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Thread: Chicago Man Facing Hate Crime/Murder Charge

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    Re: Chicago Man Facing Hate Crime/Murder Charge

    Increasingly it seems "hate crime" laws are just a way to get round "free speech" for political correctness.

    People angry at each other have been calling people the most insulting names possible. You even see it on this forum. Because ethnic slurs and "hate" slurs are the most insulting, when raging people will tend to use them. I don't believe the slur created the hate or the fight. Rather, fights usually come with hate words, because nearly ALL fights have something to do with hate, although there are exceptions.

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    Re: Chicago Man Facing Hate Crime/Murder Charge

    Has anyone actually read the FEDERAL "hate crimes" law?

    Under it, probably most federal, state and local officials could be prosecuted for hate crimes.

    It also says that anyone acting or threatens to act under the color of law in their employment to deny a citizen any constitutional or statutory right has committed a federal hate crime. It is very broad language. Of course, getting the AG to prosecute? That is another matter.

    However, it is a real door to civil suits.

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    Re: Chicago Man Facing Hate Crime/Murder Charge

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    Increasingly it seems "hate crime" laws are just a way to get round "free speech" for political correctness.

    People angry at each other have been calling people the most insulting names possible. You even see it on this forum. Because ethnic slurs and "hate" slurs are the most insulting, when raging people will tend to use them. I don't believe the slur created the hate or the fight. Rather, fights usually come with hate words, because nearly ALL fights have something to do with hate, although there are exceptions.
    No.
    These laws were enacted to protect people, like you, me, and others.

    I believe the offender threw the first punch. I believe that the hate speech escalated or followed that punch, by the man thinking he could say what he wanted to insult a 15 year old and her father, and get away with it.

    I don't know what world you live in, but nice people just don't go around insulting other people, in this case, there's nothing nice about him, he's a felon who was on probation.

    He'll now be doing time in the big house, maybe some brothers will teach him some manners after he arrives.

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    Re: Chicago Man Facing Hate Crime/Murder Charge

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    Hate crime in the US has nothing to do with whom one hates. It's to do with organized terrorism.


    What's organized about some lone guy getting into a fist fight?

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    Re: Chicago Man Facing Hate Crime/Murder Charge

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    This was a hate crime. Those who disagree should first read the OP article again, watch the video and then read tbe quoted explanation provided by RiverDad on page 6. Once you do that you'll get the basic facts:

    1. Firek was White.
    2. Tingling was Black.
    3. Firek uttered a racial epithet while assaulting Tingling.

    Those are the facts as presented in the linked article in the OP. The fact that Tingling had a weak heart doesn't matter. Firek infected hate into the assault.
    I guess it's alright to attack someone then as long as you don't hate them.

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    Re: Chicago Man Facing Hate Crime/Murder Charge

    Quote Originally Posted by Texmex View Post
    :lamo:lamo :lamo

    What's organized about some lone guy getting into a fist fight?
    Part of proving motive is generally proving that the accused was a member of a known hate group or possessed propaganda from a known hate group that targets the victim.

    This illustrates organized terrorism.

    Also, ambushing someone because of their race/gender is not "getting in a fist fight".

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    Re: Chicago Man Facing Hate Crime/Murder Charge

    Quote Originally Posted by Texmex View Post
    I guess it's alright to attack someone then as long as you don't hate them.
    Come now, Texmex. I didn't say that, but even if I did a person can be attacked and not hate his/her victim. You seem to be drawing such a conclusion based on reports concerning the Knock Out game when there does seem to be elements of racial biasness involved. This was the case concerning the assault in the OP, mind you, where the victim's attacker DID use racial language as he assaulted his victim.

    Let me put it to you this way:

    Let's assume you're White and you get into a fight with a Black man. If all you've done is curse at the guy during the verbal altercation and the ensuing fight as most people would do when they're angry, you don't have a hate crime pursuant to the law. All you have is an assault (or assault and battery, depending on the circumstances). But let's suppose one of you makes a racist comment both before, during and after the fight. Let's say it was the Black guy who called you a "Cracker" and a "Klan-wanna-be" (since there really isn't a White-equivalent to the n-word that carries as much of a stigma). In so doing, the Black guy's words injected racism into the altercation which makes it a hate crime. Why?

    Because he no longer saw you as a person who coincidentally got into an altercation with a perfect stranger (or even a neighbor or coworker for that matter). Because he made such racially bias remarks, it illustrates his distain for you just because you appear different from him in some way.

    Muggers can attack you and not hate you. They're just hoping they can score some cash or get access to your credit cards or maybe snatch a few valuables from you, i.e., a watch, a ring or necklace. What Mr. Firek and many of those who participate in the playing the Knockout Game did was attack based in some measure on their racial bias/hatred. There is a difference.
    Last edited by Objective Voice; 03-22-14 at 10:48 AM.
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    Re: Chicago Man Facing Hate Crime/Murder Charge

    Quote Originally Posted by RiverDad View Post
    Being a victim of a hate crime and not having the prosecutor charge the perp with a hate crime for his hate-crime attack on you is a pretty hollow honor.

    I'm always eager to learn new things. You made a definitive statement that middle-aged, hetero, white males have been victims of hate crimes. This surely indicates that you have actually know this to be true. Would you please link up some evidence in support of your position.
    Brooklyn group of black youths blocks white couple's car, bloody victims in racial attack: cops - NY Daily News

    Ronald Russo, 30, and his wife, Alanna, apparently had the green light and the husband honked at the group to get out of the way. The rowdy kids started kicking the car, according to the criminal complaint. Ronald Russo got out to check on potential damage to his vehicle.

    And thatís when all hell broke loose.

    Ronald Russo was dragged to the ground. Then he was punched and kicked in the head. He felt more blows all over his body, investigators said. He suffered a fractured nose, a broken septum, a blood clot and abrasions to his shoulder. He was treated and released from Beth Israel Medical Center.
    Kirton, 18, of East Flatbush, who has no prior arrests, faces gang assault, harassment and menacing charges, all as hate crimes. He was released on $50,000 bond.
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    Re: Chicago Man Facing Hate Crime/Murder Charge

    Sorry, your example fails....10 days after the article you post here, a follow up...

    Hate crime charges have been dropped against the two black teens who allegedly pummeled a white Brooklyn couple while yelling racial slurs at them, the Daily News has learned.

    Law enforcement sources said a grand jury declined to indict Kashawn Kirton, 18, and Daehrell Finch, 17, both of Brooklyn, on hate crime charges in the Oct. 14 attack on Ronald Russo and his wife, Alanna, both 30, on Avenue U near E. 58th St. in Mill Basin.

    Hate crime charges dropped against black teens accused of beating white Brooklyn couple - NY Daily News
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    Re: Chicago Man Facing Hate Crime/Murder Charge

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Sorry, your example fails....10 days after the article you post here, a follow up...
    SO what?

    He didn't ask for an example of someone who was convicted of a hate crime.

    He spoke about prosecutors charging a perp for a hate crime against a middle aged, white, hetero, male victim.

    This perp was charged by the prosecutor for committing a hate crime
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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