, we must and we will much, about that be committed..." --- the right Reverend Alfred Charles "Al" Shaprton, Jr.

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    Re: Judge strikes down Michigan's ban on gay marriage[W:95]

    Quote Originally Posted by prometeus View Post
    Thanks for the demonstration of ignorance and lack of understanding. History is just an account of events, it can not have fault, be clean or dirty. It can be inaccurately presented or misrepresented, but that is hardly the fault of history.

    No that is more ignorant misrepresentation. Being prevented from being marries is the discrimination.
    Oh my sweet fricken lord... seems there is an equation that has surfaced as a pattern in this thread and with this debate. A diametric inverse of real knowledge/rationality to level of annoyance. The one goes way down, the other goes way up.

    You do know that in most dictionaries there are words that have varying definitions, not just the single one, depending on context? Here is one, apt, from Merriam-Webster online of history: events of the past.

    Events of the past CAN be dirty. Yesterday I cleaned the bathroom sink. The undeniable history of this particular sink proved that it had gotten dirty. Until this very moment this historic event had not been written about... I suppose if I didn't have to go to to such lengths to prove this point, it never would have... it is still history now, whether I had ever written of it or not. Simple example, should be simple enough to assimilate.

    Even, based on your incomplete understanding of the definition, there can be fault, as in knowingly leaving out of pertinent portions or putting in lies... that would, indeed, be dirty and the fault of those writing the history... they would be dirty and so would their account of history. If you believe otherwise, well, we will just have to agree to disagree.

    Way to prove your point on discrimination. I think I might completely abandon my reasoning abilities and agree with you now. Thanks, you have been ever so helpful.
    "...But resist we much, we must and we will much, about that be committed..." --- the right Reverend Alfred Charles "Al" Shaprton, Jr.

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    Re: Judge strikes down Michigan's ban on gay marriage[W:95]

    Quote Originally Posted by prometeus View Post
    There is not need to fabricate or make up lies, although it is not surprising coming from you.
    I made no remark about summary of events. That is just a lie to mask your mistake or inability to comprehend written sentences. An accounting, an accurate one as it was implied, would contain all pertinent aspects.
    Might you give an example representing your view of history, please? Besides being wrong on the definition, also wrong with regard to accounting v summary. It is almost impossible, perhaps it is impossible, to get ALL pertinent aspects. Often times nobody knows ALL, or will ever know, ALL of them...

    And, absolutes are usually best not used as they can almost always be proved wrong. See how I used that almost before the absolute of always?

    You don't have to thank me.
    "...But resist we much, we must and we will much, about that be committed..." --- the right Reverend Alfred Charles "Al" Shaprton, Jr.

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    Re: Judge strikes down Michigan's ban on gay marriage[W:95]

    Quote Originally Posted by prometeus View Post
    Yes you keep saying that and not much else.

    Neither is it won by denial, bigoted statements or irrelevant tripe, fellow citizen.
    I think a simple comparison of what I have written here on the topic compared to...just what have you actually written on the topic? Usually just a rather unreasoned/faulty counter to what I have posted, seems to me.

    So you think the state is our master, that society cannot choose to go the way society wants? You think that the minority's will should win out over the majority's will? You think that SSM is specifically provided protections in the Constitution?
    "...But resist we much, we must and we will much, about that be committed..." --- the right Reverend Alfred Charles "Al" Shaprton, Jr.

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